Bloody hell - it's MELTDOWN on the FTSE

Dithering_Dad

borntobefree wrote: »

No I have not mixed you up with somone else and nor am I lying.

Let's take this statement of yours

when I say that "I am going to do this" or "I am going to do that", it's not advice. It's just what I'm personally doing.

and this link you provide here

http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/...html?t=1209067


In this link you were clearly given advice - whatever terms you like to cosset it in. My recollection is that you were quite adamant in your advice, rather than the cuddly " I suggested this and I suggested that" parlance taken in this post.

So I have also, like you, reached 2 conclusions:-

1) You don't want to acknowledge the poor advice you have given in the past ( but then I never thought you would).

2) You actually, truthfully, don't even remember giving such poor advice - which I find, frankly, even more scary.

I suggest you go onto the pensions forums or the Savings and Investment forum and ask whether it's better to put your retirement money into a Cash ISA or into an S&S ISA. I know what the response will be.

If you believe that a Cash ISA is a good repository for your pension, then that's your choice and you will have to stand by that decision while your long-term pension savings get eroded by inflation.

I actually favour pension plans to (S&S) ISA savings because you can't dip into them for emergencies or irresponsible spending, they are not means-tested for benefits and you get a valuable tax incentive of 20% for basic rate tax payers ad 40% for high rate tax payers.

My usual comment with pensions is that whatever you do to save towards retirement is good, because at least you're doing something. It's just that some investments do better than others and certainly a pension pot held in a diversified portfolio of shares, gilts, cash & property funds will give a better return than putting all of your money into a single asset, namely cash in a Cash ISA.

Good luck with your Cash ISA plan, but I really do think you should seek financial advice before embarking on this (or continuing it if you have already started).

p.s. if you're going to "throw someone's words back in their faces", it's usually better to 'quote' the original text rather than just go on about some vague recollection you have. You have much more credibility that way. I'd also say that it is interesting that you recall me saying something back in January, when you actually didn't join until March. :rolleyes:

borntobefree

Dithering_Dad wrote: »

I suggest you go onto the pensions forums or the Savings and Investment forum and ask whether it's better to put your retirement money into a Cash ISA or into an S&S ISA. I know what the response will be.

If you believe that a Cash ISA is a good repository for your pension, then that's your choice and you will have to stand by that decision while your long-term pension savings get eroded by inflation.

I actually favour pension plans to (S&S) ISA savings because you can't dip into them for emergencies or irresponsible spending, they are not means-tested for benefits and you get a valuable tax incentive of 20% for basic rate tax payers ad 40% for high rate tax payers.

I assume you deliberately keep misunderstanding my posts in order to evade the issue

My usual comment with pensions is that whatever you do to save towards retirement is good, because at least you're doing something. It's just that some investments do better than others and certainly a pension pot held in a diversified portfolio of shares, gilts, cash & property funds will give a better return than putting all of your money into a single asset, namely cash in a Cash ISA.

Good luck with your Cash ISA plan, but I really do think you should seek financial advice before embarking on this (or continuing it if you have already started).

evasion

p.s. if you're going to "throw someone's words back in their faces", it's usually better to 'quote' the original text rather than just go on about some vague recollection you have. You have much more credibility that way. I'd also say that it is interesting that you recall me saying something back in January, when you actually didn't join until March. :rolleyes:

I never said anything about January, so why make that up?

Dithering_Dad

borntobefree wrote: »

I never said anything about January, so why make that up?

Yawn. I can't be bothered with you now B2bt. I don't really understand the point you're trying to make and to be honest, if it's boring me it must be excruciatingly tedious to everyone else on the forum.

All I can say is to reiterate what I have always said about pension:

1. Everyone should have retirement savings because the state pension is just enough to survive on but not to 'live' on. Any method you use to get you there is fine because it's better to do something than nothing, however you do get better returns dependant on what you invest in.

2. I feel that a balanced portfolio of stocks (mixture of UK, EU, US and ROW) and mixture of industries (utilities, manufacturing, financial services, etc), index linked or fixed government bonds, cash and property is the safest way to invest if you want growth. Better than putting all your money in one asset class such as cash, property (i.e. BTL) or even 100% in equities.

3. I feel that one needs to analyse your own risk aversion and invest accordingly. My own risk profile is 'adventurous growth so I have 83% in equities, 10% in government bonds and 7% in cash. People who have greater aversion to risk (or are close to retirement) should invest a greater percentage of their pension in cash funds, property funds and government bonds.

4. I feel that pensions are better than S&S ISAs for retirement planning, especially for high rate tax payers and so people who get contributions from their employers. I think that S&S ISAs have their place in supplimenting the main pension, rather than replacing it as some others advise.

