Consumer Credit (Cancellation Notices and Copies of Documents) Regulations 1983

storkeye

Hi All,

I wonder if you could help. Today we received a this letter in response to our request for a copy of our Signed Agreement under s78 of the CCA 1974. This agreement was created on 22 February 2007 by applying online, receiving an agreement in the post which was signed and returned.

Thank you all in advance.

methusala_2

er er er and your question???

Fire_Fox

I think Storkeye wants to know if this is a valid credit agreement if Argos are omitting the signature and address?

storkeye

Hi All,

That's right. The copy agreement they returned is titled:

'Credit Agreement Regulated by the Consumer Credit Act 1974'

There is no name, address or signature. In fact there is NOTHING that relates to us on this agreement at all.

In their letter they refer to the CCR 1983, yet there is no mention of that in the agreement they have sent.

So my question is: What should I do about this? How's best to respond to them?

Many Thanks,
Storkeye

LilacPixie

Sorry i'm pant with these things and tend to ask on consumer action group.

storkeye

Hi LilacPixie, do you mean a consumer action group here on moneysavingexpert or a forum elsewhere?

Thanks,
Storkeye

Fire_Fox

If it were me, I would write back repeating that you do not acknowledge any debt and that they have not satisfied you that there is a valid credit agreement in place between yourself and Argos. This debt remains in dispute until you are in receipt of a copy of an agreement with your personal details and signature fully visible.

They can quote any bit of law they like, the paperwork you have been supplied with would not be admissable if the case went to court. No judge would rule in favour of 'evidence' that may, for all you know, be blank or be signed by your neighbours dog. I think Argos are chancing their arm.

storkeye

Hi Fire Fox,

That's exactly what I thought, but I was hoping for someone to confirm. As you say the agreement they have sent is quite simply a piece of paper without any signature, even theirs!!!

As I had suspected an agreement should be signed by both parties to show that they 'agree' to the terms.

I will write to them today and keep you posted.

Thanks again,
Storkeye

pepe2008

I had the same cr*p from Capital One today. reading through the Regs on www.opsi.gov.uk It appears that they can omit such things, but it does not release them from providing you with a copy of the ORIGINAL CCA. All it does is satisfy the provision of a Copy of the Terms and Conditions that were relevant at the time of your Account opening......IT IS NOT THE AGREEMENT which is what they are required.
I will check with OFT to see if this breaks OFT Guidelines Section 2.2e and 2.8i

fermi

What twaddle from Argos. :rolleyes:

The regulations actually say:

(2) There may be omitted from any such copy--

(a) any information included in an executed agreement, security instrument or other document relating to the debtor,
hirer or surety or included for the use of the creditor or owner only which is not required to be included therein by the
Act or any Regulations thereunder as to the form and content of the document of which it is a copy;

(b) any signature box, signature or date of signature (other than, in the case of a copy of a cancellable executed
agreement delivered to the debtor under section 63(1) of the Act, the date of the signature by the debtor of an
agreement to which section 68(b) of the Act applies);

(c) in the case of any copy of an unexecuted agreement delivered or sent to the debtor or hirer under section 62 of
the Act, the name and address of the debtor or hirer

So they can ommit that on a copy of an UNEXECUTED agreement.

However, Sections 77/78 demand that the creditor provides a copy of the EXECUTED agreement.

That is the one completed by the customer and cannot omit those details.

pepe2008

Thanks Fermi.....I suspected that they were just grabbing at straws as some sort of avoidance tactic.
Should have asked you directly, been cross-eyed looking through all the Amendments!