Economist: Britain's fallen start

Rochdale_Pioneers

harryhound wrote: »

There has been extensive discussion in this forum pointing out that the government debt has been extensively fiddled by "off balance sheet" dodges such as the PFI.

It does not really matter if the debt is government, corporate or personal, it encourages the government to devalue and it exacerbates the collapse in confidence and the cuts in GDP.

And I have repeatedly pointed out that I quote Eurostat numbers not UK government numbers because they INCLUDE off-books liabilities like PFI. What that means is that when I compare numbers from the UK and places like Japan I compare like for like. It means that when I say PFI I say the actual cost faced by the taxpayer, not some theoretical figure if every PFI contract collapsed simultaneously and we had to foot the bill - which is I suspect the kind of thing you mean when you say PFI.

Ultimately it comes down to choices. Are you interested in a fair assessment of the UK economy or not? Some of you quite patently are not - the question arises as to why you would lie and distort to talk down your own country? Do you hate Labour that much? Do you secretly (or openly!) cheer every job loss and every piece of bad news as another nail in his coffin?

setmefree2

A great article - thanks op - a very well balanced analysis of the UK's position imho. Something for everyone here : plenty of things to be positive about for the optimists and plenty to dwell on for the doom mongers.

Should keep us all happy.

lostinrates

nomoneytoday wrote: »

I am not advocating that you spend all of your savings on a plasma telly, but that spending power is being eroded. The absurd situation is that with interest rates at 1% and inflation at 3% you are losing money by saving it. There are few risk free saving plans out there paying in excess of 3% for those who haven't fixed already.

Yes, this is the conflicting problem.

TbH I'm not sure what I should be doing. I really don't need a tv, but a house. I don't really want to buy a house for the short term, I'm thinking about buying a car.

Noone giving 'proper' or paid for advice seems to have strong conviction behind their words (I did retain an IFA but cancelled the contract recently for this reason) and I'm just not sure what to do. ETA: I am recognising that I am teetering on the border of returning to a state of crippled by indecision rather than simply deciding not to do something/anything!

Wookster

Rochdale_Pioneers wrote: »

Ultimately it comes down to choices. Are you interested in a fair assessment of the UK economy or not? Some of you quite patently are not - the question arises as to why you would lie and distort to talk down your own country? Do you hate Labour that much? Do you secretly (or openly!) cheer every job loss and every piece of bad news as another nail in his coffin?

How disingenuous to suggest that talking about the risks facing us means you aren't interested in a fair assessment of the UK economy!

You are the one who isn't interested in a fair assessment, only parroting your Labour mantra.

harryhound

Rochdale_Pioneers wrote: »

Ultimately it comes down to choices. Are you interested in a fair assessment of the UK economy or not? Some of you quite patently are not - the question arises as to why you would lie and distort to talk down your own country? Do you hate Labour that much? Do you secretly (or openly!) cheer every job loss and every piece of bad news as another nail in his coffin?

Time to revise the figures again:
http://www.citywire.co.uk/personal/-/news/money-property-and-tax/content.aspx?ID=330013

Tax freedom day is getting to the point where soon we will be working for the state more than we work for ourselves.

The logic of your position is that eventually only the government will be fit to spend money. It has been tried before, it is called Easter Europe and welfare dependency not to mention the damned fool things politicians and civil servants do when spending other peoples' money.

I would like to live in a society where children were educated into personal responsibility and self reliance.
You probably think that all this "corporatism" is good for society - I don't.