5. I feel that Cash ISAs are useful for storing emergency money, but once you have reached your comfort limit (say 3x or 6x monthly expenditure) then I think it's better to then invest in an S&S ISA.

Everything I have suggested above is what I am actually doing right now - except that my emergency savings are held in my company bank account. If I didn't have my own company then I would either put my emergency money into Cash ISAs or into my Mortgage Offset account.

If you feel that any of the above is bad advice, then please feel free to do something different. As ever on any financial forums, read them and then DO YOUR OWN RESEARCH. What works for one person does not always work for someone else.

Also please remember that even professional financial advice provided by an IFA has a time limit, so advice given in one time-frame, may not be pertinen in another - hence why it's better to have 'trail commission' when you use a financial advisor. This means that they actively manage your portfolio, rather than put your pension into a series of investment that may be excellent in January, but may not be in October.

Note: all of the above is general purpose suggestions, rather than direct advice. I have not, and would not make suggestions on which funds to invest your money into or whether the funds/endowments/investments you currently have are good or bad. I simply have my strategy and I'm happy to discuss this on the forum.

Hope this clears things up B2bt. If it doesn't then I'm afraid we will just have to agree to differ and stop clogging up threads with off-topic discussions. If you still wish to discuss pension investment strategies then please PM me and I'll provide more information on my personal strategy, though I must add that I'm not a financial advisor and so couldn't & wouldn't suggest a strategy for anyone else.

The PM mechanism is a great tool for people to discuss non-topic relevent items that are nonrelevant to other forums users. Many people don;t use the PM mechanism because they like to 'play to the crowd'. In this case I think the crowd is pretty bored of your posts, but I am hoping that my couple of pension posts will have been of interest and useful.

Cheers

carolt

Hallo DD - the world's leaders are meeting this weekend to decide whether or not the global economy is going to go into meltdown.

Might this not be a good time to hang up the sparring gloves?

Good luck everyone - let's hope it all works out for the best......

GDB2222

!!!!!!? wrote: »

However, there's just a chance that the panic could tip the system over the edge into a total meltdown.

Actually, it's rather a good chance. Insurance companies, in particular, may be compelled by the solvency rules to sell their equities into a market without buyers, which forces them to sell more ... and so on. The last time this happened, I bought a shed-load of shares from Standard Life when the FTSE index was 3200 in April/May 2003. I'm still holding those, so I'm really aghast to think that they could be back to that value again next week.

The solvency rules have been altered since then, but it comes down to the same thing. Institutions can sell their equities at a low point in the market and ensure they remain solvent. Alternatively, they can hang on in there and hope that prices recover. If prices don't recover, though, the institutions have just turned themselves into a giant Ponzi scheme. I'm pleased I'm not working at the FSA right now.

Anyway, DD has piled into equities, which will move the market back up again.

Edit: I'll just add that if we are in for a fairly ordinary recession the market has discounted that, and more. If it gets a lot worse, ie a couple of weeks more like last week, then there is a risk of total financial collapse and social breakdown, and the value of the little bits of paper called share certificates is the very least of our worries. Consequently, DD's bet on the market looks more and more like a no-risk bet to me the more I think about it. If he's wrong, all he's lost is a deposit in an institution that probably won't be there when the riots and looting have stopped.

GracieP

GDB2222 wrote: »

Anyway, DD has piled into equities, which will move the market back up again.

Perhaps it was his purchase that made the DOW spike like it did last night.:D

mewbie_2

I think now is a good time to buy some shares. If it's really the end of the world then it won't much matter anyway, and if it isn't the end of the world then might make a bit of money. All I need is a share broker who can lend me ten times income with no deposit or proof of earnings, so I can invest about £250,000.

GDB2222

I've just ordered a load of mineral water for Ocado to deliver tonight. My BMI is so high that I'll out-survive the rest of you, as long as I have something to drink.

hethmar

Not if we eat you first

Dithering_Dad

carolt wrote: »

Hallo DD - the world's leaders are meeting this weekend to decide whether or not the global economy is going to go into meltdown.

Might this not be a good time to hang up the sparring gloves?

Good luck everyone - let's hope it all works out for the best......

Hi Carol, I'm hoping that G7 (or is it G8 now, I always forget) will come up with something and the markets will start to turn around. Otherwise we could end up in a depression and as the other guys have said, it matters not if you have your money in a cash fund or equity fund - the whole lot will go down the toilet.

As far as hanging up the sparring gloves, you will have probably noticed that B2tf is the one who started the 'sparring' and continued it through the thread despite my efforts to end it (such as my "Good luck with your Cash ISA pension plan" comments and suggestion that she uses the PM mechanism if she wants to discuss this further). Strange how you made the suggestion that I hang up my gloves and yet said nothing to her?