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Gumtree fraud & HSBC bank accounts
titan318
Posts: 2 Newbie
I was recently a victim of a Gumtree scam which involved me paying for (what I thought was) genuine goods via Internet banking transfer. The item never showed up and after a lot of exhaustive research I have recently found out the seller is a fraudster who has done this multiple times and is continuing to do it. Reported him to Gumtree and they simply gave me an email address to pass on to police.
I am with HSBC and their assistance so far has been minimal. They have distanced themselves from the issue because I made the payment willingly (understandable). The problem I am having though is with their assistance with trying to get the money back. They have traced the money for me, but all this provided me with was the bank account details of the person (which I already knew, as I made the payment). I was also promised the persons name and address but then told in a later call when I chased this up that this absolutely would not be possible (but they certainly did offer it, rightly or wrongly).
What are my next steps? HSBC have told me I have to take it up with the fraudsters bank (Lloyds TSB) but Lloyds have quite rightly said they cannot really help me because of data protection. Lloyds have been brilliant about this and have registered on their system that the account holder may be committing fraud. They also said if I was with them, they would get the money back asap.
I am going to call HSBC and report this as a fraud case, beforehand it was just dealt with as a wayward payment. I don't feel that they really care.
Does anyone have advice on what I should be doing / saying in order to get this recognised as the crime it is? HSBC seem to be doing very little and basically have said 'tough luck' to almost £500 which is a lot of money for me. It was an investment in a new home-business but now I have nothing to show for it.
I have reported the incident on the Action Fraud website which has given me a crime reference number. I am waiting to hear back from local police about the matter. What else should I be doing?
And yes, I know it was incredibly stupid! It seemed very genuine and I have bought/sold thousands of items online so I didn't think much of it at the time. Lesson certainly learned.
I am with HSBC and their assistance so far has been minimal. They have distanced themselves from the issue because I made the payment willingly (understandable). The problem I am having though is with their assistance with trying to get the money back. They have traced the money for me, but all this provided me with was the bank account details of the person (which I already knew, as I made the payment). I was also promised the persons name and address but then told in a later call when I chased this up that this absolutely would not be possible (but they certainly did offer it, rightly or wrongly).
What are my next steps? HSBC have told me I have to take it up with the fraudsters bank (Lloyds TSB) but Lloyds have quite rightly said they cannot really help me because of data protection. Lloyds have been brilliant about this and have registered on their system that the account holder may be committing fraud. They also said if I was with them, they would get the money back asap.
I am going to call HSBC and report this as a fraud case, beforehand it was just dealt with as a wayward payment. I don't feel that they really care.
Does anyone have advice on what I should be doing / saying in order to get this recognised as the crime it is? HSBC seem to be doing very little and basically have said 'tough luck' to almost £500 which is a lot of money for me. It was an investment in a new home-business but now I have nothing to show for it.
I have reported the incident on the Action Fraud website which has given me a crime reference number. I am waiting to hear back from local police about the matter. What else should I be doing?
And yes, I know it was incredibly stupid! It seemed very genuine and I have bought/sold thousands of items online so I didn't think much of it at the time. Lesson certainly learned.
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Comments
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Whoever promised you the receiving account-holders details was wrong. The Data protection that prevents Lloyds TSB from giving you the details, will prevent them from being given to HSBC. Only the police can take this any further. You have no comeback whatsoever against HSBC, even if you report it to them as fraud. There is very little a bank can do when you willingly make a transaction.0
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This is a matter for the police: they are the only people who can get the name and address from Lloyds. I suggest you go and visit your local police station and see if you can persuade them to take action. Your research (revealing that the person has done this many times) should be helpful in persuading the police that this is a crime rather than simply a civil matter.
And I think that HSBC have handled this as well as the law allows.0 -
Thank you for your replies. Very useful. I was very surprised when someone on the telephone said I would be provided with a name and address so it's not surprising that this didn't happen due to data protection.
I have visited HSBC in-branch and they are set up a meeting to discuss the fraud, however I don't know what more they can do.
I have reported it to the police and I am waiting to hear back from them with what happens next. Sadly I know the address the fraudster provided is not real, so I cannot submit this to small claims court as I don't have a real address. Hopefully the police will be able to find out some more information.0 -
There is nothing HSBC can do to assist, meeting or not.
If you had withdrawn the cash and given it to the fraudster, it would have had the same end effect. They have as much responsibility for what money you transfer elsewhere is for as they do for what you use money you draw out in cash for.
The police are your way forward. Also, be bloody careful on Gumtree, that site is a hive of scam artists in my experience.urs sinserly,
~~joosy jeezus~~0 -
Gumtree = fraudsters paradise....0
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I have to agree with BugsyBrowne - there is no way you will get your money back.
Sorry to be the bearer of bad news - help the police with their enquiries and move on.0 -
I sympathise, but I have to agree - making a BACS transfer to a third party is as good as giving them cash. If there is a problem, there is no way the bank can do a reversal, which is why Paypal (despite its flaws) does offer an element of protection.
As others have pointed out, only the police can proceed with this, however it would be wrong to think that they will get your money back. All they can do is investigate whether this is a one-off or an ongoing scam. Whilst you are certainly informing them of this, if there is not a history of large-scale fraud, the CPS will not have the resources to take this further. In neither case will the involvement of these parties result in you getting your money back unless the miscreant decides to do it (or the court requires him to make a refund). I think you can appreciate that the account is probably regularly emptied, and as such there will be no funds to earmark.
Sorry to be so depressing, but there is really nothing else you can do that you haven't done already. The time for due dilligence is BEFORE you pass any money over, and if a scam, then the price needed to be unrealistic to attract a potential buyer - and the result was you were hooked.
You've learned a lot with this - but unless you are dealing with a bona fide trader, and bring in payment method(s) that will prodect you in case of fraud, this problem will just keep on hapenning.0
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