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Euro Car Parks - POPLA appeal help

Hello all,

Long time lurker here and I was hoping to get some advice on how to appeal a PCN from Euro Car Parks.

As a background, the car park in question has ANPR and it clocked my car entering the car park at 13:01 and leaving at 13:17 with no valid pay and display or permit purchased during this time.
I used their website to dispute the charge stating that the signs were not clear and that the fee in question is excessive for the time the car was in the car park which they have rejected and provided a POPLA reference number for me to appeal if I wish. They provided clear pictures of the signs but I cannot see any mention of grace periods.

I used the template from the sticky in this forum to appeal to Euro car parks and I was wondering if there have been any successful cases like mine that went to POPLA appeal? Additionally is there anything elss I should include in my appeal to POPLA (maybe something about a grace period?).

This is the first time I have received a charge like this and I would greatly appreciate any help that anyone can provide.

Many thanks.
«1

Comments

  • pappa_golf
    pappa_golf Posts: 8,895 Forumite
    Combo Breaker First Post
    the car park in question has ANPR and it clocked my car entering the car park at 13:01 and leaving at 13:17 with no valid pay and display or permit purchased during this time.


    time entering and leaving a car park , is NOT time parked , the cameras are at the entrance not at the parking space.


    ECP seem to have forgotten the words in the BPA code of practice , the words are "grace" periods , ie: time to enter , to read , to accept terms and conditions and decide if you with to stay or go.




    you have made one appeal to them , you cannot now use the forum template , and have 2 "dibs"


    await a POPLA code , and write a POPLa appeal , stating obvious things but including the fact that you chose not to enter into their terms and conditions and left the site
    Save a Rachael

    buy a share in crapita
  • Kc88
    Kc88 Posts: 9 Forumite
    Thanks Pappa Golf, I do have a POPLA code now, so would the grounds of the grace period be enough for the charge to be rescinded?
  • Coupon-mad
    Coupon-mad Posts: 131,614 Forumite
    Name Dropper First Post Photogenic First Anniversary
    edited 30 May 2016 at 9:53PM
    Kc88 wrote: »
    I do have a POPLA code now, so would the grounds of the grace period be enough for the charge to be rescinded?

    No, not on its own.
    I was wondering if there have been any successful cases like mine that went to POPLA appeal?

    EVERY Euro Car Parks case on here has been won at POPLA or earlier.

    You just need to search 'Euro POPLA' and copy from a recent one (March 2016 onwards, no older) and show us your draft which needs to include unseen/unreadable signs and no landowner authority - and of course, no keeper liability due the the flaws in the NTK (which a recent example ECP POPLA appeal will have. Keep looking at your search results till you find one which covers the ECP flaws in their NTKs).
    PRIVATE 'PCN'? DON'T PAY BUT DON'T IGNORE IT (except N.Ireland).
    CLICK at the top of this/any page where it says:
    Forum Home»Motoring»Parking Tickets Fines & Parking - read the NEWBIES THREAD
  • Kc88
    Kc88 Posts: 9 Forumite
    Thank you, I have drafted my POPLA appeal, drawing on past examples (admittedly copied a lot from you Coupon-mad! Can someone please check over this to see if there is anything else I should include? Do I also need to provide a copy of my NTK on the POPLA appeal?
    Many thanks
    Vehicle Registration Number MYCAR
    PCN Reference MYPCN
    POPLACODE: MYPOPLACODE
    Issued by Euro Car Parks Limited


    As the registered keeper of the above vehicle, I wish to appeal the parking charge notice Euro Car Parks issued against it. I would like to have the parking charge notice cancelled based on the following grounds:


    1) Keeper Liability not established - The Notice to Keeper is not compliant with the POFA 2012
    2) No Landowner Authority
    3) BPA Code of Practice - non-compliance
    4) The minimum grace period was not allowed by the operator
    5) The ANPR system is neither reliable nor accurate.



    1) Keeper Liability not established - The Notice to Keeper is not compliant with the POFA 2012

    Although Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (“POFA”) gives a creditor the right to recover any unpaid parking charges from a vehicle’s keeper, this right is strictly subject to statutory conditions being met by the operator, without which the right to 'keeper liability' does not exist.

    I set out below a non-exhaustive list of reasons why Euro Car Parks’ Notice to Keeper failed to comply with Schedule 4 of POFA:

    (i) Contrary to the requirements of Paragraph 9(2)(a), the Notice to Keeper did not 'specify the period of parking' to which it related. It merely provided the dates and times when the vehicle allegedly entered and exited the car park; these times do not equate to any single evidenced period of parking. There is no evidence of a period of parking and this cannot reasonably be assumed on the balance of probabilities.


    (ii) Contrary to the requirements of Paragraph 9(2)(b), the Notice to Keeper did not inform the keeper that the driver is required to pay parking charges in respect of the specified period of parking and that the parking charges have not been paid in full;

    BOTH the above prescribed requirements must be stated in the NTK and they were not.


