help with misold endownment-Please help!!!

frostypug10

wrote a letter to Barclays concerning a misselling of an endownment policy connected to the morgage on my property. The main points of it were that the Bank manager of our local Barclays branch was the one who in fact recommended that we change from our repayment mortgage to the endownment type. He then arranged for a Barclays insurance rep to call which he did and told us the usual promises of will pay all and a lump sum and why dont we have more than we need etc. We now have a £6.000 shortfall on a £16.000 policy. The second main point was that the policy matures after my husband and I are over retirement age.
Barclays have now sent a claim form with lots of questions such as "Did we read the agreements" and "Did we realise that it would mature after retirement etc"
I really would like some advice off anyone who has been through this as I dont want to make a mistake when filling it in.
It is due back soon so any help would be appreciated sooner rather than later
Many thanks

EdInvestor

Most people can't remember the answers to these questions the providers ask in an effort to fish for information which may help them to refute your claim.

treliac

You will find lots of information on the 'Act now on mis-sold endowments' sticky. If you post this on there, you may well get more response too.

Our own mortgage was due to run for some time after retirement, the facts and consequences of which we did not realise at the time. This has counted as a point in evidence of it having been mis-sold to us.

Possibly, like ourselves, you did not read the paperwork at the time, nor understood it, being of the belief that everything was properly looked after by a 'financial professional,' whose advice you were paying for !!

dunstonh

EdInvestor wrote: »

Most people can't remember the answers to these questions the providers ask in an effort to fish for information which may help them to refute your claim.

Its strange that people cannot rememember the answers to these questions but manage to know exactly what they were told by the reps involved.

The second main point was that the policy matures after my husband and I are over retirement age.

A few years ago this was an easy one to get upheld. However, firms argued the point that taking a repayment mortgage for the same period would have still gone past retirement and many people would use their pension lump sum etc to pay off early. There was also a lot of abuse of this by claims companies and template letters who saw it as an easy way to get an upheld complaint. The FOS have listened somewhat on this and would expect you to prove it is going past retirement and that you dont have funding for it. This is to stop people saying they are retiring at 55 or 60 when in reality that was never on the cards and only 65 was available.

frostypug10

I have been to see the Mortgage advisor at Barclays as the FSA and the Ombusman said I had left it too late to claim for misselling.
He has offered me a number of options, extended mortgage time,higher payments for the next three years which is when it ends etc.
I think I should ask for a good will gesture payment as their rep. who sold it to us never mentioned that there was a possibility of it not paying out.
Is there any one who has done this or any advice please

treliac

dunstonh wrote: »

Its strange that people cannot rememember the answers to these questions but manage to know exactly what they were told by the reps involved.

We've been round this one many times (on the 'Sticky' thread) and I believe it's a case of the advisers not talking about these issues so as to encourage sales and therefore the buyers not understanding the implications, rather than people not remembering. IMO you really had 'to be there' to understand the climate at the time.

A few years ago this was an easy one to get upheld. However, firms argued the point that taking a repayment mortgage for the same period would have still gone past retirement and many people would use their pension lump sum etc to pay off early. There was also a lot of abuse of this by claims companies and template letters who saw it as an easy way to get an upheld complaint. The FOS have listened somewhat on this and would expect you to prove it is going past retirement and that you dont have funding for it. This is to stop people saying they are retiring at 55 or 60 when in reality that was never on the cards and only 65 was available.

I presume that the OP is talking about it going on beyond the age of 65 yrs. That was the situation in our case.

treliac

frostypug10 wrote: »

I have been to see the Mortgage advisor at Barclays as the FSA and the Ombusman said I had left it too late to claim for misselling.
He has offered me a number of options, extended mortgage time,higher payments for the next three years which is when it ends etc.
I think I should ask for a good will gesture payment as their rep. who sold it to us never mentioned that there was a possibility of it not paying out.
Is there any one who has done this or any advice please

There are many of us who believe that deadlines are an arbitrary and unfair measure to prevent claims unless, of course, it can be proven that the claimant had previously been advised that they may have been mis-sold and of their entitlement to make a claim, and had not bothered.

Lots of people have received some level of redress and others have not been able to do the same, in many cases because they reached the same point in their understanding later than those who were successful.

