Lapland New Forest - Guide to Claiming Money Back

GomerPyle

The situation for getting refund of money re Lapland New Forest Ltd

Firstly you should make a claim to Lapland New Forest Ltd at their registered address (this maybe achademic as the company are applying to go into liquidation, but it seems sensible to do this to make sure that there are no grounds for rejecting any claim you make.

LAPLAND NEW FOREST LIMITED
UNIT 1, WILD PARK HOUSE,
HOME FARM ROAD
BRIGHTON
EAST SUSSEX
UNITED KINGDOM
BN1 9HT

stating the reasons why you are making a claim for refund of the money you paid. See 'The reasons fall into two main categories' below.
It's a common misconception that sending things Recorded Delivery means that they get it and a court will accept this as evidence... it's not. If the person isn't in and refuses to collect the letter from the post office, then it is deemed as Not Served.

Send it First Class with a Certificate of Posting, which is free.

I took this advice about how to send the letter from the Facebook site, and it seems very sensible, especially as we know that many of the recorded letters customers have sent, have been returned 'not signed for'.

IF YOU PAID BY CHEQUE

Unfortunately anyone who paid by cheque is going to have to await the letter that they will be sent by Lapland New Forest Ltd’s liquidator, or look out for the notice that will be published in a couple of local Brighton newspapers. That will give details of how to lodge your claim and where and when a meeting of creditors will be held at which you will be advised of the statement of affairs detailing the financial position of the company.

IF YOU PAID BY DEBIT OR CREDIT CARD (BEARING THE VISA OR MASTERCARD LOGO)

Even if a company goes into liquidation it is possible to reclaim money, as the claim is made against the company's bank, not the company itself. You need to apply for a chargeback refund within 120 days.
(source: http://www.guardian.co.uk/money/2008/nov/02/airlines-sterling-money-back-visa)

I believe that is 120 days from the date on which those goods or services were contracted to be provided.

Credit card holders can make demands for refund under section 75 of the Consumer Credit Act (1974) but the drawback to that is that there is a rule that it only applies where the cost of each item (even if paid as one total amount) must be in excess of £100, therefore it could be rejected due to the individual tickets costing £25/£30 each.

It is therefore best if you get your refund (whether it is a debit or credit card) by asking your card provider to make a CHARGEBACK, as long as your card bears the logo of VIA or MASTERCARD.

If your card provider attempts to refuse to make a chargeback you can politely refer them to this statement by the Financial Ombudsman Service (the complaints body of the Financial Services Authority who regulate all UK financial institutions)

http://www.financial-ombudsman.org.uk/publications/ombudsman-news/3/plastic-cards.htm

We agreed that there was no contractual right. But chargeback was a matter of public knowledge and it was maladministration for the firm not to attempt one. We awarded Mr J compensation to cover the cost of the goods, plus his inconvenience in having to pursue the complaint to us.

You would have to go through the company’s complaints procedure and then formally complain to the FOS, but it costs you nothing to do that, only your time and effort, and the FOS actually charges the card company when you complain, so they would have to be stupid to push it that far, and I would be prepared to help and guide anyone through the process, knowing it won’t happen.

Undoubtedly the card company is likely to want to know the reason for you wanting a refund.

The reasons fall into two main categories

1. Those who went and were shocked to find that the event did not match the advertising

ITN video news report
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=oRnyDgDYlAs

Bournemouth Echo video news reports
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=Tb7V_OBPmWs&feature=related
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=wKu2I8zAfcw&feature=related

West Country TV video news report
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=RhgrD1xKfVA&feature=related

The website containing photos 'borrowed' from other websites
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=Q4z506eT_60&feature=related

A list of sites that those photos had come from

http://www.flickr.com/photos/nao-cha/410918802/

http://intelligenttravel.typepad.com/it/images/2008/01/08/reindeer_enjoy_their_work_3.jpg

http://www.santa.sc/content,reindeer-gallery/

http://byteshuffler.com/rospo/blog/uploaded_images/RabbitInSnow1-737695.jpg

http://www.comparestoreprices.co.uk/images/br/brittany-christmas-food-hamper.jpg

http://virtual.finland.fi/netcomm/news/showarticle.asp?intNWSAID=26070

http://www.progressive.com/driving-destinations/snug-hotels.aspx

http://www.thegreenhead.com/2007/11/classic-snowman-kit.php

The original website
http://issuu.com/search?q=lapland%20new%20forest&st=document

An in depth newspaper article of the whole sorry enterprise
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/scammed-by-santa-attraction-closes-six-days-after-it-opened-1055550.html

Copy of advertising leaflet
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3230/...c54df00c_o.jpg

Links to photos of the actual event
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/shared/spl/hi/pop_ups/08/uk_lapland_new_forest/html/1.stm
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/shared/spl/hi/pop_ups/08/uk_lapland_new_forest/html/3.stm
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/shared/spl/hi/pop_ups/08/uk_lapland_new_forest/html/4.stm
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/shared/spl/hi/pop_ups/08/uk_lapland_new_forest/html/9.stm
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/shared/spl/hi/pop_ups/08/uk_lapland_new_forest/html/12.stm

BBC report
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/dorset/7762855.stm
A security guard at a Lapland-style theme park criticised by visitors as "hell" and a "scam" said he resigned because he was "ashamed to work there".

