Ombudsman useless again

crazyhaggid

I would appreciate any help with this matter, a quick bit of background; I used to hold a credit card with HFC which I could no longer afford to pay so arranged a payment plan with them through CAB. Despite not missing any payments, without warning they sold the debt to Cabot.

Cabot have from day one piled interest on my account. I wrote to them for a copy of the original credit agreement using one of the template letters from this site. After about two months they finally provided me with a poor photocopy.

With further information from this forum I told them they had no right to charge me interest as the rate was not readable on the credit agreement.

After a lot of nasty letters from them, I took the problem to the Ombudsman, the complaint being either they provide me with a true copy of my credit agreement or stop harassing me for my debt.

The Ombudsman replied with the following points:

Cabot cannot supply a legible copy of the CA if one doesn’t exist.

Cabot is under no obligation to freeze interest or charges whilst the account is being disputed.

So basically the ombudsman has ruled that they debt is mine and Cabot can charge me what they want even though you can’t read the CA.

I would really appreciate it if someone could quote me some points in law as it appears the Ombudsman really can’t be bothered with this one and I'd love to be able to quote the relevant acts to them. The main points in law I would like to have clarified are:

• Freezing of interest and charges whilst an account is in dispute, particularly as Debtline told me that they should freeze interest and charges.
• What interest can they charge me if any when you cannot read the CA.
• Cabot told me that the debt collection guidelines are just that and so they aren’t enforceable in law.

Thanks.

Stu

anniecave

i presume the "standard" interest rate on a credit card can vary as providers can vary it depending on anything from interest rates generally to how they see your risk profile and also any other factors as they see fit.

Are you on a debt management plan for other debts? how much is this debt? how much have you been paying towards this? Is it possible for you to pay it off any quicker (so the interest they are charging then won't matter as much)?

crazyhaggid

thanks for the reply, I don't know if you could say I was on a debt management plan with my other debtors, I have arrangements with them originally set up by CAB, which I have never missed.

The debt started out at ~£1400 it is now ~£1600 as they have also been applying 'penalty' interest whilst I have been disputing it with them.

MarkyMarkD

I don't really see the relevance of the original agreement interest rate, because as anniecave says, the original agreement will have allowed the card operator (HFC) to vary the right after giving you notice in any case.

So Cabot can legitimately vary the interest rate too, as they've taken the debt over from HFC.

crazyhaggid

ok I'm going to try this after speaking to debt line it appears they have broken section 78 of the CCA:

78.—(1) The creditor under a regulated agreement for running-account credit, within
the prescribed period after receiving a request in writing to that effect from the debtor
and payment of a fee of 15 new pence, shall give the debtor a copy of the executed
agreement (if any) and of any other document referred to in it, together with a
statement signed by or on behalf of the creditor showing, according to the information
to which it is practicable for him to refer,—
(a) the state of the account, and
(b) the amount, if any, currently payable under the agreement by the debtor to the
creditor, and
(c) the amounts and due dates of any payments which, if the debtor does not draw
further on the account, will later become payable under the agreement by the
debtor to the creditor.

The copy of my original agreement is unreadable and therefore I cannot determine my interest or repayment terms therefore section 6 applies:

(6) If the creditor under an agreement fails to comply with subsection (1)—
(a) he is not entitled, while the default continues, to enforce the agreement;
and
(b) if the default continues for one month he commits an offence.

Any thoughts?

stapeley

If they took you to court and the Judge could not read the CCA , he would be justified in throwing the case out ! I would write to them and say as what they have sent is unreadable they have not complied with your request and to go and JUMP .

crazyhaggid

stapeley wrote: »

If they took you to court and the Judge could not read the CCA , he would be justified in throwing the case out ! I would write to them and say as what they have sent is unreadable they have not complied with your request and to go and JUMP .

after the ombudsman being useless I'm very tempted to do this, although debtline said the judge could still enforce the debt if they thought it should be. (got to love our laws!)

bathgatebuyer

The guidelines referred to come from the Office of Fair Trading's Debt Collection Guidance Note from 2003. I have also hear people mention that the Administration of Justice Act has something to do with accounts in dispute - I've looked but could never find any evidence as to that.

I got a letter from the OFT in relation to the CCA matters:

http://s197.photobucket.com/albums/aa77/bathgatebuyer/?action=view&current=OFTLetter1.jpg
http://i197.photobucket.com/albums/aa77/bathgatebuyer/OFTLetter2.jpg
http://i197.photobucket.com/albums/aa77/bathgatebuyer/OFTLetter3.jpg

Don't know if that's of any interest, but I wrote to the OFT asking to them to clarify what happens with CCA disputes.

RAS

maybe but are cabot going to take that chance? Chances actually are they will not even turn up to court.

bathgatebuyer

Make a request for info under the Civil Procedure Rules rather than the CCA 1974. There's an item on the CAG forum about this very things at the moment. I'll see if I can find it for you - may give you a different angle to look at these things.

crazyhaggid

bathgatebuyer wrote: »

Make a request for info under the Civil Procedure Rules rather than the CCA 1974. There's an item on the CAG forum about this very things at the moment. I'll see if I can find it for you - may give you a different angle to look at these things.

Thanks for the replies everyone, I'm very interested in this civil procedure rule