How to find out from charity if a freelancer got paid for 'voluntary' work I did?

SpaceisthePlace · 2 October 2017 at 5:08PM

My mum has a saying............just because she has retired does not mean her time in not valuable and she has nothing better to do than other family members chores.

Good one! I quite agree.

Comms69 · 2 October 2017 at 5:12PM

SpaceisthePlace wrote: »

But I wasn't fully informed before I agreed. So my agreement means nothing. I wouldn't have done the project if I'd been told the freelancer had already been paid to do it. It's not a situation I'm comfortable with, doing work that someone else will be paid for. I would've used that time to do something else.

I understand that him being paid only may have happened. That's why my original post was about how to find out if my suspicions are correct.

But you were in team meetings where the subject was brought up a number of times?

Stop volunteering if your time comes with conditions.

nicechap · 2 October 2017 at 5:12PM

SpaceisthePlace wrote: »

Literally the whole point of my entire OP was how do I get evidence for my suspicions. I've been completely upfront about the fact that these are just suspicions, and that I don't have proof, and that I would like to get proof.

I've been very clear that what I want out of this situation is to know what really happened. And then IF what I think happened did happen, go from there.

As has been said on page 1, you're not entitled to get evidence. You are not the police nor an auditor.

You can ask, which you appear to have done, and not got the answer you wanted.

That's where the road ends unless you want to make accusations that could end up backfiring on you.

SpaceisthePlace · 2 October 2017 at 5:15PM

you're assuming they won't try to get their money back. at my workplace, we have freelancers for certain things. a lot of the time we do pay them in advance, especially if it's near the end of the budget and we have a surplus to spend. we ask them to submit their invoice early, as we would like to use that surplus, even if the work is then completed later in the year. if they don't complete that work, we would issue them with a bill for works not completed. this could well be the case. but you're only a volunteer and you do not have any right to their financials to know what is going on.

Good points. I think that was why he was paid in advance - budget surplus at the end of the tax year. I truly hope they did issue him with a bill for works not completed. But I suspect not, as the work was completed, just not by him, and I have no idea whether the financial team are aware of that. Plus the manager made comments that strongly suggested otherwise.

Thanks for the information though, it's useful.

nicechap · 2 October 2017 at 5:19PM

SpaceisthePlace wrote: »

I know for a fact that he hadn't done it beforehand. There were several team meetings with him present where the project was discussed and the fact it hadn't been done was talked about. He had plenty of chances to say 'hey I've done this already' but didn't. The nature of the work means he couldn't have done it while on holiday. I was asked to do it because it hadn't been done.

SpaceisthePlace wrote: »

But I wasn't fully informed before I agreed. So my agreement means nothing. I wouldn't have done the project if I'd been told the freelancer had already been paid to do it. It's not a situation I'm comfortable with, doing work that someone else will be paid for. I would've used that time to do something else.

I understand that him being paid only may have happened. That's why my original post was about how to find out if my suspicions are correct.

So you were privy to meetings where the paid Freelancer hadn't done the work (it would be strange if the person responsible for delivering the project wasn't minuted as being), yet you then went on & did it?

SpaceisthePlace · 2 October 2017 at 5:24PM

As has been said on page 1, you're not entitled to get evidence. You are not the police nor an auditor.

You can ask, which you appear to have done, and not got the answer you wanted.

That's where the road ends unless you want to make accusations that could end up backfiring on you.

My comment was a response to your comments that I am jumping to conclusions without evidence. I pointed out that I would like to get evidence. I would never make accusations without evidence to back myself up. Hence my OP.

However I know now that I am not entitled to see invoices to prove my suspicions. I fully accept that.

SpaceisthePlace · 2 October 2017 at 5:31PM

So you were privy to meetings where the paid Freelancer hadn't done the work (it would be strange if the person responsible for delivering the project wasn't minuted as being), yet you then went on & did it?

At the time of the meetings I wasn't aware he had been paid in advance. Nobody disclosed this information.

Usually freelancers invoice after work done. I assumed that as he didn't do the work, he wouldn't be invoicing or being paid. However later on, after I had completed the project, the manager told me it had been paid for in advance, but didn't specify whether that payment included paying the freelancer or was just for equipment etc (although I don't see why it wouldn't, usually a project cost would include freelance worker hours). Hence my original post about wanting to get clarity on the issue.

nicechap · 2 October 2017 at 5:46PM

SpaceisthePlace wrote: »

At the time of the meetings I wasn't aware he had been paid in advance. Nobody disclosed this information.

Usually freelancers invoice after work done. I assumed that as he didn't do the work, he wouldn't be invoicing or being paid. However later on, after I had completed the project, the manager told me it had been paid for in advance, but didn't specify whether that payment included paying the freelancer or was just for equipment etc (although I don't see why it wouldn't, usually a project cost would include freelance worker hours). Hence my original post about wanting to get clarity on the issue.

See how easy it was for me to draw wrong conclusions when I didn't have the full information? But I'm guessing it was known he was a PAID freelancer and was responsible for delivery?

Maybe think about whether you are doing the same.

Instead take pride in your delivery of the project to timescale for the benefit of the charity. And move on.

SpaceisthePlace · 2 October 2017 at 6:14PM

See how easy it was for me to draw wrong conclusions when I didn't have the full information? But I'm guessing it was known he was a PAID freelancer and was responsible for delivery?

Maybe think about whether you are doing the same.

Instead take pride in your delivery of the project to timescale for the benefit of the charity. And move on.

It was known that he works for the charity doing various projects on a paid freelance basis. However, like I said, usually freelancers invoice after work done. Not before. No work, no pay. At least that's how it usually works. I'm not sure how I would have been expected to know without being told that on this one occasion, he'd been paid in advance.

As I've said several times, I'm not jumping to conclusions, I've been very clear that I want the full information. This was the exact reason for my OP. But I'm just repeating myself now and wasting my time. Have a nice evening.

SpaceisthePlace · 2 October 2017 at 6:21PM

I'm signing out now and won't be logging back on to this thread.

I feel like I've got an unequivocal answer to my original question, and that now the thread is just descending into quibbles over details about the specific situation. I anticipate that it will all just end up in circular arguments and we've all got better things to do.

Thank you to everyone who wrote kind, polite, constructive comments.

How to find out from charity if a freelancer got paid for 'voluntary' work I did?

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