    (iii) Contrary to the requirements of Paragraph 9(2)(e), the Notice to Keeper did not state that the creditor does not know both the name of the driver and a current address for service for the driver and invite the keeper: ... to pay the unpaid parking charges; or ... if the keeper was not the driver of the vehicle, to notify the creditor of the name of the driver and a current address for service for the driver and to pass the notice on to the driver;

    The NTK fails to include all of the above wording, as prescribed under the statute.


    (iv) Contrary to the requirements of Paragraph 9(2)(f), this NTK fails in the prescribed requirement - in exact words and with the correct deadline - to:

    ''warn the keeper that if, after the period of 28 days beginning with the day after that on which the notice is given— ...the amount of the unpaid parking charges specified under paragraph (d) has not been paid in full, and...the creditor does not know both the name of the driver and a current address for service for the driver, the creditor will (if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met) have the right to recover from the keeper so much of that amount as remains unpaid;''


    (v) Contrary to the requirements of Paragraph 9(2)(h), the Notice to Keeper does not identify the creditor and specify how and to whom payment or notification to the creditor may be made;


    (vi) Contrary to the requirements of Paragraph 9(2)(i) the Notice to Keeper does not specify the date on which the notice is sent (where it is sent by post) or given (in any other case).

    A date of preparing or batching of NTKs ready for mailing later by iMail is often stated by BPA AOS members, misleadingly, as a 'date of issue' or similar. This fails the requirement to state the date SENT or GIVEN, neither of which are defined as the date the document was drawn up by back office staff, several days before iMail actually put the NTK in the post via Royal Mail.

    Consequently, Euro Car Parks has forfeited its right to recover any unpaid parking charges from the keeper of the vehicle.

    If Euro Car Parks should try to suggest that there is any method outwith the prescribed statute (POFA 2012) whereby a registered keeper can be held liable for a charge where a driver is not identified, I would remind them of the words of Mr Henry Greenslade, the 2015 POPLA Chief Adjudicator who ensured consistency of decisions since 2012, whereby POPLA never found against a registered keeper where a clearly non-POFA Notice to Keeper was served, as in this case.

    The Lead Adjudicator reminded operators (and his team of Assessors, in their training) of the following facts about a keeper's right not to name the driver and, of course, still not be lawfully able to be held liable, under Schedule 4:

    URLLINK|transportxtra.com/publications/parking-review/news/46154/there-is-no-50-50-rule-for-private-parking-appeals-says-popla-s-michael-greenslade|URLLINK

    Understanding keeper liability
    “There appears to be continuing misunderstanding about Schedule 4. Provided certain conditions are strictly complied with, it provides for recovery of unpaid parking charges from the keeper of the vehicle.

    There is no ‘reasonable presumption’ in law that the registered keeper of a vehicle is the driver. Operators should never suggest anything of the sort. Further, a failure by the recipient of a notice issued under Schedule 4 to name the driver, does not of itself mean that the recipient has accepted that they were the driver at the material time. Unlike, for example, a Notice of Intended Prosecution where details of the driver of a vehicle must be supplied when requested by the police, pursuant to Section 172 of the Road Traffic Act 1988, a keeper sent a Schedule 4 notice has no legal obligation to name the driver.”

    The wording in the Protection of Freedoms Act (POFA) 2012 is as follows:

    ''Right to claim unpaid parking charges from keeper of vehicle: 4(1) The creditor has the right to recover any unpaid parking charges from the keeper of the vehicle. (2) The right under this paragraph applies only if—

    (a) the conditions specified in paragraphs 5, 6*, 11 and 12 (so far as applicable) are met;


    *Conditions that must be met for purposes of paragraph 4:
    6(1) ''The second condition is that the creditor (or a person acting for or on behalf of the creditor)— (b) has given a notice to keeper in accordance with paragraph 9.''

    The operator has failed to meet the second condition for keeper liability due to the multiple flaws in the NTK. Therefore, no lawful right exists to claim unpaid parking charges from myself as keeper of the vehicle as they have not met the required conditions within Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act (POFA) 2012.

    This too was confirmed by Mr Greenslade, POPLA Lead Adjudicator. in page 8 of the 2015 POPLA Report:

    ''If {POFA 2012 Schedule 4 is} not complied with then keeper liability does not generally pass.''




    2) No landowner Authority:

    I question Euro Car Parks Limited’s authority from the landowner, to enforce parking charges regarding alleged breaches at this car park.

    BPA CoP paragraphs 7.1 & 7.2 dictate some of the required contract wording. I put Euro Car Parks Limited to strict proof of the contract terms with the actual landowner (not a lessee or agent who has no more title than the operator). I question Euro Car Parks Limited’s legal status to enforce this charge because there is no assignment of rights to pursue PCNs in the courts in neither their own name nor standing to form contracts with drivers themselves.

