Why house prices are headed down still

WTF?_2

IveSeenTheLight wrote: »

While some may have had fantastic foresight, I would hazzard a guess that the majority didn't buy into property because they couldn't afford to

Hmmm ... sounds like just another variation on the well worn "You want prices to go down because you are bitter and priced out" line. :rolleyes:

WTF?_2

chucky wrote: »

here you go, this was after a couple of minutes searching... i've highlighted it before and you still inisist and still deny that these hardcore HPCers exist.

funnily enough they've got a high numbers of Thanks versus posting ratio... so there are people that agree with them out there...

http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showpost.html?p=15354885&postcount=2

http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showpost.html?p=15332667&postcount=7

http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showpost.html?p=15305889&postcount=3

if you agree with these posters (and there are many more) it's up to you - i don't.

and as for you being well ahead of the curve in understanding just how badly screwed the economy was going to be - your timing was terrible, you should have bought in 1999 and then sold in 2006.

that's what i would say is being ahead of the curve...

I saw nothing in those links to support your bizarre claims.

I suspect that you have rather a lot of money tied up in property and thus are projecting your fears onto anyone who takes a bearish point of view on it.

As for buying in 1999 - a bit difficult to do so with zero savings then and as I've said before, I didn't even take an interest in buying a house until late 2006.

chucky

!!!!!!? wrote: »

I saw nothing in those links to support your bizarre claims.

i think it's probably more bizarre for you to think that wanting to send a BTLer to prison is a normal viewpoint to have especially that it wasn't said tongue in cheek. personally i think it's a stupid comment to make.

best leave that one there i think - just displays your agreement for anyone that has been obviously more succesful to you. shame because you're not a stupid chap...

!!!!!!? wrote: »

I suspect that you have rather a lot of money tied up in property and thus are projecting your fears onto anyone who takes a bearish point of view on it.

of course that i have money tied up in property, you know this already - i feel it's bit strange that you continuosly bring this up, is this a problem to you? they were purchases made from motivated sellers with good discounts, excellent areas, low costs, no new-builds and also have a good return on the lettings.

i've insulated myself quite well - in addition the Land Registry figures look quite healthy year on year, only somewhere around a 3% drop that lags a couple of months. not a crash that is predicted by yourself by any means.
http://www1.landregistry.gov.uk/houseprices/housepriceindex/report/default.asp?g=1&gt=2&a=City+Of+Westminster&s=01%20October%202007&e=01%20September%202008&t=1

i know they don't take into account reposessions and new-builds but they won't have a massive impact on these numbers, so you can see that i am quite happy with my investments especially in these times.

in addition i work for myself on medium term contracts and all properties are owned by the company so there have been tax incentives there which further insulate me in the event prices do 'crash' in this area.

i'm also looking at the next bargain to be had at the moment - just waiting for the seller to get his expectations down to my level.

WTF?_2

chucky wrote: »

i think it's probably more bizarre for you to think that wanting to send a BTLer to prison is a normal viewpoint to have especially that it wasn't said tongue in cheek. personally i think it's a stupid comment to make.

best leave that one there i think - just displays your agreement for anyone that has been obviously more succesful to you. shame because you're not a stupid chap...

You claimed that there were hardcore HPCers here who .."do not see and will never see the bigger picture. they demand lower house prices and want bankers, EA's, brokers, BTLers etc to do badly or lose their jobs."

I didn't see anything in the links you gave to support that. Most HPCers would simply like cheaper houses and didn't buy into the mainstream hype of the last few years. If they laugh at some of the idiots involved in pimping prices, doesn't indicate some overarching ulterior motive.

I do notice that there's another thread here today which started off with a post laughing about how much money hedge funds and short sellers lost in the murky VW affair and you thanked that post..... :rolleyes: Rather hypocritical I thought.

chucky

!!!!!!? wrote: »

You claimed that there were hardcore HPCers here who .."do not see and will never see the bigger picture. they demand lower house prices and want bankers, EA's, brokers, BTLers etc to do badly or lose their jobs."

I didn't see anything in the links you gave to support that. Most HPCers would simply like cheaper houses and didn't buy into the mainstream hype of the last few years. If they laugh at some of the idiots involved in pimping prices, doesn't indicate some overarching ulterior motive.

