Council Tax reduction on second home

arunadasi

I've just discovered that there is a council tax reduction on a second home and am wondering if I can claim for the past, or at all.

This is what it says on my council's website:

Council Tax Discounts

Council Tax is charged if there are two or more adults (over the age of 18 years) living in a property.

There are a number of discounts you may be entitled to which would reduce your bill. They include:

• single occupier discount - if only one adult has their main home in a property, the bill will be reduced by a quarter (25%),
• second homes/holiday homes - properties that are unoccupied and furnished - (10%), and
• vacant furnished lets - properties falling vacant between lets - (10%).

BUT: there are axceptions.

Second Home - a 50% discount will apply in respect of a second home where it is provided to the council tax payer by reason of your employment and you are also liable for council tax for another dwelling which is your sole or main residence.

and:

Job Related Properties - a 50% discount still apply if you have a second home and you are responsible for council tax for a main residence elsewhere. This means that publicans, for example, who have a second home but are required to live at the licensed premises of which they are the tenant, are able to apply for a 50% Discount.

I am wondering about that clause "by reason of your employment".
This is the situation:

I am a German citizen (naturalised german through marriage) and our main home, a five bedroom house, was in Germany. I sent my children to schools in England and I came here to be with them during term time, but also because of my work. My husband stayed in Germany where he was employed. As I am self-employed and work from home it did not matter where I was. During the holidays, half terms, and for long weekends we went back to Germany, up intil January 2008 when the house in Germany was sold and my husband moved here.

There is no council tax per se in Germany; instead, this is paid through income tax which I have always paid in Germany; my husband and I are assessed there as a couple.

I have always paid the full council tax in England. I am wondering if it actually qualifies as a "second home". That "by reason of your employment" is a bit confusing. I can make a good case for my self-employment needing to be based in England... I'm wondering if I cold qualify for the 50% reduction...

Most importantly, though.... can I claim back for the past years?
All help much appreciated!

arunadasi

Ooops!
If I claim reduction due to my work I might have to pay business rates, is that right?

tyllwyd

I'm not qualified to answer your question ... but my reading of the bit where you say you are also liable for council tax on your main residence would imply to me that you have to be actually paying council tax on that property. You weren't paying UK council tax on two properties, so I don't see how you could make a claim for a reduction on a second property.

arunadasi

Looking through my German documents (my husband used to take care of all this stuff so I wasn't aware) I found all kinds of documents showing various tax payments towards the property. So even if it wasn't council tax in the strictly UK sense, we are paying full amounts on two homes. My UK home was definitely a second home until January 2008 - it's a 2-bed town flat, the other is a 5 bed country house with garden. Anyway, no harm in trying; I can't lose, and might win. I'll only go for the 10% reduction, though!

jennifernil

did you not claim the 25% reduction for single occupancy?

not sure if you can get any claims backdated, but with regard to the second home discount, I agree with tyllwyd, I don't see how you can claim it if you only had one home in the UK.

arunadasi

jennifernil wrote: »

did you not claim the 25% reduction for single occupancy?

not sure if you can get any claims backdated, but with regard to the second home discount, I agree with tyllwyd, I don't see how you can claim it if you only had one home in the UK.

But why not? If it was not my main home? After all, Germany is the EU and many regulations are valid for both, for instance health care, and taxation; since I pay tax in Germany I don't have to pay it here as well. Anyway, I've put in the application, I'll let you know what comes of it.

lincroft1710

Council Tax law only applies to UK dwellings, you have to be paying CT on one dwelling before you get discount on 2nd UK dwelling. EU law does not (fortunately) apply to every aspect of UK law. England, Wales and Scotland each have a slightly different CT system to one another.

arunadasi

lincroft1710 wrote: »

Council Tax law only applies to UK dwellings, you have to be paying CT on one dwelling before you get discount on 2nd UK dwelling. EU law does not (fortunately) apply to every aspect of UK law. England, Wales and Scotland each have a slightly different CT system to one another.

Oh well, I can still try. I don't think it's fortunate; it would be only fair. It makes me want to apply for double child benefit, double disability benefit, and so on but I'm too honest!

lincroft1710

Do you get 10% discount for tax on 2nd home in Germany? Is income tax the same rate in Germany as in England or even France? What about VAT or vehicle excise duty or TV licence. Vive la difference!

How can you claim double child and disability benefits when you are now only living in one country?

arunadasi

lincroft1710 wrote: »

Do you get 10% discount for tax on 2nd home in Germany? Is income tax the same rate in Germany as in England or even France? What about VAT or vehicle excise duty or TV licence. Vive la difference!

How can you claim double child and disability benefits when you are now only living in one country?

Income tax is higher in Germany than in the UK. And because I pay it in Germany I don't have to pay it here, that's why I feel it would only be fair to get a second home reduction here. It's only 10%!

As for benefits: my husband could have claimed benefits for the two kids in Germany and I for them in England. Of course, I didn't.
Same thing wiht disability benefits. Several people from SS kept insisting we could claim disability for my hubby and I had to tell them no, I get it from Germany. Both child and disability benefits are higher in UK than in Germany so I could possibly have dropped them in Germany instead but I had reasons not to.

That can be problematic, for instance, to get a Blue Badge they want you to have the higher mobility rate of disability paid in the UK, and as it's a different system I didn't have that. I got them to recognise the German benefit, though. Sometimes you just have to box things through.

In some cases, it would be in the UK's interest to relax some of the rules. For instance, my husband could get all his medication paid for by his German insurance. But for that he needs the original prescription back from the pharmacy. But they refuse to give you the original back here, even if it's a private prescription, so I can't claim, so I use the NHS.

As for VAT etc: that's a different matter than a second home, surely. Hubby paid German VAT in Germany, I paid UK VAT here.

Anyway, I've been searching the council tax site to see where it says that the main home has to be in the UK but couldn't find it anywhere. Can you tell me where it says that?

tyllwyd

arunadasi wrote: »

Anyway, I've been searching the council tax site to see where it says that the main home has to be in the UK but couldn't find it anywhere. Can you tell me where it says that?

It probably doesn't say that specifically because though you might pay all kinds of taxes elsewhere in the world, council tax is a UK tax on properties in this country. So they wouldn't need to spell it out - if the home wasn't in the UK you wouldn't have paid council tax on it.