    They do not own this car park and appear (at best) to have a bare licence to put signs up and ‘ticket’ vehicles on site, merely acting as agents on behalf of a principal. No evidence has been supplied lawfully showing that Euro Car Parks Limited is entitled to pursue these charges in their own right in the courts which is a strict requirement within the BPA CoP. I suggest that Euro Car Parks Limited are certainly not empowered by the landowner to sue customers and visitors in a free of charge enormous car park and that issuing 'PCNs' by post is no evidence of any right to actually pursue charges in court.

    In addition, Section 7.3 of the CoP states:

    “The written authorization must also set out:

    a) the definition of the land on which you may operate, so that the boundaries of the land can be clearly defined
    b) Any conditions or restrictions on parking control and enforcement operations, including any restrictions on hours of operation
    c) Any conditions or restrictions on the types of vehicles that may, or may not, be subject to parking control and enforcement
    d) Who has the responsibility for putting up and maintaining signs
    e) The definition of the services provided by each party to the agreement.''

    I put Euro Car Parks Limited to strict proof of compliance with all of the above requirements.

    This is vital, especially in view of the signs where it is clear on close scrutiny, is that someone (identity not established and I ask the operator for evidence in this regard) has changed the time limit to 4.5 hours at some point. So, I contend that the contract - if this operator produces one - does not reflect the altered signage and if only a basic agreement or 'witness statement' is produced, then this will fail to demonstrate compliance with 7.3 (in particular, point b and d, above).

    It is eminently possible that the contract states only the original free parking period (whatever that was) and therefore a sticker over a sign is unsupported by the will of the landowner in any contract. This would destroy any attempt by this operator to argue there is a Beavis-case-style 'legitimate interest' backed by any commercial justification and wishes of the landowner to sue customers after just 4.5 hours in a car park where they have only allowed this agent to issue PCNs after a completely different period.

    I require Euro Car Parks Limited to provide a full copy of the contemporaneous, signed & dated contract with the landowner showing evidence to meet 7.3 of the CoP. In order to comply, a non-landowner private parking company must have a specifically-worded contract with the landowner – not merely an ‘agreement’ with a non-landholder managing agent – otherwise there is no authority.



    3) BPA Code of Practice - further non-compliance - photo evidence.

    The BPA Code of Practice point 20.5a stipulates that:

    "When issuing a parking charge notice you may use photographs as evidence that a vehicle was parked in an unauthorized way. The photographs must refer to and confirm the incident which you claim was unauthorized. A date and time stamp should be included on the photograph. All photographs used for evidence should be clear and legible and must not be retouched or digitally altered."

    The parking charge notice in question contains two photographs of the vehicle number plate. Neither of these images contains a date and time stamp on the photographs nor do they clearly identify the vehicle entering or leaving this car park (which is also not identifiable in the photos as any particular location at all).

    The time and date stamp has been inserted into the letter underneath (but not part of) the photographs. The images have also been cropped to only display the number plate. As these are not the original images, I require Euro Car Parks Limited to produce evidence of the original "un-cropped" images containing the required date and time stamp and to evidence where the photographs show the car to be when there is a lack of any marker or sign to indisputably relate these photos to the location stated.



    4) The minimum grace period was not allowed by the Operator
    British Parking Association Code of Practice 13.1 – 13.4 states:
    13 Grace periods
    13.1 Your approach to parking management must allow a
    driver who enters your car park but decides not to park,
    to leave the car park within a reasonable period without
    having their vehicle issued with a parking charge notice.
    13.2 You should allow the driver a reasonable ‘grace period’
    in which to decide if they are going to stay or go. If the
    driver is on your land without permission you should still
    allow them a grace period to read your signs and leave
    before you take enforcement action.
    13.3 You should be prepared to tell us the specific grace period
    at a site if our compliance team or our agents ask what it is.
    13.4 You should allow the driver a reasonable period to leave the
    private car park after the parking contract has ended, before
    you take enforcement action. If the location is one where
    parking is normally permitted, the Grace Period at the end
    of the parking period should be a minimum of 10 minutes.
    Also, under the BPA Approved Operator Scheme Code of Practice Version 6, Oct 2015, states that if drivers
    "…decide not to park but choose to leave the car park, you must provide them with reasonable grace period to leave, as they will not be bound by your parking contract." (18.5).

    And that when using Automatic Number Plate Recognition (ANPR),
    "…your system must allow drivers who have not paid the fee to leave a site within a reasonable period that allows for the conditions and environment of that parking site. This grace period should be long enough to allow motorists to leave without having their vehicle registration mark processed for a parking charge." (30.2)

    The above states that a time no less than 20 minutes should be allowed for first, entry and consideration of the contract, and second, leaving the property. The times stated on the NTK show only the time of entry and exit (13:01 and 13:07 respectively). These do not indicate the time in which the vehicle parked. The charges laid out in the signage are only for the time that the vehicle was parked. The times stated on the NTK, however, are clear evidence that the vehicle entered the car park and left again within the grace period specified by the BPA CoP to protect consumers in the time that they need to find a parking space, consider the contract, and leave the car park again.

