How buy-to-let turned into a mug’s game

stevetodd

wisbech_lad wrote: »

SteveTodd,

Thanks for that. My father was a bookie's runner as a teenager, even now in his 70's his mental maths is amazingly fast! He enjoyed the whole "game" of laying off bets, keeping the book etc., and then helped supplement his money as a student, and for a couple of years after by being a semi-pro gambler (mostly bridge and poker) in London clubs.

His favourite "coup" was holes-in-ones at major tournaments. He worked out the odds of them happening (based on # of par 3's, number of players, # of rounds) and found that bookies of the time (late 50's early 60's) badly underestimated - and would quote odds that were multiples of the true probability of a hole in one happening. So he would spread around small bets (so as not to spook the bookies) every tournament. Not big money, but he still is proud of spotting such a mispricing!

One thing that spectator article fails to mention. Gearing. 30,000 quid of B&B shares now worth zero. 30,000 quid in a BTL flat, assuming drop of 50% and 15% deposit, now worth -70,000 quid.

Shares are "limited liability".

Hi, actually a friend of mine from the racecourse (NC was his initials) told me about 2 guys who went all over the place backing holes in one at golf tournaments, I think he read about it (but he may have knew one of them), one of them was probably your father? I probably have the figures wrong but I seem to remember that the magnitude of error in the odds was huge something in the order of actual 6/4 but offered at about 8/1 and it started decreasing as payouts occurred but they were still underestimating it for while.

moanymoany

When I started work I was 15. The company where I worked held sweepstakes on all the bug races. It was compulsory to enter (pressure probably, but I thought you couldn't say no) and it cost half a crown.

I knew nothing about racing anyway and always got a rank outsider that lost. Half a crown was a lot of money for me to lose and I resented it very much every time the biggies came around.

Since then I have been grateful to this practice. The worse thing that could have happened to me is that I won anything. As it is I have rarely bet since. Don't buy lottery tickets or scratch cards as - to me - it is throwing money away. I hate raffles and especially tombollas! I would rather simply give my money to the 'good cause'.

Horses for courses. :rotfl:

Neillgb

Yes, lessons are best learnt young.

On the gambling front I didn't learn my lesson early enough.

However I did pick up a dog end and take a puff at about 10 years old ,that was my last ciggy!!

Strange how this thread seems to have become full of posts relating to gambling. I mean buying property wasn't a gamble was it? Surely it was a sure thing investment.

manchestermike_2

neverdespairgirl wrote: »

Every so often people come on this board and say this. It amazes me. I have no desire whatsoever to be a property investor. None. Nada.

If I had the chance (i.e. the money and time) to do this years ago I'd have jumped at it. I have no desire now, but 7/8 years ago I'd have definitely invested in property. What would you have looked to invest in instead?

On the gambling, there are lessons of course, but if you take those lessons and do learn them then betting can be a profitable passtime

JonnyBravo

moanymoany wrote: »

The company where I worked held sweepstakes on all the bug races. It was compulsory to enter (pressure probably, but I thought you couldn't say no) and it cost half a crown.

Ah yes.... I fondly remember the good ol' days of the Earwig Derby and the famously long run in on the Millipede Grand National.... oh the arguments.... " it can't have won, it hasn't got all its feet across the line yet"

:rolleyes:

Sir_Humphrey

manchestermike wrote: »

If I had the chance (i.e. the money and time) to do this years ago I'd have jumped at it. I have no desire now, but 7/8 years ago I'd have definitely invested in property. What would you have looked to invest in instead?

Thirty years ago, I wish I had bought shares in Microsoft. Shame I wasn't alive.

Ten years ago, buying a house to live in would have been a good idea. However, I was too busy starting at University.

manchestermike_2

Sir_Humphrey wrote: »

Thirty years ago, I wish I had bought shares in Microsoft. Shame I wasn't alive.

Ten years ago, buying a house to live in would have been a good idea. However, I was too busy starting at University.

So was I, that's not the point. The point I am making is that IF you were in a position to invest in property at that time I'm sure any sensible person would have

neverdespairgirl

manchestermike wrote: »

If I had the chance (i.e. the money and time) to do this years ago I'd have jumped at it. I have no desire now, but 7/8 years ago I'd have definitely invested in property. What would you have looked to invest in instead?

I'd have focused on earning my money instead. I just have no interest in being a LL.

IveSeenTheLight

neverdespairgirl wrote: »

I'd have focused on earning my money instead. I just have no interest in being a LL.

Now now NDG, is that a dig that being a LL is a way of getting money without earning it?

Being a LL is just another means of investment, like shares are and puting the money in a bank.
If you don't believe in receiving money that you have not earned, then you wouldn't be puting your money into banks

neverdespairgirl

IveSeenTheLight wrote: »

Now now NDG, is that a dig that being a LL is a way of getting money without earning it?

No, not a dig at all. I mean that I would do my own work, that I enjoy, rather than the LL-type work, which I wouldn't.