I do notice that there's another thread here today which started off with a post laughing about how much money hedge funds and short sellers lost in the murky VW affair and you thanked that post..... :rolleyes: Rather hypocritical I thought.

i don't have a problem with HPCers - just the doom mongers.

one thing i will agree on you here is that there are hardcore HPCers and also hardcore HPIers. i just seem to notice that there are more hardcore HPCers, you don't see it that way unfortunately.

not sure what you're trying to get by me thanking a post but it was an informative post from a credible source about something that i had interest in. by you saying hypocrytical about Thanking a post - have a look at this

http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showpost.html?p=14807495&postcount=47

just shows that and i agree that everyone is free to Thank a post and shouldn't have to justify it anyone esle. i felt i had to so that you were clear why i did so.

we've nearly taken this thread off topic again so it's probably better if you PM and we can have this discussion privately.

WTF?_2

chucky wrote: »

i don't have a problem with HPCers - just the doom mongers.

And what exactly constitutes a 'doom monger' then?

As far as I can see, in the context of this forum it's an epithet hurled by those of bullish disposition here at anyone who has a bearish outlook on the market.

But then, attacking the person when you don't like the message has been a hallmark of this forum pretty much ever since the day it was created. Amazing to see that even months and months later when the 'doom mongers' have been proven to be correct some people still can't let it lie....

chucky

!!!!!!? wrote: »

And what exactly constitutes a 'doom monger' then?

As far as I can see, in the context of this forum it's an epithet hurled by those of bullish disposition here at anyone who has a bearish outlook on the market.

But then, attacking the person when you don't like the message has been a hallmark of this forum pretty much ever since the day it was created. Amazing to see that even months and months later when the 'doom mongers' have been proven to be correct some people still can't let it lie....

A definition of a doom monger is this and it's not directed at you before you wade in - It's usually a person with a sense of personal inadequacy and self-loathing. In order to gain attention they attempt to instill a sense of fear in others to satisfy their need to feel wanted and loved, internet forums give these people a sense of power. Usually characterised by an insistance they are right, you are wrong and if you don't agree with them you are a fool.

I'm not in to your argument of it all being predicted; my view is that house prices will either go up or down there are opportunities all the time, just as the wind will either blow from the North or the South. Some people seem to churn out the same negative stories, that's fair enough; but even a broken clock will be correct once a day - I for one wouldn't put my life on hold by not purchasing and wanting to hit the bottom of the market, it isn't an exact science unfortunately.

WTF?_2

chucky wrote: »

A definition of a doom monger is this and it's not directed at you before you wade in - It's usually a person with a sense of personal inadequacy and self-loathing. In order to gain attention they attempt to instill a sense of fear in others to satisfy their need to feel wanted and loved, internet forums give these people a sense of power. Usually characterised by an insistance they are right, you are wrong and if you don't agree with them you are a fool.

Hmmm - I haven't seen too much of that from the 'HPC crowd'. Plenty of pretty vitriolic attacks from some 'bullish' posters about how anyone wanting lower prices or predicting falls is somehow inadequate or simply can't afford to buy and is bitter, etc. etc. Pickledpink springs immediately to mind.....

I'm not in to your argument of it all being predicted; my view is that house prices will either go up or down there are opportunities all the time, just as the wind will either blow from the North or the South. Some people seem to churn out the same negative stories, that's fair enough; but even a broken clock will be correct once a day - I for one wouldn't put my life on hold by not purchasing and wanting to hit the bottom of the market, it isn't an exact science unfortunately.

House prices are pretty much going to keep going down for at least another year IMO. And I don't think we've seen the worst of the financial crisis yet - there's plenty of nasty hidden toxic debt and other stuff still to emerge. Plus, we're only experiencing the start of the 'real world' hardships of the recession.

That's grim but it's realism as far as I'm concerned, not doom mongering or 'talking the market down' or whatever. Any typical FTB would need to be prepared to take a really long term view and be willing to lose money if they were buying into the market now. Why put yourself into a sticky situation when you don't have to?

chucky

thanks for the post !!!!!! - let's leave it there now...

Austin_Allegro

IveSeenTheLight wrote: »

While some may have had fantastic foresight, I would hazzard a guess that the majority didn't buy into property because they couldn't afford to

I think you'll find that most people in the UK couldn't afford to buy into property in the last few years.

Many, however, convinced themselves that they could by buying into the hype and sales tactics of moneylenders and other assorted VIs, thinking they were 'buying' something when all they were doing was taking on unsustainable amounts of debt. It's the realisation of this problem by the banks that is causing a lot of the current economic problems.

I don't think I had 'fantastic foresight' but I was able to work out that something was wrong when I couldn't buy even a derelict council 1-bed hovel despite earning an above average salary and having several thousand pounds in savings; which was what led me to sites like HPC.