Partial CCA recived from Halifax/1st credit - more confused!

cortana

Help!

I requested a CCA from 1st credit (who contacted me without Halifax/blair oliver and scott letting me know they had sold the debt on) I sent the CCA request on the 19th december, and today is the 31st January I recieved a letter from them stating that they have sent an edited credit agreement stamped on the back of 1 of these is a date stamp of the 19th of januaryas being recieved by them so if they have had this since then why have they waited until yesterday to send it to me. That if it is my signature I have to let them know by phone that this is my debt and my signature and only then will they send me my full copy of my agreement. If I despute the signature I should send them a copy of my signature in a driving licence or passport.

I will have to dispute this because neither of the signatures look like mine but not sure of how to do this or if there are any letters I should send back.

Also I have checked all 3 of my credit reports and the debt in default at this time is not on any of them? As you can see from the paperwork sent the date of which is the 12/7/04 in this case this cannot have been taken off my credit report due to the 6 years deadline.

Can anyone help me of what I should do next?

does a partial CCA constitute a CCA? and is it enforcable? even if the signatures only look a close proximity to mine? I will post the pages if someone can let me know how I can do this?

Also given that I sent them the CCA request on the 19th of December, and I got this CCA, (if it is the CCA I required by law) on the 31st January, isnt that 43 days? Making it well over the 30 Day limit that makes a debt enforcable? I cant find the thread I read that on. if someone can clarify this point for me I will be very happy.

Thanks in advance for your help.

druss

Ignore the extended time response, a judge will.

A partial cca is not acceptable you need the full cca including any terms and conditions it refers to for it to be enforceable.

I would write back stating they have not supplied the full cca an formally request they do within 14 days

petermb_2

Do not send a copy of your signature as they can forge it on to an agreement.
The debt is unenforceable until you have received the correct documentation.

cortana

thankyou for your response, I would like to know why it isnt listed on my credit report? One would have thought that a debt that is 4 years old would be on there?

what sort of wording should I use in the letter to them?

anymore advice would be good.

aj2703

http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.html?t=963087

I think the letter you require is something like letter number 10.

fermi

Two issues here:

a) Have they complied with the copy document regulations in this reply?

b) Is the credit agreement they possess enforceable under the CCA?

It sounds very much as if they have not completely complied with (a), but without seeing it it can be hard to tell. A few items may be omited or presented in a "condensed form" while still complying with a CCA section 77/78 request.

As for (b), the original copy of the agreement would have to be signed by you and comply with the conditions below.

IS MY AGREEMENT ENFORCEABLE (Via section 127(3) CCA1974).

PRESCRIBED TERMS FOR THE PURPOSES OF SECTIONS 61(1)(0) AND 127(3) OF THE CONSUMER CREDIT ACT 1974 Taken from schedule.6 (1983/1553) regulations

(If you just want to find out, skip the bits in between the stars it’s just some extra information)

**What do we mean by unenforceable?

In the Consumer Credit Act section 127 there is a provision for making an agreement unenforceable if it does not contain certain pieces of information.

Subsections 1,2,3,4 state which pieces of information these are, and everything mentioned there must be included within the body of the agreement, if one is missing the agreement is unenforceable.

How does unenforceable differ from enforceable with a court order only?

When an agreement is unenforceable it means that the court or the judge cannot make a ruling on it. The court cannot make it enforceable.

When an agreement is enforceable only by ruling of the court it means that the agreement can be stopped by the debtor but the court has the power to re-instate it and allow the credit to continue to enforce.**

The Prescribed Terms are these:

A Amount of credit

A term stating the amount of credit

B Repayments

A term stating how the debtor is to discharge his obligations under the agreement to make the repayments, which may be expressed by reference to a combination of any of the following:-

(a) Number of repayments;
(b) Amount of repayments;
(c) Frequency and timing of repayments;
(d) Dates of repayments;
(e) The manner in which any of the above may be determined; or in any other way, and any power of the creditor to vary what is payable.

C Rate of interest

A term stating the rate of interest to be applied to the credit issued under the agreement

D Credit limit

This may be a term or the manner in which it will be determined or that there is no credit limit.

---

Which of these applies to you depends on the type of agreement you have?

For a Running Account (credit card) agreement

BC and D Apply

For a Restricted Use Debtor Creditor Supplier

• Where the dealer is the supplier and the creditor is the one providing the finance.
• The money can only be used for the purpose it is given.
• There is no interest on the purchase (the cash price is the same as the total price)
• And there is no advance payment

A is applicable

For a fixed Sum Credit Agreement

A conventional credit agreement with none of the above restrictions

A and B apply

For a Hire Agreement

B is Applicable

This paper only covers section 127(3) of the Act agreements can also be unenforceable by contravention of sections 1 and 4 this will be the subject of the next paper.

Please note that these Prescribed terms where not changed in any way by the 2004/1482 Amendments although the form in which they appear on the agreement was. Subsection127(3) was repealed on the 6th of April 2007 so that unenforceability due to 127(3) will only apply to agreements executed before that date.

cortana

I can post the pages they sent me but I dont know how to put them on the forum? Wasnt there also somthing I read about loans taken out as consolidation were unenforcable?

cortana

These are links to all the pages received:

Cover: http://i43.tinypic.com/35kqydt.jpg
P1: http://i40.tinypic.com/27ynzeo.jpg
P2: http://i39.tinypic.com/2vvn8nt.jpg
P3: http://i40.tinypic.com/jv5hqv.jpg

Each page has a different style signature (although I've censored them and other personal information, you'll understand), and while the first one looks vaguely like my own, the others just don't flow at all.

Any advice greatly appreciated.

cortana

Hi ,

Can anyone help with the abov post regarding the cca that was sent, could really do with some advoce as I am going out of my head and I dont know quite what to do.

Please help.

fermi

cortana wrote: »

Can anyone help with the abov post regarding the cca that was sent, could really do with some advoce as I am going out of my head and I dont know quite what to do.

Sorry. I missed the bit about them demanding the signature.

This is the letter you need, as previously said.

Dear Sir/Madam,

RE: Account NO XXXXXXXX

Thank you for your letter dated xx/xx/2008 the contents of which are noted.

In your letter you make reference to requiring my signed authorisation /specimen signature** before you comply. I draw your attention to the fact that the Consumer Credit Act 1974 does not require that i supply you a copy of my signature before you comply with my S77/78** request.

If it is for Data Protection purposes then i can happily supply you with documentation to substantiate my identity to you.

However please note that to date you have happily sent statements and correspondence containing extensive sensitive private information to my address. I have to ask if you are concerned that you are corresponding with the correct person why has it taken so long to raise this?

As you are aware, disclosing data without adequate checks of identity is contrary to the 7th principal of data protection, listed in schedule 1 of the Data protection Act 1998:

7. Appropriate technical and organisational measures shall be taken against unauthorised or unlawful processing of personal data and against accidental loss or destruction of, or damage to, personal data.

My request for a true copy of my credit agreement under section 77/78** was made on xx/xx/2008 and the 12 working days for your compliance expire on xx/xx/2008.

I note that there is no provision that removes the requirements of the act to provide this information on time, even if you are unsure of my identity.

I look forward to receiving the documentation requested

Yours faithfully

Print don't Sign

cortana

Thank you for all your helpful advice.

Have you taken a look at the links i put on that take you to my cca I recieved from them, would very much appreciate some advice on the cca they sent me.

If anyone can help I would fully appreciate it

thanks