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  • FIRST POST
    • steady.alone
    • By steady.alone 29th Aug 16, 12:15 AM
    • 14Posts
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    steady.alone
    Letter Before Claim - Own Bay PCN
    • #1
    • 29th Aug 16, 12:15 AM
    Letter Before Claim - Own Bay PCN 29th Aug 16 at 12:15 AM
    Hi all, this is my first post here!
    I parked my vehicle in unallocated parking space in my blocks of apartment where this Parking & Property Management company has issued me a PCN for not displaying permits which is absolutely frustrating. Apparently they are running scamming scheme of displaying permits under lights of signage. As per my renting lease, I can park in any allocated space and other details on parking are silent.

    After reading a lot of forums and threads I appealed against my PCN directly to above parking management company but got rejected. They sent me a reminder notice along with standard photographs after some time which I ignored.

    I have now received a Letter before Claim from Gladstones Solicitors on 16th Aug seeking response within 14 days. I did try to attache the letter but not allowed to post link as this is my first post. Is there any other way I can share my LBC here?

    A detailed thread from LazyDaisy was quite useful but after doing some research I found that Regulations have changed for Practice Direction. Not sure if I can still use their template based on same principles.
    Many thanks for any suggestion or advise you can offer.
    Last edited by steady.alone; 29-08-2016 at 12:21 AM.
Page 1
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 29th Aug 16, 12:17 AM
    • 40,408 Posts
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    Coupon-mad
    • #2
    • 29th Aug 16, 12:17 AM
    • #2
    • 29th Aug 16, 12:17 AM
    Have a look at other Gladstones 'Letter before Claim' threads, by searching the forum for the single word 'Gladstones'. That will help you.

    You can show pics by changing the URL 'http' to hxxp.
    PRIVATE PCN in England/Wales? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT

    Click on the breadcrumb trail, top of page: Household & Travel > Motoring > Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking & READ THE 'NEWBIES' FAQS THREAD.
    DON'T read old advice to ignore, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • The Deep
    • By The Deep 29th Aug 16, 7:30 AM
    • 5,561 Posts
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    The Deep
    • #3
    • 29th Aug 16, 7:30 AM
    • #3
    • 29th Aug 16, 7:30 AM
    . As per my renting lease, I can park in any allocated space and other details on parking are silent.


    Are you sure that, you can park in any allocated space, even one allocated to a neighbour?


    To post a document here, post it to photobucket or similar, and post a dead link here, i.e. instead of http at the start alter it to hxxp and someone will correct it.


    You are not alone, there has been a storm of these claims from some very dodgy law firms recently, read threads with BW Law, SCS, Wright Hassell and Gladstones in the title.
    • steady.alone
    • By steady.alone 29th Aug 16, 10:17 AM
    • 14 Posts
    • 8 Thanks
    steady.alone
    • #4
    • 29th Aug 16, 10:17 AM
    • #4
    • 29th Aug 16, 10:17 AM
    Thank you for your replies.

    My apologies, I meant " I can park in any Unallocated space". which I exactly did.

    Here is the Letter before claim [IMG]hxxp://i67.tinypic.com/2ptrtpt.jpg[/IMG]

    i have read so many threads and forums and I am surprised to see many of these scamming companies conning innocent residents, this has become a massive industry in it own.

    I just wondered if they can proceed this matter to the court?
    • bod1467
    • By bod1467 29th Aug 16, 12:06 PM
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    bod1467
    • #5
    • 29th Aug 16, 12:06 PM
    • #5
    • 29th Aug 16, 12:06 PM
    No need for IMG tags. In fact I'd actively discourage using them.

    I can't access tinypic here at work, but here's a clickable link.

    http://i67.tinypic.com/2ptrtpt.jpg
    • Marktheshark
    • By Marktheshark 29th Aug 16, 12:33 PM
    • 5,317 Posts
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    Marktheshark
    • #6
    • 29th Aug 16, 12:33 PM
    • #6
    • 29th Aug 16, 12:33 PM
    Arguing practice directives will not work.
    Reply to the management company as principle to agent with a rebuttal stating your rental lease supersedes any contract formed in your absence with a third party.
    Make it clear you will be counter claiming the alleged loss and your expenses from the management company as they have failed to mitigate the loss.