I am very sorry for you.

dunstonh

frostypug10 wrote: »

I have been to see the Mortgage advisor at Barclays as the FSA and the Ombusman said I had left it too late to claim for misselling.
He has offered me a number of options, extended mortgage time,higher payments for the next three years which is when it ends etc.
I think I should ask for a good will gesture payment as their rep. who sold it to us never mentioned that there was a possibility of it not paying out.
Is there any one who has done this or any advice please

They have absolutely no reason to pay you a penny. That probably means they wont.

We've been round this one many times (on the 'Sticky' thread) and I believe it's a case of the advisers not talking about these issues so as to encourage sales and therefore the buyers not understanding the implications, rather than people not remembering. IMO you really had 'to be there' to understand the climate at the time.

Yes we have. However, its a both sides here. I did follow endowment sales compliantly (such as issuing cost comparisons, giving the target growth rate in the reason why letter and saying if it didnt achieve that it would fall short and getting that signed). However, the most common reason for people doing an endowment mortgage was the lower cost of the monthly payments. The risk side is basically a non-issue for most people. They wanted to get on the ladder and pay as little as they could.

We all know that some endowments were mis-sold. Enough to justify a review. However, the endowment mis-sale process also encouraged a lot of people who were not mis-sold to make a claim. The whole thing has been a complete mess and no-one comes out of it without some blemish. The insurance companies, sales reps and advisers, the regulator, the FOS, claims companies, the consumers association (Which?), the media and consumers themselves.

There are many of us who believe that deadlines are an arbitrary and unfair measure to prevent claims unless, of course, it can be proven that the claimant had previously been advised that they may have been mis-sold and of their entitlement to make a claim, and had not bothered.

There are also those that believe the timebars should match those in law. If that was the case, then many more complaints would be rejected. The time bar is a subjective issue. You can see the reason why it exists but why is it that there are not time bars on other products? If should be the same rule for all financial products. They shouldnt be able to pick and choose.

treliac

dunstonh wrote: »

They have absolutely no reason to pay you a penny. That probably means they wont.



Yes we have. However, its a both sides here. I did follow endowment sales compliantly (such as issuing cost comparisons, giving the target growth rate in the reason why letter and saying if it didnt achieve that it would fall short and getting that signed). However, the most common reason for people doing an endowment mortgage was the lower cost of the monthly payments. The risk side is basically a non-issue for most people. They wanted to get on the ladder and pay as little as they could.

We all know that some endowments were mis-sold. Enough to justify a review. However, the endowment mis-sale process also encouraged a lot of people who were not mis-sold to make a claim. The whole thing has been a complete mess and no-one comes out of it without some blemish. The insurance companies, sales reps and advisers, the regulator, the FOS, claims companies, the consumers association (Which?), the media and consumers themselves.

I agree with you on many of your points.

I can only recount, with accuracy, the sales pitch I received and it was certainly nothing like the process you obviously followed. Whether that is due to your fairness and diligence or maybe something to do with the era (our case dates back to mid-eighties), i.e. the sales process being tightened up as time went by, I wouldn't like to say.

Our product wasn't cheaper either, and was not sold as being so.

But clearly the whole scene has been an utter mess. There are claimants and claims companies who have been rewarded with monies they should not have received and there are those who have not been helped out of the dreadful disadvantage they were put at by many unscrupulous (or ignorant?) sales staff.

The further mess that has been made by the industry in addressing mis-selling just adds more torment for those who cannot achieve justice.

dunstonh

can only recount, with accuracy, the sales pitch I received and it was certainly nothing like the process you obviously followed. Whether that is due to your fairness and diligence or maybe something to do with the era (our case dates back to mid-eighties), i.e. the sales process being tightened up as time went by, I wouldn't like to say.

I think the later you got into the 1990s the better the processes became. 1980s and early 90s had nothing that would come close to compliant by todays standards.

I was lucky. I didnt do a great deal of mortgages as I was in a wealthy town where it was mostly investing. Plus I had a unit linked background. And more than anything else, I didnt need to hit sales targets. Thats why I am very negative towards salesforces nowadays. I have seen the damage they do.

EdInvestor

frostypug10 wrote: »

He has offered me a number of options, extended mortgage time,higher payments for the next three years which is when it ends etc.

You will probably be best to cash in the endowment, use the money to reduce the mortgage, and increase the monthly mortgage payment by the amount of the (now redundant) endowment premium.You may need also need to increase the mortgage payment above that level and extend the mortgage term.