The recession, benefits, the safety net, and the learning curve

Max_Headroom_3

fc123 wrote: »

To sidetrack a bit, what do you honestly feel about your chances of getting a new job soon? Not digging, just thinking aloud really, like how long will you need to rely on JSA?

Just to add, I made myself scarily redundant from something recently but had made a new job in the meantime....it's been a stressy year, still is.

I genuinely don't know. I've got an excellent track record, been with the same company years so demonstrably loyal, (I think) very presentable, literate, able to present myself well. However my field was quite specialist and whilst I believe I've got very transferable skills, I guess there are enough with direct skills for employers not to want to start looking at people in parallel positions looking to move across.

I finished work at the end of last month, been actively looking for a couple of months, and only signed on this week because it's clear I've got nothing coming up.

Just before I finished I went out and spent £500 on a really nice suit for interviews, first impressions and all that, because I thought I'll need it. I've not worn it once yet!

I'm absolutely staggered at the complete lack of even a sniff of a job. When I chase up applications by phone I'm always told that they're inundated with responses.

Quite scary really...

fc123

Max_Headroom wrote: »

I genuinely don't know. I've got an excellent track record, been with the same company years so demonstrably loyal, (I think) very presentable, literate, able to present myself well. However my field was quite specialist and whilst I believe I've got very transferable skills, I guess there are enough with direct skills for employers not to want to start looking at people in parallel positions looking to move across.

I finished work at the end of last month, been actively looking for a couple of months, and only signed on this week because it's clear I've got nothing coming up.

Just before I finished I went out and spent £500 on a really nice suit for interviews, first impressions and all that, because I thought I'll need it. I've not worn it once yet!

I'm absolutely staggered at the complete lack of even a sniff of a job. When I chase up applications by phone I'm always told that they're inundated with responses.

Quite scary really...

$hi t, that sounds scary. I recall you mentioned very high end retail once.

Would you consider re-training for anything? Like something you always wanted to do but never got the time or could afford to?
I am sure, if one is unemployed, courses are free...but I may be wrong.

Well.....OH and myself closed down a significant part our business, (direct retail; part of it for 23 years) in March.
Knew we had to cut it loose as the losses would have taken everything.
down in the end, say 24 months on.

Got a tricky lease issue still to resolve but, was the best thing we could have done. Hard mind, the doing of it.

I think a lot more poeple who post here are worried but don't let on. The downturn is seeping through to many now.

lostinrates

fc123 wrote: »

I think a lot more poeple who post here are worried but don't let on. The downturn is seeping through to many now.

I'm worried. Not that it helps Max that I'm worried.

fc123

lostinrates wrote: »

I'm worried. Not that it helps Max that I'm worried.

I hate to bring up gender, I really do, but I notice female posters tend to open up more. I am thinking Thriftybabes threads on her business.

We need the metrosexuals back on the board. I think a campaign is needed.

Sometimes, if one writes out the issues, it sounds like ones failed or is rubbish.....as no-one really knows the person or their life directly....and there is always the chance that some poster will type out 'loser' or whatever, or remind one that they are OK Jack etc. That's how I feel anyway.

chupov

Max_Headroom wrote: »

I genuinely don't know. I've got an excellent track record, been with the same company years so demonstrably loyal, (I think) very presentable, literate, able to present myself well. However my field was quite specialist and whilst I believe I've got very transferable skills, I guess there are enough with direct skills for employers not to want to start looking at people in parallel positions looking to move across.

I finished work at the end of last month, been actively looking for a couple of months, and only signed on this week because it's clear I've got nothing coming up.

Just before I finished I went out and spent £500 on a really nice suit for interviews, first impressions and all that, because I thought I'll need it. I've not worn it once yet!

I'm absolutely staggered at the complete lack of even a sniff of a job. When I chase up applications by phone I'm always told that they're inundated with responses.

Quite scary really...

dont worry mate - from the sounds of things you have your head on your shoulders.

