Darwinian natural selection will ensure property will once again boom.

vigesimal

chucky wrote: »

also when you say that BTL doesn't produce anything - i rent one of my properties to a business. what do you think of that?

do you think that i am taking a home away from someone?

You seem to have a strange idea about what a business is. I ran a business for 40 years before retiring early and letting my sons take over. We make things. We employ people. If you couldn't have rented your property out to a business would you have rented it out to a family? What about the other properties you say you have, are they rented to families?

If you are quite happy that you have taken homes away from people, then that says a lot about the type of person you are.

Cash flow is the downfall of most business. Lets see how a lot of BTLers get on now. I doubt many of them did a business plan.

vigesimal

chucky wrote: »

properties always get developed (give work to local builders), property gets marketed (EA's get work, helps support that business and the people that work for that business), property gets advertised (advertising space in magazines, that also provides jobs),

All of that would have be the same is FTBers had the properties. Can you really not see that???

vigesimal

chucky wrote: »

a quick question carol - do you speak to your landlord with the hate that you do in this forum? i bet you don't and you're as good as pie, otherwise you'd be on the street and you know it!

Do you speak to your tenants like that? I doubt you do or they would be leaving you with a void and the costs of finding another tenant.

There is an oversupply with rentals, so I doubt a LL would like to lose a tenant that pays on time. Unless he doesn't understand about business and from reading this site, I starting to realise that a lot of BTLers don't.

I even saw one LL write that her tenants loved her:rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:

ruggedtoast

Conrad wrote: »

Rugged toast

I have bought 2 properties in Germany (1 of which I sold recently). Thier property market crashed from the late nineties and only began to recover recently.
In affluent parts of what was West Germany, the owner occupier proportion is similar to the UK.
In the former communist east, few of course owned thier own property as the state did everything and it will take time for ownership to embed, so of course thier ownership levels are lower.

Biological security is the inner impulse that drives organisms to want a secure private habitat, whether its rented or owned.
Property is therefore highly valued.

In some circumstances people are more secure renting. As maligned as council housing is, it gives people somewhere to live where at least they know if they lose their job their landlord wont throw them onto the streets with a ruined credit rating and little chance of getting anywhere else.

Thanks to free market neo-liberalism poverty is wealth double think, a worthy high minded ideal - society providing secure stakeholder homes for its citizens, has been subverted into an analogy for personal and state led failure. And to be replaced with what; millions waking in the middle of the night in a cold sweat because their minds cant turn off trying to work out how they can make their next mortgage or rent payment if the next team meeting announces the job losses everyone knows is coming?

Brown's economic miracle has left many people one p45 and a missed paycheck away from homelessness. The illusion that gearing property investments was going to provide any long term financial security is just that, an illusion pushed on us to sell usurious loans.

chucky

vigesimal wrote: »

You seem to have a strange idea about what a business is. I ran a business for 40 years before retiring early and letting my sons take over. We make things. We employ people. If you couldn't have rented your property out to a business would you have rented it out to a family? What about the other properties you say you have, are they rented to families?

No properties have been rented to families. All one beds; examples are one has been rented to someone who works in the City (non-finance) and another to someone who just wants to live in that area (I think her father pays for that), that doesn't include the business let too.

vigesimal wrote: »

If you are quite happy that you have taken homes away from people, then that says a lot about the type of person you are.

Not taken any home from people, they are free to go and buy if they need to. Neither of the above want to rent as both are foreign nationals and are just starting their careers in London.

Confused about the last sentence; are you an on-line psychoanalyst?

vigesimal wrote: »

Cash flow is the downfall of most business. Lets see how a lot of BTLers get on now. I doubt many of them did a business plan.

A business plan is essential for any business however small. I project manage everything for at least two years forward. I also have enough funds in my company to pay for 2 years mortgage payments in case the property doesn't rent.

My residential situation isn't too shoddy either, I also have liquidity there. Only a 15% mortgage approx, should be mortgage free by the end of next year or even longer if rates contniue to drop.

Hope that you're enjoying your retirement by the way.

chucky

vigesimal wrote: »

Do you speak to your tenants like that? I doubt you do or they would be leaving you with a void and the costs of finding another tenant.

There is an oversupply with rentals, so I doubt a LL would like to lose a tenant that pays on time. Unless he doesn't understand about business and from reading this site, I starting to realise that a lot of BTLers don't.

I even saw one LL write that her tenants loved her:rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:

Never speak to tenants - it's all managed. Much more efficient use of my time and effort.

Over supply with rentals - not here sorry
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/personalfinance/borrowing/mortgages/3056278/Rental-demand-soars-65-per-cent.html

Many BTLers definately don't know their stuff and are amatuers - as everyone knows these will realise that BTL isn't for them and sell and move on.

The letter of love sounds a bit desperate - he should really try online dating...

carolt

chucky - my landlord has a pretty clear idea of my real opinion of her, I imagine, much as I do of her opinion of me.

She thinks of me as a mealticket - I think of her as a parasite.

Obviously we're polite when we converse, but whatever she thinks I think, she doesn't want to lose me - she knows we're damn good tenants and have never paid a day late in 4.5 years, and look after her property. That's why we've only had 1 rent increase in that time, and it was negotiated downwards.

Your post suggesting that I should be 'as good as pie' is somewhat revealing of your attitude towards landlord-tenant relations. I hope you are 'as good as pie' when it comes to maintaining your properties.

neverdespairgirl

vigesimal wrote: »

I even saw one LL write that her tenants loved her

I don't love my LL, but we get on fine.

Cannon_Fodder

chucky wrote: »

Over supply with rentals - not here sorry
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/personalfinance/borrowing/mortgages/3056278/Rental-demand-soars-65-per-cent.html

There is an important factor missing from that article;

"What % change has there been in supply of properties to rent?"


Lots of properties are appearing twice in the weekly housing supplements, as while they cannot sell, they are trying to rent in the meantime.

In the interests of accurately understanding the business/market, I would have thought supply is an important consideration.

chucky

Cannon_Fodder wrote: »

There is an important factor missing from that article;

"What % change has there been in supply of properties to rent?"


Lots of properties are appearing twice in the weekly housing supplements, as while they cannot sell, they are trying to rent in the meantime.

In the interests of accurately understanding the business/market, I would have thought supply is an important consideration.

apologies CF - i didn't write the article.

i can only speak for Central London. rents seem to be holding out well, on average they would have dropped 2%. a very small drop.

a switched on Landlord will always put on his property at a lower price so that it is competitive, less than a 2% reduction. he obviously does this so that the property is never empty, one week of it being empty equates to 1.92% of your annual rental income. so by reducing it by 5% should always give you a better annualised return.

if that equates to a price drop or a crash i'm not really sure.

as for properties appearing in both rentals and sales, that has always happened. if you're saying that it is happening more, i haven't seen those numbers so would be very intrigued to see them. do you have them or can tell me where to find them?

as a BTLer i always put a property on sales when it is being marketed for rent. you never know if someone may come along and pay the full asking price for that property. if the price suits i sell if it doesn't i let.