    In this case, the 16 minutes was used to find a parking space, consider the terms of the contract, and decline the offer. The mention of a minimum of 10 minutes is exactly this, a minimum. The time needed to complete all these actions are dependent on a number of wildly varying factors, including traffic, lighting and parking conditions, driver’s eyesight and driving ability and mental faculties. For this reason, a minimum amount is specified, but the maximum time allowed for these tasks to be completed are not. Further to this, the signage makes no indication of how long a driver may be on the site before a parking penalty will be charged. This leaves the driver uncertain to the terms of the contract, which means that there was no full acceptance of the contract to be breached.



    5) The ANPR system is neither reliable nor accurate.

    Euro Car Parks’ evidence shows no parking time, merely photos of a car driving in and out. It is unreasonable for this operator to record the start of 'parking time' as the moment of arrival in moving traffic if they in fact offer a pay and display system which the driver can only access after parking and which is when the clock in fact starts. The exit photo is not evidence of 'parking time' at all and has not been shown to be synchronized to the pay and display machine clock nor even to relate to the same parking event.

    As keeper I cannot discount that the driver may have driven in, realised it was pay and display then driven out. The BPA even mention this as an inherent problem with ANPR on their website;
    URLLINK|britishparking.co.uk/How-does-ANPR-work|URLLINK


    The BPA's view is: 'As with all new technology, there are issues associated with its use:
    Some ‘drive in/drive out’ motorists that have activated the system receive a charge certificate even though they have not parked or taken a ticket. Reputable operators tend not to uphold charge certificates issued in this manner...'

    Additionally under paragraph 21.3 of the BPA Code of Practice, parking companies are required to ensure ANPR equipment is maintained and is in correct working order. I require Euro Car Parks to provide records with dates and times of when the equipment was checked, calibrated, maintained and synchronised with the timer which stamps the photo to ensure the accuracy of the ANPR images. As the parking charge is founded entirely on 2 photos of my vehicle entering and leaving the car park at specific times (not shown within the photographic evidence), it is vital that Euro Car Parks produces evidence in response to these points.

    In addition to showing their maintenance records, I require Euro Car Parks to show evidence to rebut the following assertion. I suggest that in the case of my vehicle being in this car park, a local camera took the image but a remote server added the time stamp. As the two are disconnected by the internet and do not have a common "time synchronisation system", there is no proof that the time stamp added is actually the exact time of the image. The Operator appears to use WIFI which introduces a delay through buffering, so "live" is not really "live". Hence, without a synchronised time stamp, there is no evidence that the image is ever time stamped with an accurate time. Therefore I contend that this ANPR evidence from the cameras in this car park is just as unreliable and unsynchronised as the evidence put forward in the recent case of ParkingEye v Fox-Jones on 8 Nov 2013. That case was dismissed when the judge deemed the evidence from ParkingEye to be fundamentally flawed because the synchronisation of the camera pictures with the timer had been called into question and the operator could not rebut the point. As its whole charge rests upon two timed photos, I put Euro Car Parks to strict proof to the contrary.



    I have made my detailed submission to show how the applicable law (POFA) and the BPA Code of Practice undoubtedly supports my appeal, which I submit should now be determined in my favour.

    Yours sincerely,
  • Coupon-mad
    Coupon-mad Posts: 131,614 Forumite
    Name Dropper First Post Photogenic First Anniversary
    edited 6 June 2016 at 9:03PM
    13:01 and 13:07

    Can't be right? 16 minutes?

    You are missing any criticism of the signs, which is ALWAYS ALWAYS a required POPLA point:

    http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?p=70636374#post70636374

    The PPCs always have signs up but often the parking charge is unreadable/in small print. You need to contend this is the case. Also that link shows a bit of other wording you could use, about the charge not being comparable to the Beavis case so there is no rationale or legitimate interest to save it from being a penalty. Like here:

    http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?p=70507124#post70507124

    The operator if they contest this appeal, WILL rely on the Beavis case so you MUST get in first or POPLA won't allow you to respond on that point at all (unfair, isn't it).
    PRIVATE 'PCN'? DON'T PAY BUT DON'T IGNORE IT (except N.Ireland).
    CLICK at the top of this/any page where it says:
    Forum Home»Motoring»Parking Tickets Fines & Parking - read the NEWBIES THREAD
  • Kc88
    Kc88 Posts: 9 Forumite
    Sorry, made a typo on the times, corrected now and I've added in points on how it is different to the Beavis case and regarding unclear signage.