    Send them that, then start building a robust defence and await court papers.
    Brexit will become whatever they invent it to be.
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 29th Aug 16, 1:58 PM
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    Coupon-mad
    • #7
    • 29th Aug 16, 1:58 PM
    • #7
    • 29th Aug 16, 1:58 PM
    Here is a P&PM thread from pepipoo which is ahead of yours and I posted a defence draft there in Buzz2000's thread (I post as SchoolRunMum on pepipoo):

    http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?showtopic=98803

    I realise you are not at that stage yet but the thread should help as he's ahead of you and the thread was started when he first got the PCN over a year ago, and also covers LBC stage. You need to be aware this is likely to proceed but that Gladstones cases are normally full of holes and defendable on various points, as you can see.
    PRIVATE PCN in England/Wales? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT

    Click on the breadcrumb trail, top of page: Household & Travel > Motoring > Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking & READ THE 'NEWBIES' FAQS THREAD.
    DON'T read old advice to ignore, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • steady.alone
    • By steady.alone 29th Aug 16, 11:49 PM
    • 14 Posts
    • 8 Thanks
    steady.alone
    • #8
    • 29th Aug 16, 11:49 PM
    Hi, thank you so much for you replies.
    • #8
    • 29th Aug 16, 11:49 PM
    Here is a P&PM thread from pepipoo which is ahead of yours and I posted a defence draft there in Buzz2000's thread (I post as SchoolRunMum on pepipoo):

    hxxp://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?showtopic=98803

    I realise you are not at that stage yet but the thread should help as he's ahead of you and the thread was started when he first got the PCN over a year ago, and also covers LBC stage. You need to be aware this is likely to proceed but that Gladstones cases are normally full of holes and defendable on various points, as you can see.
    Originally posted by Coupon-mad
    That's a very useful thread with lot of insight which I can correlate my case to it. The only difference is that I have not replied to their NTK letter. Now, even I am feeling that they will proceed with this case further. I am preparing an acknowledgement for their Letter Before Claim which I believe is advantageous to defend, as I read in other MSE threads?

    Also, as suggested I will write to the management company as well to push thier agent to cancel my ticket.

    If I am missing anything else at this stage then please point out. Many thanks once again.
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 30th Aug 16, 1:09 AM
    • 40,408 Posts
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    Coupon-mad
    • #9
    • 30th Aug 16, 1:09 AM
    • #9
    • 30th Aug 16, 1:09 AM
    Sounds like you have got a handle on what to do. And yes, it is defendable.
    PRIVATE PCN in England/Wales? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT

    Click on the breadcrumb trail, top of page: Household & Travel > Motoring > Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking & READ THE 'NEWBIES' FAQS THREAD.
    DON'T read old advice to ignore, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • steady.alone
    • By steady.alone 30th Aug 16, 1:27 PM
    • 14 Posts
    • 8 Thanks
    steady.alone
    Thank you for boosting my confidence. I hope it all works in the end


    After reading some other useful threads on MSE and Pepipoo, I have made a draft to respond their LBC. Would you be please kind enough to have a quick glance and suggest if anything misleading or missing in this draft.




    Dear Sirs,

    Thank you for your above letter which I acknowledge the receipt of it as a Registered Keeper of the vehicle in question.

    Since your Letter Before Claim refers to Practice Direction, I trust that you are obviously aware of what is required and I expect you to comply with your obligations.

    I would like to bring this to your attention that your client is fully aware that:
    • It failed to meet the requirements of the Protection of Freedom Act
    • We have no liability for this parking notice
    Kindly send me a fully compliant Letter Before Claim providing below information, so that I can deal with my own obligations under the Practice Direction.
    • A copy of your clients written contract as per Practice Direction 16 7.3(1) and Practice Direction 7C 1.4(3A) and the IPC’s Code of Practice B1.1
    • In what way, your client believes a contract (which is denied) was breached.
    • Time stamped photos of the event showing the alleged incident where the car was supposedly in breach. These would be the ones that the DVLA require their client to keep under the terms of their KADOE contract with the DVLA to show “reasonable cause”. Regulation 27 (1) of the Road Vehicles (Registration & Licensing) Regulation 2002 refers.
    I look forward to receiving above requested along with acknowledgement of receipt of this letter.

    Yours Sincerely
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 30th Aug 16, 1:33 PM
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    Coupon-mad
    I always say, no 'thank you for' to a LBCCC!

    Start: 'I refer to'.

    and it is the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (Schedule 4).