2. Those who paid and were unable to go because the event had closed leaving them unable to attend.

The last day that it was possible to visit the event was Wednesday 3rd December 2008 as a sign was put up on the morning of the 4th December saying that the site had closed.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/dorset/7765080.stm

A big sign put up outside the park on Thursday morning said: "Lapland New Forest closed - for more information contact the website".

IF YOU PAID BY MAESTRO DEBIT CARD

All major banking groups in the UK use Visa debit cards except HSBC, including First Direct, and The Royal Bank of Scotland Group, including NatWest:- these use Maestro for their debit cards.
(source: http://www.guardian.co.uk/money/2008/nov/02/airlines-sterling-money-back-visa)

There is no doubt that a Maestro chargeback facility exists, but it appears that some providers of Maestro refuse to do them, though some will. It has been found that RBS and NatWest (part of the same group) will try to fob you off. This is the link to the User Manual telling a bank how to do it

http://www.mastercard.com/us/wce/PDF/TB-Entire_Manual.pdf

http://www.mastercard.com/us/merchant/pdf/Maestro_Global_Rules_5_08.pdf

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Maestro card providers aren't allowed to make up their own rules

http://www.mastercard.com/us/merchant/pdf/Maestro_Global_Rules_5_08.pdf

Part 1 3.3 Non compliance with Maestro rules

Participants that fail to comply with any particular provision of the Rules, and the regulations, policies, and technical specifications of the Organization are subject to such liquidated damages and other provisions, including but not limited to termination of participation, as provided in the Rules.

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Bearing in mind that not many banks are aware of MasterCard and Visa chargeback, I have to wonder how right they are that Maestro rules don't allow chargebacks in the UK. Trying to extract the information from the Maestro rules has confounded me. There are differing rules for the UK, but I can find nothing relating to special rules regarding UK chargebacks. UK Maestro spokesmen always add that there is no UK legal right to make a chargeback, but that is the case with all chargebacks.

Personally I would insist on making a chargeback and politely inform them that if the won’t do it you’ll take them to the FOS, though you’ll have to go through the card issuer’s complaints procedure first, as you normally have to.

Frankly the cost to any bank of handling a complaint that goes to the FOS should make them see sense, and if it did go to the FOS, it will only serve to publicise that their card is ‘second rate’ if they win. So any bank with a brain, would give in to you.

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In summary - Maestro card holders may have a tougher job with their card issuer, particularly RBS and NatWest, which is especially annoying as it was one of their branches that arranged the merchant facility at the root of this problem.

Some will make a chargeback for you, and even Visa cardholders have to press hard. If you have the will and attitude, then you can point out the FOS statement about chargebacks and state that you wish to raise a formal complaint which you will take to the Ombudsman if they refuse to do as you ask.

The intention is that they will see sense and make the chargeback. If you take it to the FOS I cannot be certain of their judgement with Maestro cards, but taking the complaint to the FOS won’t cost you anything, just time and effort.

whitewing

The above post has been very kindly collated (and a lot of the source info provided) by GomerPyle, from discussions we have been having on another thread:

http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.html?t=1229473
(Lapland New Forest Scam. How to get money back)

Please put any comments for discussion regarding the above guide, or any issues with the chargebacks on the 'Scam' thread. This will allow those users with a lot of background knowledge to view the information quickly.

We'll endeavour to keep this thread purely for the up-to-date Guide, and the success stories! (I'll try and pull a list of users who have already reported successes off the Scam thread later).

whitewing

still having trouble with formatting

JH808

Hi,
has anyone heard anything from tesco credit card? I have heard nothing back

whitewing

JH,

Come over to the main thread... I will chase it up there:

http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.html?t=1229473&page=61

jimmybrid

Having been faced with an issue that has come to light only in the last 24hrs whereby I (foolishly, with hindsight) paid for holiday accomodation using a Maestro card and the Travel Agent then went into administration leaving me with no accomodation and an empty bank account to boot, I hope I can clarify the Chargeback situation for Maestro card purchases.

If you paid by Maestro and, for whatever reason, have not received the goods or services you paid for then I'm afraid you are not covered under the Maestro Chargeback scheme - it has taken me quite some time going through the 767 page "Maestro Global Rules" document, but if anyone else wants to confirm my view, check out Chapter 19a (UK Maestro) and you will find a section where it says that a chargeback cannot be invoked when a cardholder has not received goods or services.

If this were the US, the rules are different and you can claim. But it's not. So you can't.