Volker-This is not an Ordinary Recession

Rochdale_Pioneers

Wookster wrote: »

The point you still fail to see is that Brown has single handedly placed Britain in the worst affected basket, along with Iceland and Ireland

The EU and the credit rating agencies disagree with you. Still, I am sure that you are right and they are all wrong.

Wookster

Rochdale_Pioneers wrote: »

The EU and the credit rating agencies disagree with you. Still, I am sure that you are right and they are all wrong.

The IMF says otherwise.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/imf-predicts-uk-will-be-hardest-hit-1518588.html

Still, there you go, clinging onto Crash's coat tails, unable to see the disaster he has brought to this country.

Edit: Seeing as you have so much time for the credit rating agencies, how is it possible that they gave all these "financial weapons of mass destruction" that caused this mess AAA ratings? Never get things wrong, do they?

ninky_2

the problem is that it is global. but the powers and solutions people have are generally only national. legislation and structures have been put in place to manage things at a national level but this isn't enough.

on a micro-level, those with foreign citizenship taking out huge debts in this country and ferretting the money away overseas away from the eyes of regulators, then claiming bankruptcy, benefit etc, etc (I am not xenophobic just happen to personally know of a lot of cases where this type of thing happens). on a macro level multinational companies doing similar shenanigans. it can only work if we get rid of national borders and start acting as a single humanity on a single planet...can't see this happening in my lifetime though (cue John Lennon song...)

Reaper

When talking about Brown you need to split his actions into 2

Before the crisis: In my view he made things worse, though a global recession can't be caused by 1 man any more than it can be fixed by 1 man.
Since the crisis began: Frankly I'm glad he is in charge. He has done things I disgree with (3 things spring to mind straight off) but if the Conservatives had been in power it would have been a disaster. Cameron announces stuff that is popular but daft such as cutting taxes on savings - utter madness! At least Brown has a reasonable understanding of economics and the Americans (and to some extent Europenas) have altered their policies to match the UK in recognition of it.

cogito

Reaper wrote: »

When talking about Brown you need to split his actions into 2

Before the crisis: In my view he made things worse, though a global recession can't be caused by 1 man any more than it can be fixed by 1 man.
Since the crisis began: Frankly I'm glad he is in charge. He has done things I disgree with (3 things spring to mind straight off) but if the Conservatives had been in power it would have been a disaster. Cameron announces stuff that is popular but daft such as cutting taxes on savings - utter madness! At least Brown has a reasonable understanding of economics and the Americans (and to some extent Europenas) have altered their policies to match the UK in recognition of it.

Oh please. Brown is utterly clueless. If he had the vaguest idea what he was doing, we wouldn't be where we are now. Despite his constant mantra about do nothing Tories, he gives the distinct impression of a drowning man grimly hanging on to any passing straw. He's doing nothing more than reacting to events, putting the country at huge risk and amazingly, some people are still falling for it.

nickmason

cogito wrote: »

Oh please. Brown is utterly clueless. If he had the vaguest idea what he was doing, we wouldn't be where we are now. Despite his constant mantra about do nothing Tories, he gives the distinct impression of a drowning man grimly hanging on to any passing straw. He's doing nothing more than reacting to events, putting the country at huge risk and amazingly, some people are still falling for it.

One of the wierdest moments of my life - well not really, but it was quite wierd, was when I glanced upon PR weekly (or it might even have been marketing weekly) and there was a whole article about Labour looking to change their mantra from the above because it looked as if it wasn't resonating with the electorate, and that they were out to tender or something for the next line of attack.

It made me realise quite how ridiculous the vote-hunting has got; and how blatant and brazen - I sort of thought these conversations happened over dark tables in smoke-filled rooms, rather than with a bunch of bright-eyed bushy-tailed marketing and PR people pitching the new idea for how to keep him in power. The more I thought about it, the more depressed I got with the whole charade.

stevsand

Wookster wrote: »

The point you still fail to see is that Brown has single handedly placed Britain in the worst affected basket, along with Iceland and Ireland due to its "soft touch" regulation which allowed the house price bubble to blow out of control, the tripartite system of regulation that he was responsible for devising. Furthermore he presided over a significant increase of the national debt during the boom times, thus constraining the room for rescue now.

Now we are reading the a government owned bank is to "lead" the market with its provision of 90% mortgages.

The man is reckless and cannot be trusted. He might have the best intentions in the world but he will bankrupt Britain.




Again, this is a gross oversimplification of where I stand.

And a Tory government would have regulated the market?Every time i have heard a Tory spokesman in the last ten years they have been calling for less regulation :rolleyes:

Wookster

stevsand wrote: »

And a Tory government would have regulated the market?Every time i have heard a Tory spokesman in the last ten years they have been calling for less regulation :rolleyes:

I think might be mistaking red tape for regulation.

Anyways, no one can know what they would have done because they weren't in power.

nickmason

stevsand wrote: »

And a Tory government would have regulated the market?Every time i have heard a Tory spokesman in the last ten years they have been calling for less regulation :rolleyes:

Better, and so less, regulation. It's simple. In theory.

bubblesmoney

purch wrote: »

Quite an interesting speech by Paul Volker, one of the better Central Bankers of the recent past, and a man that luckily is now an adviser to President Obama.

You should be able to find the full text on Fullermoney.com

I really feel a sense of profound disappointment coming up here. We are having a great financial problem around the world. And finance doesn’t work without some sense of trust and confidence and people meaning what they say. You take their oral word and their written word as a sign that their intentions will be carried out.

This is not an ordinary recession. I have never, in my lifetime, seen a financial problem of this sort. It has the makings of something much more serious than an ordinary recession where you go down for a while and then you bounce up and it’s partly a monetary – but a self-correcting – pheno menon. The ordinary recession does not bring into question the stability and the solidity of the whole financial system.

Why is it that this is so much more profound a crisis? I’m not saying it’s going to get anywhere as serious as the Great Depression, but that was not an ordinary business cycle either.

it would have been good if volker had more of a say in things in the usa. but looks like he is being sidelined from meetings etc by summers (who doesnt get along with him apparently) and geithner