Owning your own house mortgage free is a massive advantage. take my advice and go to the doctor with a dicky back or 'depression' and get yourself on the sicky asap. You paid loadsa tax and you might as well get a cut of it as some scrounging chav whose never had a job and lived their whole life on benefits!

mardatha

How the hell they expect anybody to exist on £64 a week is beyond me. Especially when you see how much we pay them for their allowances.And single pensioners get more, why is there a difference ?

Francesanne

Max_Headroom wrote: »

The one thing this recession is going to do is wake people like myself up to what the benefit system is actually about.

I've worked full time in continuous employment since I left school 25 (is it really that long!?) year ago. And I've been fortunate enough never to need to claim anything, I've just jogged along earning my money, paying my taxes, living my life.

And naively (as it turns out) I've paid those taxes in part in the belief that I'm contributing to the countries benefit system which is helping out those that need help, safe in the knowledge that there but for the grace of God go I. And that should I ever be in the unfortunate position of being unable to support myself, that very same benefit system will be my safety net should I need it.

Sure, I've had the odd rant in the past like everyone else about the benefit scroungers of society. It seems every other month the Daily Mail unearths another family of eight pulling in £30K a year worth of benefits and living in a five bedroom detached house all at the expense of Joe Taxpayer. and on a more personal level, I know of several people seemingly able to live life quite happily without a thought toward getting a job, nice little terraced house, secondhand car, treats for the kids and a modest holiday once a year. And that irks, but as is often said, that's the price we pay in this country for a safety net that keeps everyone afloat. The system is bound to be open to some abuse, that's just how it is.

Ok so, recession hits, the business I'm working in almost completely flat-lines, and after a year of sitting in my office staring out of the window and wondering how long they're going to continue to pay me for doing nothing I get my answer. They're not. I'm out. Fair enough, I can cope with that, honestly can't blame them. The business isn't there and only a major re-structure is going to save the company. Unfortunately I'm (along with many others) re-structured out the door.

I hit the ground running, my CVs are in the post like confetti, I'm all over the job sites, I'm on the phone, I'm Mr. Proactive, I've got history, I've got experience, I'll get another job and we'll keep the plates spinning.

No.

Two months and one deafening silence later and I've not had a single offer of an interview. The enormity of all those hours of BBC news broadcasts and reams of newsprint hit home. This is serious. And this isn't happening to somebody else, this is happening to me, now.

So thank god for the benefit system this country proudly boasts. Thank god for the safety net that has it's problems, but doesn't allow anyone to slip through, a cradle of support for those in dire need. And I am in dire need.

So I find myself on the phone and I find myself in the job centre and I find myself answering question after question and I'm signed on.

And what do I get? £64-30/week. That's less than £3.5K a year. That's £279 a month. I can also claim help with my council tax. And that, I'm told, is it.

And for that I have to trot down to the job centre once a fortnight with my homework for marking. What jobs have I applied for? Who've I phoned? Where've I looked? After all, they don't want me putting my feet up and retiring on this bountiful income do they?

So what happened to this safety net? What, in fact, am I supposed to live on? Ok I'm fortunate, I've got a small amount of savings. But what if the roof falls off tomorrow and the builder tells me it's going to cost all of that to fix it? What, actually, will I live on then? I live very modestly but the JSA barely covers the bills. I can't actually therefore afford to eat. Pretty basic stuff I'd have thought.

So, like many others, I find myself questioning.

Why is this "safety net" failing a hard working tax paying single man? What were all those tens of thousands of pounds I've put into the system for?

And how is the single girl I know who's been living on benefits as long as I've known her (several years) able to afford to run a car and has just bought a pair of £130 Nike trainers for her sons birthday? I can't afford to eat on my benefits!

There is something very messed up with this system. And I think that as this recession bites deeper and deeper and people like myself suddenly become face to face with a reality they thought would never affect them, there's going to be a sharp learning curve as to what the benefit system actually is and a lot of people like myself are going to have the benefit system brought into sharp focus.

And what they (we) will see is that it's not a safety net at all. It won't save you when you need it, it won't provide temporary support at all, it just doesn't work that way. But yet it does at the same time allow many many people to live quite happily for years carving out a reasonable standard of living from it.