    Part 1
    Vehicle Registration Number MYCAR
    PCN Reference MYPCN
    POPLACODE: MYPOPLACODE
    Issued by Euro Car Parks Limited


    As the registered keeper of the above vehicle, I wish to appeal the parking charge notice Euro Car Parks issued against it. I would like to have the parking charge notice cancelled based on the following grounds:


    1) Keeper Liability not established - The Notice to Keeper is not compliant with the POFA 2012
    2) No Landowner Authority
    3) BPA Code of Practice - non-compliance
    4) The minimum grace period was not allowed by the operator
    5) No genuine pre-estimate of loss – case can be differentiated from ParkingEye-v-Beavis
    6) The ANPR system is neither reliable nor accurate.
    7) Lack of legible signage - no contract with driver



    1) Keeper Liability not established - The Notice to Keeper is not compliant with the POFA 2012

    Although Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (“POFA”) gives a creditor the right to recover any unpaid parking charges from a vehicle’s keeper, this right is strictly subject to statutory conditions being met by the operator, without which the right to 'keeper liability' does not exist.

    I set out below a non-exhaustive list of reasons why Euro Car Parks’ Notice to Keeper failed to comply with Schedule 4 of POFA:

    (i) Contrary to the requirements of Paragraph 9(2)(a), the Notice to Keeper did not 'specify the period of parking' to which it related. It merely provided the dates and times when the vehicle allegedly entered and exited the car park; these times do not equate to any single evidenced period of parking. There is no evidence of a period of parking and this cannot reasonably be assumed on the balance of probabilities.


    (ii) Contrary to the requirements of Paragraph 9(2)(b), the Notice to Keeper did not inform the keeper that the driver is required to pay parking charges in respect of the specified period of parking and that the parking charges have not been paid in full;

    BOTH the above prescribed requirements must be stated in the NTK and they were not.


    (iii) Contrary to the requirements of Paragraph 9(2)(e), the Notice to Keeper did not state that the creditor does not know both the name of the driver and a current address for service for the driver and invite the keeper: ... to pay the unpaid parking charges; or ... if the keeper was not the driver of the vehicle, to notify the creditor of the name of the driver and a current address for service for the driver and to pass the notice on to the driver;

    The NTK fails to include all of the above wording, as prescribed under the statute.


    (iv) Contrary to the requirements of Paragraph 9(2)(f), this NTK fails in the prescribed requirement - in exact words and with the correct deadline - to:

    ''warn the keeper that if, after the period of 28 days beginning with the day after that on which the notice is given— ...the amount of the unpaid parking charges specified under paragraph (d) has not been paid in full, and...the creditor does not know both the name of the driver and a current address for service for the driver, the creditor will (if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met) have the right to recover from the keeper so much of that amount as remains unpaid;''


    (v) Contrary to the requirements of Paragraph 9(2)(h), the Notice to Keeper does not identify the creditor and specify how and to whom payment or notification to the creditor may be made;


    (vi) Contrary to the requirements of Paragraph 9(2)(i) the Notice to Keeper does not specify the date on which the notice is sent (where it is sent by post) or given (in any other case).

    A date of preparing or batching of NTKs ready for mailing later by iMail is often stated by BPA AOS members, misleadingly, as a 'date of issue' or similar. This fails the requirement to state the date SENT or GIVEN, neither of which are defined as the date the document was drawn up by back office staff, several days before iMail actually put the NTK in the post via Royal Mail.

    Consequently, Euro Car Parks has forfeited its right to recover any unpaid parking charges from the keeper of the vehicle.

    If Euro Car Parks should try to suggest that there is any method outwith the prescribed statute (POFA 2012) whereby a registered keeper can be held liable for a charge where a driver is not identified, I would remind them of the words of Mr Henry Greenslade, the 2015 POPLA Chief Adjudicator who ensured consistency of decisions since 2012, whereby POPLA never found against a registered keeper where a clearly non-POFA Notice to Keeper was served, as in this case.

    The Lead Adjudicator reminded operators (and his team of Assessors, in their training) of the following facts about a keeper's right not to name the driver and, of course, still not be lawfully able to be held liable, under Schedule 4:

    URLLINK.transportxtra.com/publications/parking-review/news/46154/there-is-no-50-50-rule-for-private-parking-appeals-says-popla-s-michael-greensladeURLLINK

    Understanding keeper liability
    “There appears to be continuing misunderstanding about Schedule 4. Provided certain conditions are strictly complied with, it provides for recovery of unpaid parking charges from the keeper of the vehicle.

    There is no ‘reasonable presumption’ in law that the registered keeper of a vehicle is the driver. Operators should never suggest anything of the sort. Further, a failure by the recipient of a notice issued under Schedule 4 to name the driver, does not of itself mean that the recipient has accepted that they were the driver at the material time. Unlike, for example, a Notice of Intended Prosecution where details of the driver of a vehicle must be supplied when requested by the police, pursuant to Section 172 of the Road Traffic Act 1988, a keeper sent a Schedule 4 notice has no legal obligation to name the driver.”

    The wording in the Protection of Freedoms Act (POFA) 2012 is as follows:

    ''Right to claim unpaid parking charges from keeper of vehicle: 4(1) The creditor has the right to recover any unpaid parking charges from the keeper of the vehicle. (2) The right under this paragraph applies only if—

    (a) the conditions specified in paragraphs 5, 6*, 11 and 12 (so far as applicable) are met;


    *Conditions that must be met for purposes of paragraph 4:
    6(1) ''The second condition is that the creditor (or a person acting for or on behalf of the creditor)— (b) has given a notice to keeper in accordance with paragraph 9.''