    Apart from that, yes that will do - but expect a court claim in the end as Gladstones machine continues regardless, with no scrutiny of details or any real heed to victims' replies.
    PRIVATE PCN in England/Wales? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT

    Click on the breadcrumb trail, top of page: Household & Travel > Motoring > Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking & READ THE 'NEWBIES' FAQS THREAD.
    DON'T read old advice to ignore, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • steady.alone
    • By steady.alone 30th Aug 16, 2:07 PM
    • 14 Posts
    • 8 Thanks
    steady.alone
    Thank you for so much for your suggestion. Yes I got to see so many proceedings from Gladstones recently on so many MSE & Pepipoo threads and I wonder how they are even recovering their costs. I believe more the scams more the money for these people.
    • bod1467
    • By bod1467 30th Aug 16, 2:11 PM
    • 14,806 Posts
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    bod1467
    Gladstones are making a pretty penny with this ... it is their clients who are stumping up, whether they win court claims or not.

    What confounds many of us is ... how have these PPCs failed to cotton on that they're being taken for mugs by Gladstones?
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 30th Aug 16, 6:22 PM
    • 40,408 Posts
    • 52,292 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    Thank you for so much for your suggestion. Yes I got to see so many proceedings from Gladstones recently on so many MSE & Pepipoo threads and I wonder how they are even recovering their costs. I believe more the scams more the money for these people.
    Originally posted by steady.alone
    The Parking Prankster would agree with you, have you read his many Blogs about it? Here are a few from this Spring/Summer:

    http://parking-prankster.blogspot.co.uk/2016/06/hopeless-solicitors-gladstones-bungle.html

    http://parking-prankster.blogspot.co.uk/2016/05/gladstones-solicitors-bungle-case.html

    http://parking-prankster.blogspot.co.uk/2016/04/pcm-uk-signage-does-not-create-contract.html

    http://parking-prankster.blogspot.co.uk/2016/02/gladstone-solicitors-score-triple-whammy.html

    PRIVATE PCN in England/Wales? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT

    Click on the breadcrumb trail, top of page: Household & Travel > Motoring > Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking & READ THE 'NEWBIES' FAQS THREAD.
    DON'T read old advice to ignore, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • steady.alone
    • By steady.alone 19th Sep 16, 7:32 PM
    • 14 Posts
    • 8 Thanks
    steady.alone
    Thanks for sharing these great blogs, I cant believe how this industry is getting bigger n bigger each year.

    I found this post in telegraph the other day.
    hxxp://telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/09/15/drivers-fined-110-for-parking-on-their-own-driveways
    • steady.alone
    • By steady.alone 19th Sep 16, 8:09 PM
    • 14 Posts
    • 8 Thanks
    steady.alone
    Guess what, surprisingly I have received an email (not letter) in response to my LBC acknowledgment letter posted earlier, saying their
    -Letter before claim is fully compliant with the Practice direction and they will not issue another.
    - Client has previously sent me the details of the charges. (No copy of written contract is provided as yet)
    - Time stamped photos attached in their email.

    Final line says " You have 7 days from date of email to pay £150 in full Or a claim will be issued against you without further notice"

    I am thinking of replying to their email as they have not provided their clients written contracts (as we knew), should I or not?
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 19th Sep 16, 8:12 PM
    • 40,408 Posts
    • 52,292 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    Always reply to a Solicitor letter about a Parking charge, don't leave the ball in their court.
    PRIVATE PCN in England/Wales? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT

    Click on the breadcrumb trail, top of page: Household & Travel > Motoring > Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking & READ THE 'NEWBIES' FAQS THREAD.
    DON'T read old advice to ignore, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • steady.alone
    • By steady.alone 19th Sep 16, 8:47 PM
    • 14 Posts
    • 8 Thanks
    steady.alone
    As long as the ball remains outside the court I will be happy

    Yes I will. I hope below will do for now and keep the ball rolling, any additional suggestion will be highly appreciated.

    Asking for clients written contract copy again and reminding them again about my unfettered 'Right to Park' in any unallocated space as per lease agreement.

    Many thanks
    • steady.alone
    • By steady.alone 18th Oct 16, 10:05 PM
    • 14 Posts
    • 8 Thanks
    steady.alone
    Hello friends
    As Gladstones meter is still counting I have received a County Court Claim letter dated 11th Oct 2016 which I have acknowledged online today on 18th Oct. The MCOL shows below status so I am hoping it is now submitted I am now doing some further research on the good defence.

    Claim History
    A claim was issued against you on 11/10/2016
    Your acknowledgment of service was submitted on 18/10/2016 at 21:20:44


    Am I supposed to start a new thread here as I received the court papers or continue using this thread?
    • Ralph-y
    • By Ralph-y 18th Oct 16, 10:31 PM
    • 2,241 Posts
    • 2,724 Thanks
    Ralph-y
    please keep it all in this thread ....

    Ralph
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