Something here is very very wrong.

And it desperately needs to change.

A friend of mine found herself in a very similiar position to yours recently. She's 54 (doesn't look it),divorced,no kids and a mortgage and without a job after 20 years with the same company. From the moment she was made redundant she's applied for jobs, updated her CV, tried everything within her power to find another job. She was horrified to discover that she would only get Jobseekers Allowance for 6 months and after that she would be on her own. Seems only the last 2 years employment are taken into account despite the fact she's been working for 37 years non stop. Thankfully, all her efforts have paid off and she started a new p/t job last week. We thought she might be entitled to working tax credit but seems you have to work 30 hours per week to qualify and she's only got 20 hours per week but she's over the moon to have got a job and she certainly deserves it after all the effort she's put into finding one. Good luck to everyone out there job hunting.

chupov

fc123 wrote: »

I hate to bring up gender, I really do, but I notice female posters tend to open up more. I am thinking Thriftybabes threads on her business.

We need the metrosexuals back on the board. I think a campaign is needed.

Sometimes, if one writes out the issues, it sounds like ones failed or is rubbish.....as no-one really knows the person or their life directly....and there is always the chance that some poster will type out 'loser' or whatever, or remind one that they are OK Jack etc. That's how I feel anyway.

ive noticed some certainly seem to like to big-up themselves. Makes em feel better about themselves I think. Maxie on the other hand has no worries admitting his bad fortune (a lot of people experiencing that these days) - a sign of rather more self worth than some. :T

lostinrates

fc123 wrote: »

I hate to bring up gender, I really do, but I notice female posters tend to open up more. I am thinking Thriftybabes threads on her business.

We need the metrosexuals back on the board. I think a campaign is needed.

Sometimes, if one writes out the issues, it sounds like ones failed or is rubbish.....as no-one really knows the person or their life directly....and there is always the chance that some poster will type out 'loser' or whatever, or remind one that they are OK Jack etc. That's how I feel anyway.

Thats ok, I'm female, you're female...you can mention it I miss the metrosexuals too.
Maybe we should advertise the forum in estate agents/mortage bits of banks? Get some new blood?

I am a bit failed , in tht I'm not where I thought I would be but I'm not rubbish. I'm not sure I fully get my life or how I ended up where I am. The people who are ''loser'' typers, well...what kind of loser tells someone else that they are losers (too) ona forum?:D I wonder, it must take some kind of anger/frustration to get frequently riled by people on the internet.


Any way: I do sort of get the argument that we who have something should rely on tht first, but it seems so flawed when the live of what we haves are going with out while some people seem ''un suffering'' on what they never had IYSWIM. Yet I wouldn't want to see people forced to beg or children malnourished and greater social poverty. I can't see clearly how to re draw the lines and rewrite the rules to be better, myself. Yet.

PasturesNew

fc123 wrote: »

I am sure, if one is unemployed, courses are free...but I may be wrong.

That is what they want you to believe, but it's not like that.

There seem to be a limited variety of courses:
- basic reading/writing/using a PC.
- why don't you go to University and get a degree.
- for those 16-24 there is a rumour of apprenticeships.

To actually do a course in something needs:
- you to know what you want to do
- there to be a reasonable chance that at the end of it any job would exist, exist in your area, that you would stand a chance of getting one at your age/stage in life, that the wages were worth the retraining
- the course has to exist
- the course has to exist in your area
- the course has to be actually about to start now

When you weigh up all that lot, against a backdrop of "I am an earner and I need to earn a living soonest, so I need to find a job - and I don't want to commit to something that I might not be able to do because ... well, I'm sure a job might come up in the next 1-2 months" it's not really doable.

Also, if you are on a course, as a "normal person/worker" then they stop your dole.

Courses are only of use to people whose financial support is assured. Those who won't lose out financially, or who are geographically well placed, those who have no learning/experience are are starting out. It's a whole different ballgame if you're self-supporting, alone ... and not sure what to do or if it would be worthwhile to take that time out... and, of course, if the course is actually available.