    The operator has failed to meet the second condition for keeper liability due to the multiple flaws in the NTK. Therefore, no lawful right exists to claim unpaid parking charges from myself as keeper of the vehicle as they have not met the required conditions within Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act (POFA) 2012.

    This too was confirmed by Mr Greenslade, POPLA Lead Adjudicator. in page 8 of the 2015 POPLA Report:

    ''If {POFA 2012 Schedule 4 is} not complied with then keeper liability does not generally pass.''




    2) No landowner Authority:

    I question Euro Car Parks Limited’s authority from the landowner, to enforce parking charges regarding alleged breaches at this car park.

    BPA CoP paragraphs 7.1 & 7.2 dictate some of the required contract wording. I put Euro Car Parks Limited to strict proof of the contract terms with the actual landowner (not a lessee or agent who has no more title than the operator). I question Euro Car Parks Limited’s legal status to enforce this charge because there is no assignment of rights to pursue PCNs in the courts in neither their own name nor standing to form contracts with drivers themselves.

    They do not own this car park and appear (at best) to have a bare licence to put signs up and ‘ticket’ vehicles on site, merely acting as agents on behalf of a principal. No evidence has been supplied lawfully showing that Euro Car Parks Limited is entitled to pursue these charges in their own right in the courts which is a strict requirement within the BPA CoP. I suggest that Euro Car Parks Limited are certainly not empowered by the landowner to sue customers and visitors in a free of charge enormous car park and that issuing 'PCNs' by post is no evidence of any right to actually pursue charges in court.

    In addition, Section 7.3 of the CoP states:

    “The written authorization must also set out:

    a) the definition of the land on which you may operate, so that the boundaries of the land can be clearly defined
    b) Any conditions or restrictions on parking control and enforcement operations, including any restrictions on hours of operation
    c) Any conditions or restrictions on the types of vehicles that may, or may not, be subject to parking control and enforcement
    d) Who has the responsibility for putting up and maintaining signs
    e) The definition of the services provided by each party to the agreement.''

    I put Euro Car Parks Limited to strict proof of compliance with all of the above requirements.

    This is vital, especially in view of the signs where it is clear on close scrutiny, is that someone (identity not established and I ask the operator for evidence in this regard) has changed the time limit to 4.5 hours at some point. So, I contend that the contract - if this operator produces one - does not reflect the altered signage and if only a basic agreement or 'witness statement' is produced, then this will fail to demonstrate compliance with 7.3 (in particular, point b and d, above).

    It is eminently possible that the contract states only the original free parking period (whatever that was) and therefore a sticker over a sign is unsupported by the will of the landowner in any contract. This would destroy any attempt by this operator to argue there is a Beavis-case-style 'legitimate interest' backed by any commercial justification and wishes of the landowner to sue customers after just 4.5 hours in a car park where they have only allowed this agent to issue PCNs after a completely different period.

    I require Euro Car Parks Limited to provide a full copy of the contemporaneous, signed & dated contract with the landowner showing evidence to meet 7.3 of the CoP. In order to comply, a non-landowner private parking company must have a specifically-worded contract with the landowner – not merely an ‘agreement’ with a non-landholder managing agent – otherwise there is no authority.



    3) BPA Code of Practice - further non-compliance - photo evidence.

    The BPA Code of Practice point 20.5a stipulates that:

    "When issuing a parking charge notice you may use photographs as evidence that a vehicle was parked in an unauthorized way. The photographs must refer to and confirm the incident which you claim was unauthorized. A date and time stamp should be included on the photograph. All photographs used for evidence should be clear and legible and must not be retouched or digitally altered."

    The parking charge notice in question contains two photographs of the vehicle number plate. Neither of these images contains a date and time stamp on the photographs nor do they clearly identify the vehicle entering or leaving this car park (which is also not identifiable in the photos as any particular location at all).

    The time and date stamp has been inserted into the letter underneath (but not part of) the photographs. The images have also been cropped to only display the number plate. As these are not the original images, I require Euro Car Parks Limited to produce evidence of the original "un-cropped" images containing the required date and time stamp and to evidence where the photographs show the car to be when there is a lack of any marker or sign to indisputably relate these photos to the location stated.



