Paypal need me to verify a fake aftershave - pls help!

ct24

OK, my hubby purchased a BNIB Burberry Touch aftershave (one of his usual) He paid £21.00 and upon receiving it he realised it was a fake, the bottle is different, the box is different etc. So we started a dispute with paypal to get a refund. We had the following from them and we are now stuck here are the emails

1st from paypal (with transaction details blanked)
Dear ----,
>
> Seller's name: ----
> Seller's email: [URL="wlmailhtml:%7bF86EB3AC-07F2-4F87-A5AE-A06564011703%7dmid://00000022/!x-usc:mailto:qadeerali####@yahoo.com"]----[/URL]
> Seller's transaction ID: ---->
> Transaction date: # Jan ####
> Transaction amount: -##.## GBP
> Your transaction ID:

---

> Case number:

---

>
> Its our aim to work with you to resolve your complaint as
> quickly and
> easily as possible. To do so its important that we have all
> the necessary
> information. So thats why we ask you to please fax us
> documentation to
> support your claim that the item you have received wasnt
> authentic.
>
> We suggest that you obtain written proof from an unbiased
> third-party, such
> as a dealer, appraiser, or organisation qualified in the area of
> the item
> in question (other than yourself), which clearly identifies the
> item as not
> authentic. It should be clear from the document how the item
> you received
> differs from an authentic one and give a detailed explanation of
> how the
> person evaluating the item determined that its not authentic.
> Its
> important that the document is on a letterhead which includes
> the name,
> address, and phone number of the business or organisation so we
> can contact
> them if necessary. Where possible also include a serial number.
>
> Supporting documentation should be uploaded via the Resolution
> Centre onto
> your claim.
>
> You can visit PayPal's Resolution Center to submit your
> documentation and
> follow these steps:
> #. Click "Resolve Complaint."
> #. Select the radio button to provide the documentation and
> click
> "Continue."
> #. Select a method to submit your documentation.
>
> Alternatively you can fax supporting documentation to PayPal at
> ##### ###
> ###. Please include a cover sheet with your fax that includes
> the primary
> email address registered on your PayPal account and the ID
> number of the
> claim ----. This will allow us to attach the document
> to the
> claim as quickly as possible.
>
> We kindly ask you to please send us your documents by ##th
> January #### so
> we can proceed with the investigation of your claim. Please note
> that if we
> dont receive your documents by ##th January ####, we will be
> unable to
> complete the investigation and therefore your claim will be
> cancelled. No
> extensions will be granted.
>
> Unfortunately we are unable to reimburse you for any costs or
> fees you may
> incur in obtaining the requested documents. If necessary, any
> documents you
> provide may also be supplied to the seller in your dispute.
>
> If you have any questions, please email us at
> [URL="wlmailhtml:%7bF86EB3AC-07F2-4F87-A5AE-A06564011703%7dmid://00000022/!x-usc:mailto:disputeassistance@paypal.co.uk"]disputeassistance@paypal.co.uk[/URL]. Dont hesitate to contact us if
> you need
> any help.
>
> Thank you for your cooperation and patience. We regret any
> inconvenience
> this request may cause.
>
> Sincerely,
> Donna
> PayPal
>
> Please do not reply to this email. This mailbox is not
> monitored and you
> will not receive a response. For assistance, log in to your
> PayPal account
> and click the Help link in the top right corner of any PayPal
> page.

We replied,

Good Afternoon,
>
> I am receipt of your email i have been to my
> local boots and
> thay have advised me that they dont verify aftershave, as the
> matter does
> not concern them. I am happy to provide photos of what i
> received and also
> google image links which show the clear difference between the
> one received
> and a genuine. Would this be sufficiant?
>
> I also think that the seller should have to provide proof of
> purchase, and
> i dont really understand why as a innocent buyer why i have to
> do all the
> leg work to prove an item is real/fake. If you look at the
> listing it only
> shows the box, even this differers from a genuine as it doesnt
> have the
> string/button tie (please google to see what i mean as it is
> hard to
> describe).
>
> I look forward to your reply
>
> Many thanks.

