Full and final settlement help thread

GP2015

fatbelly wrote: »

OK, you don't have to send income/expenditure details, let alone bank statements.

If you think the Arrow/Capquest debt might be lacking paperwork, and it was originally a CCA debt, like a loan or credit card, why not do a CCA request? You may kill this off at no cost.

I don't have anything to go by, other than the sudden series of letters related to this account. And, as I understand from this thread, a CCA request isn't without potential risks. Naturally they will never tell me "we have no leg to stand on", unless I probe. Well, I need to think about this. Incidentally, I was wrong about capquest being the latest owner of this particular debt, they're "only" (?) "managing the account on behalf of" Arrow. Does it mean that I should make any offers still to Arrow, rather than CapQuest?
... and I got a first reply from my creditors to my first offer, they counteroffered with approx. 20% off the total, which would be ok, if I had this much!
Does anyone know how long such games last? I mean, I will now increase my offer to, say, 35%, they (possibly) offer to go down to 75%, then I up it to 40% and they go down to mayby 65%, etc, etc? Last time I haggled like this was in Asia, more than 15 years ago, pretty awkward.

glentoran99

GP2015 wrote: »

I don't have anything to go by, other than the sudden series of letters related to this account. And, as I understand from this thread, a CCA request isn't without potential risks. Naturally they will never tell me "we have no leg to stand on", unless I probe. Well, I need to think about this. Incidentally, I was wrong about capquest being the latest owner of this particular debt, they're "only" (?) "managing the account on behalf of" Arrow. Does it mean that I should make any offers still to Arrow, rather than CapQuest?
... and I got a first reply from my creditors to my first offer, they counteroffered with approx. 20% off the total, which would be ok, if I had this much!
Does anyone know how long such games last? I mean, I will now increase my offer to, say, 35%, they (possibly) offer to go down to 75%, then I up it to 40% and they go down to mayby 65%, etc, etc? Last time I haggled like this was in Asia, more than 15 years ago, pretty awkward.

you'd be surprised, quite common for them to do so

fatbelly

GP2015 wrote: »

I don't have anything to go by, other than the sudden series of letters related to this account. And, as I understand from this thread, a CCA request isn't without potential risks. Naturally they will never tell me "we have no leg to stand on", unless I probe. Well, I need to think about this. Incidentally, I was wrong about capquest being the latest owner of this particular debt, they're "only" (?) "managing the account on behalf of" Arrow. Does it mean that I should make any offers still to Arrow, rather than CapQuest?
... and I got a first reply from my creditors to my first offer, they counteroffered with approx. 20% off the total, which would be ok, if I had this much!
Does anyone know how long such games last? I mean, I will now increase my offer to, say, 35%, they (possibly) offer to go down to 75%, then I up it to 40% and they go down to mayby 65%, etc, etc? Last time I haggled like this was in Asia, more than 15 years ago, pretty awkward.

Glentoran is right - creditors are more likely now to admit this since FCA guidance warned them about it

8) However, where a firm is aware that an agreement is unenforceable because of non-compliance with an information request under section 77, 78 or 79 of the CCA, a firm should make it clear when communicating to a customer about a debt that the debt is in fact unenforceable. Failure to do so, in that case, would in the FCA's view unfairly mislead the customer by omission. Any communication that implies expressly or otherwise that a debt is enforceable when it is known that it is not, would be misleading. One way to avoid this would be for the firm to explain to the customer the full meaning of 'unenforceable'.

I can't think what risks you may be worried about - maybe waking up a creditor that has gone to sleep, but that doesn't apply here.

Regarding F&F negotiation - yes it can be quite drawn out. That's what I try to conclude a deal with a phone call then get confirmation in writing. But the gap between <35% and 80% is probably too large.

braveheart6612

Quick update I had a payday loan with Mr Lender £210 settled for £60 full and final. So paid it still have Avant to pay by 26/12. WONGA and MYJAR not interested in settling unless in full there not defaulted yet which is my intention in 2017. Moving away from SC to self manage DMP.

GP2015

Hello everybody,
I've read all posts in this thread related to the reply from creditors, who politely ask for (before considering offer further, etc.) "details of income and expenditure". I know I don't have to legally provide bank statements (and they haven't asked - YET), but they did provide a photocopy of their "income and expenditure" form to complete. Now, providing my own income and expenditure on their form is not a problem, BUT the form also ask details about my spouse / partner, including "their take home pay", plus details about mortgage (who with, total mortgage, current value of the property, council tax, etc.). The mortgage is in my partner's name, so I can happily ignore these fields. BUT, how can I ignore the field "spouse's take home pay", if I first have to complete the fields "Do you have a partner / spouse and "how many people live with you", plus "Children (under 18)"? Well, I "have to", in the sense that I want something from them (consider my final payment offer), so I need to demonstrate good will to cooperate so that they can get a "better picture" to consider my offer.
I really don't want to give them details of my wife's income, because they could well say: right, it looks like you can make those payments, or pay even more. Plus, my wife banks with them, so a bit risky. At least her mortgage is no longer with them!
Does anyone have any suggestions on how to handle that "spouse take home pay"? If I just ignore the fields, they might happily reply asking for other details "to help me", e.g. bank statements (and they will see money my wife has transferred from her Santander account a few times when she propped me up) or they could write they have not received enough proof from me to consider my offer - which would be, frankly, hard to dispute...

Regards,
n.

sourcrates

GP2015 wrote: »

Does anyone have any suggestions on how to handle that "spouse take home pay"?
Regards,
n.

Yes, ignore it, draw a line through it.

It's absolutely none of their business what your partner earns, the debt is yours, not your spouses.

You only fill in sections relevant to yourself, ignore everything else.

This gets asked every now an then, I always advise the same, and no one has yet come back to me saying they were treated any different, or had to jump through hoops for doing so.

GP2015

Thank you very much for the tip, I will do that!
p.s. I also got asked in their reply, whether I'd maintain my current payment to them should they reject my offer. This is quite a baffling question, I mean, my instict would tell me to confirm, as I really would continue paying them, what else? (unless I couldn't afford to, if things get worse). Are they really worried I'd reduce my DMP monthly payments to gain a leverage for negotiating a better final settlement? Or is it a probing question (you don't ask you don't get) to make me show my intentions and then, potentially, try more aggressive debt recovery options?

Regards,
n.

sourcrates

GP2015 wrote: »

Thank you very much for the tip, I will do that!
p.s. I also got asked in their reply, whether I'd maintain my current payment to them should they reject my offer. This is quite a baffling question, I mean, my instict would tell me to confirm, as I really would continue paying them, what else? (unless I couldn't afford to, if things get worse). Are they really worried I'd reduce my DMP monthly payments to gain a leverage for negotiating a better final settlement? Or is it a probing question (you don't ask you don't get) to make me show my intentions and then, potentially, try more aggressive debt recovery options?

Regards,
n.

I've seen various incarnations of these forms from different creditors, I have no idea why they ask what they do, it will all be to do with there profiling of you.

Where debt collectors are concerned, experience has taught me the less you tell them, the better.

I have no respect or time for these people, to me they are the lowest form of life on this planet, who only seek to profit from someone else's bad fortune.

I would lie my head off to them before I told them a word of truth, but hey, that's just my opinion.

GP2015

Thank you! I will consider your... opinion

Regards,
n.

DrWatson1

Sourcrates is right. If you're dealing with a company who has bought the debt, would you ask them, or expect them to provide details of, how much they paid for the debt? No, but that's essentially what they are asking you for.