    4) The minimum grace period was not allowed by the Operator
    British Parking Association Code of Practice 13.1 – 13.4 states:
    13 Grace periods
    13.1 Your approach to parking management must allow a
    driver who enters your car park but decides not to park,
    to leave the car park within a reasonable period without
    having their vehicle issued with a parking charge notice.
    13.2 You should allow the driver a reasonable ‘grace period’
    in which to decide if they are going to stay or go. If the
    driver is on your land without permission you should still
    allow them a grace period to read your signs and leave
    before you take enforcement action.
    13.3 You should be prepared to tell us the specific grace period
    at a site if our compliance team or our agents ask what it is.
    13.4 You should allow the driver a reasonable period to leave the
    private car park after the parking contract has ended, before
    you take enforcement action. If the location is one where
    parking is normally permitted, the Grace Period at the end
    of the parking period should be a minimum of 10 minutes.
    Also, under the BPA Approved Operator Scheme Code of Practice Version 6, Oct 2015, states that if drivers
    "…decide not to park but choose to leave the car park, you must provide them with reasonable grace period to leave, as they will not be bound by your parking contract." (18.5).

    And that when using Automatic Number Plate Recognition (ANPR),
    "…your system must allow drivers who have not paid the fee to leave a site within a reasonable period that allows for the conditions and environment of that parking site. This grace period should be long enough to allow motorists to leave without having their vehicle registration mark processed for a parking charge." (30.2)

    The above states that a time no less than 20 minutes should be allowed for first, entry and consideration of the contract, and second, leaving the property. The times stated on the NTK show only the time of entry and exit (13:01 and 13:17 respectively). These do not indicate the time in which the vehicle parked. The charges laid out in the signage are only for the time that the vehicle was parked. The times stated on the NTK, however, are clear evidence that the vehicle entered the car park and left again within the grace period specified by the BPA CoP to protect consumers in the time that they need to find a parking space, consider the contract, and leave the car park again.

    In this case, the 16 minutes was used to find a parking space, consider the terms of the contract, and decline the offer. The mention of a minimum of 10 minutes is exactly this, a minimum. The time needed to complete all these actions are dependent on a number of wildly varying factors, including traffic, lighting and parking conditions, driver’s eyesight and driving ability and mental faculties. For this reason, a minimum amount is specified, but the maximum time allowed for these tasks to be completed are not. Further to this, the signage makes no indication of how long a driver may be on the site before a parking penalty will be charged. This leaves the driver uncertain to the terms of the contract, which means that there was no full acceptance of the contract to be breached.
  • Kc88
    Kc88 Posts: 9 Forumite
    Part 2 below:
    5) No genuine pre-estimate of loss – case can be differentiated from ParkingEye-v-Beavis

    This car park is Pay and Display and as far as I can ascertain as keeper, a payment may have been made. Having received the Notice in the post I had very little information (see point #1) so went and checked the signage and it seems that up to 16 minutes of parking would have cost £0.80 so the only recoverable sum under the POFA 2012 is the sum of the alleged 'outstanding' parking charge = £0.80 at the most. Euro Car Parks have not told me these details, despite it being a prerequisite of Schedule 4 (see Point #1).

    The Operator cannot reasonably claim a broad percentage of their entire business running costs, as they operate various different arrangements, some where they pay a landowner a huge amount akin to a 'fishing licence' to catch motorists and some where they have pay and display, and others which are free car parks. I suggest there was never any advance meeting held with the client, nor was any due regard paid to establishing any 'genuine pre-estimate of loss' prior to setting the parking charges at this site. I put this operator to strict proof to the contrary and to explain how the calculation happens to be the same whether the alleged overstay is 20 minutes or 20 hours.

    The Operator alleges 'breach of terms/failure to comply' and as such, the landowner/occupier (not their agent) can only pursue liquidated damages directly flowing from the parking event. This must amount in its entirety, only to a genuine pre-estimate of loss, not some subsequently penned 'commercial justification' statement they have devised afterwards, since this would not be a pre-estimate. Any later 'new' calculation (even if dressed up to look like a loss statement) would fall foul of Mr Greenslade's explanation abut GPEOL in the POPLA 2014 Report and would also falls foul of the DFT Guidance about private parking charges.

    In this case, even if the Operator contends there was a small outstanding P&D sum (which they have missed off the Notice to Keeper, so I have no idea) they certainly cannot claim an inflated amount. A GPEOL calculation must be a sum which might reasonably flow directly as a result of a parking event.

    An Operator cannot include 'staff time spent on appeals' and other tax deductible business costs such as administration, accounting & equipment. Appeals staff are already paid to do their admin job which includes handling appeals among other tasks, so there is no question that there is any 'loss' caused by these staff who are not 'significantly diverted' from their normal activity when they deal with challenges or POPLA stage.