They replied

Subject: Re: Fw: Request for Additional Information on Case
no

>
>
> Dear ,
>
> Thank you for contacting us in relation to your Buyer Complaint
> .
>
> Unfortunately, we do not accept photographs as evidence in our
> investigation of cases.
>
> As an internet-based company we must rely on the documentation requested
> to
> determine that the item you received is not authentic.
>
> We kindly ask you to please send us your documents by 25th January 2009 so
> we can proceed with the investigation of your claim. Please note that if
> we
> don?t receive your documents by 25th January 2009, we will be unable to
> complete the investigation and therefore your claim will be cancelled. No
> extensions will be granted.
>
> Unfortunately we are unable to reimburse you for any costs or fees you may
> incur in obtaining the requested documents. If necessary, any documents
> you
> provide may also be supplied to the seller in your dispute.
>
> If you have any questions, please email us at
> [URL="wlmailhtml:%7bF86EB3AC-07F2-4F87-A5AE-A06564011703%7dmid://00000022/!x-usc:mailto:disputeassistance@paypal.co.uk"]disputeassistance@paypal.co.uk[/URL]. Don?t hesitate to contact us if you need
> any help.
>
> Thank you for your cooperation and patience. We regret any inconvenience
> this request may cause.
>
> Sincerely,
> Miriam
> PayPal

So here is our reply that we have just sent

Subject: Re: Fw: Request for Additional Information on Case

> I find this absolutely shocking that I am the innocent party in this
> transaction, yet expected to prove an item that is so obviously
> fraudulent. Yet you are taking the sellers side and actually protecting
> the seller and endorsing fraudulent goods being sold. The seller has got
> to do nothing but say it is not fake, and that seems good enough for
> yourselves I now have to (out of my own time and expense) go to an
> independent aftershave stockist and get them to verify (which I don't
> understand why they would do it, let alone put it on headed paper, when I
> have purchased nothing from them, and taken business away from them using
> ebay) to confirm that it is fake. It is not as if I have bought a watch.
> I have contacted Trading Standards, who advised me I am entitled to a
> refund through PayPal as it is covered by the Sales of Goods act, and I
> will shortly be contacting the press to highlight to other buyers how ebay
> and Paypal are prepared to endorse the sale of fraudulent goods and will
> not protect any buyer.
>
> I would also like to point out that in your original email, it is a ONLY a
> suggestion that I provide written evidence, when in reality it is an
> necessity in settling this matter.
>
> Please can you forward me your complaints procedure, what protection
> buyers have, and what ebay/paypal's policy on selling fraudlent/fake goods
> is, and also provide me details of your governing bodies/regulators. I
> would also like to be told what the seller has to do to prove that the
> item is real.
>
> I am disgusted with the way I am being treated, and I look forward to your
> prompt reply.



So what I am asking is help!! What can I do? I have contacted trading standards who have given me a ref number, but they are unable to do anything as it is a private seller. I find this policy madness, and I wont be using eBay again to buy anything like this, I have been using eBay since 2000 and never encountered anything like this.

Sorry it is a long one, but I seem to be banging my head against a brick wall, any help is really useful.

Thanks

Ct2

Mrembo

Try contacting the manufacturer .When i bought some colgate years ago i thought it was fake.Colgate send me free colgate and asked me to send the offending sample for testing free postage of course.

Maybe BNIB Burberry Touch aftershave manufactured have different labels or boxes for different countries or maybe they have changed the boxes.

What is the seller saying?

MJS996

Can't really help much, but it might just be worth contacting your credit card company - I have an ongoing problem with paypal and some goods that werent' delivered. I'd missed the 45 day paypal limit for filing a claim and paypal weren't interested, but my bank got onto them and have sorted it out...

Good luck

geordie_joe

ct24 wrote: »

I find this policy madness,

I know it doesn't help, but you are accusing someone of selling fake goods, it's up to to prove it as the person you are accusing will be presumed innocent until proven guilty.

Look at it from another point of view. How would you feel if you sold a genuine bottle of after shave and the buyer told Paypal it was fake. And paypal just took their word for it and refunded the money from your account.

I'm sure you are right, and it is fake, but you do have to prove it.

Do as others have already said and contact the maker, if anyone can provide proof it will be them.

ct24

yes i will try to contact burberry direct, i understand what you are saying about innocnent until guilty, but what i dont understand is why i can send in pictures, as the differences in box and bottle are so obvious, i am quite happy to post them here, but obviously it wont help my case with paypal!
any more sugestions?

greyteam1959

Send some pics etc of the product that you believe to be fake to Burberry and ask them to confirm your suspicions....then forward their reply on to Paypal ???

Debt_Free_Chick

Pictures/photos can be edited so they're not accepted to prove a fake/copy.

bengal-stripe

ct24 wrote: »

...but what i dont understand is why i can send in pictures, as the differences in box and bottle are so obvious,

I don’t know about Burberry aftershave, but sometimes products get designed and packaged differently for particular countries.

The fact that it does not look familiar, will not necessarily mean it is a fake.

Chutzpah

Any smaller perfume retailers who might be easier to get a statement out of? (e.g. the perfume shop)