    Judge Charles Harris QC in 'A Retailer v Ms B' (where the Claimant tried to claim a 'loss' from a consumer for 'staff and/or management time investigating') stated:
    "[14] The claimant in the instant case has not established either that the staff in question were significantly diverted from their usual activities or that there was any significant disruption to its business... Nor was there any loss of revenue generation. [15] The two security people, far from being diverted from their usual activities, were in fact actively engaged in them. They were doing just what the claimants paid for them to do... [16] So the claim in respect of staff time cannot, in my judgment, be established. I was not clear if, at the end of the case, the other two alleged heads of loss – administrative costs and security equipment costs – were still being sought. But, if so, these claims too cannot succeed. Neither can be shown to be attributable to the defendants’ activities. The amounts spent by the claimant would have been identical had the defendants stayed at home... [17] It follows that the claims must be dismissed’’

    In the case of private parking charges in general - including this Operator - the administrative staff and Managers who handle challenges and POPLA appeals are not 'significantly diverted from their usual activities', nor do appeals cause any 'significant disruption to its business', nor was there any significant loss of revenue generation. So none of the 'staff time' can be properly included in a GPEOL calculation. If POPLA do accept a small amount of staff time in a GPEOL sum then this could only be 1% of the typical time taken for POPLA appeals, because only 1% of cases follow the POPLA route. No higher figure can have been in the reasonable contemplation of the Operator at the time of the parking event because the chances of POPLA are even less than 'debt collector stage' both being far too remote to be likely.
    ''the aim of damages is to be compensatory, beginning with the idea that the aim is to put the parties in the position they would have been in had the contract been performed. It also seems that courts have been unwilling to allow clauses designed to deter breach as this undermines the binding nature of the initial promise made. Whilst the courts have reasonably moved away from a strict interpretation of what constitutes a genuine pre-estimate of loss, recognising that in complex commercial situations an accurate pre-estimate will not always be possible, nevertheless it remains that a charge for damages must be compensatory in nature rather than punitive.''

    The Operator may seek to rely on the case of Parking Eye v Beavis as legitimising the charge in this case. The appellant will make the following observations. The Supreme Court adjudged that the charge in Parking Eye v Beavis could not be considered a penalty, despite the fact Parking Eye made no loss, because they had a legitimate interest in enforcing that charge and that the charge was not disproportionate to that interest. The legitimate interest was described in the Supreme Court judgment as :

    “97
    a. The need to provide parking spaces for their commercial tenants’ prospective customers; -

    b. The desirability of that parking being free so as to attract customers;

    c. The need to ensure a reasonable turnover of that parking so as to increase the potential number of such customers;

    d. The related need to prevent ‘misuse’ of the parking for purposes unconnected with the tenants’ business, for example by commuters going to work or shoppers going to off-park premises; and

    e. The desirability of running that parking scheme at no cost, or ideally some profit, to themselves.”

    In this case the vehicle would have been fully entitled to park as it did had payment been made ( provided the requirement to do so had been clearly brought to the motorist's attention) The above justifications are irrelevant and conspicuously absent. The only interest the Operator has in enforcing the charge is ensuring payment is made. That is not a legitimate interest. The car park is no different to any commercial enterprise .The Operator cannot argue that a legitimate interest is simply ensuring that payment is made , i.e. simply ensuring the terms of the contract are not breached. If that was the situation any contractual term requiring payment for breach could never automatically be a penalty, in other words the need for another legitimate interest is unnecessary. In addition the charge demanded for breach is clearly disproportionate to the unpaid parking tariff of less than 1 pound. The charge is clearly a penalty following the judgment of the Supreme Court.

    This position is reinforced in the earlier judgment from the Court of Appeal in Parking Eye v Beavis . The judgment states :

    "43. It is clear that the purpose of the £85 parking charge is to deter those who use the car
    park from overstaying beyond the free permitted two hours. So, Mr Hossain
    submitted, the case is clear and the parking charge provision is unenforceable.
    44. All the previous cases shown to us have concerned contracts of a financial or at least
    an economic nature, where the transaction between the contracting parties can be
    assessed in monetary terms, as can the effects of a breach of the contract by one party
    or the other. Sometimes such measurement is difficult because of inherent
    uncertainties, and in those an agreed liquidated damages provision may be upheld for
    those reasons. But, however difficult it may be to measure, it is clear that there are
    economic and commercial effects on the parties.
    45. The contract in the present case is entirely different. There is no economic transaction
    between the car park operator and the driver who uses the car park, if he or she stays
    no longer than two hours; there is no more than (for that time) a gratuitous licence to
    use the land. The operator affords the driver a free facility. That facility is, of course,
    of economic value to the driver, as well as of convenience, in assisting the driver to
    visit the shops in the shopping centre which the car park serves. It is thus useful to
    Judgment Approved by the court for handing down. ParkingEye -v- Beavis
    the driver, being close to the shops, and free. It is also useful to the shopkeepers, in
    encouraging visitors, and in particular in encouraging a turnover of visitors because of
    the two hour limit. A car owner cannot simply come to the car park and park there all
    day. To do that would be to clog up the facility and to prevent those arriving later
    from using the park for its intended purpose.
    46. The terms of use of the car park need, therefore, to provide a disincentive to drivers
    which will make them tend to comply with the two hour limit. That is afforded by the
    parking charge of £85. It would not be afforded by a system of imposing a rate per
    hour according to the time overstayed, unless that rate were also substantial, and well
    above what might be regarded as a market rate for the elapsed time, even if the market
    rate were in some way adjusted to take account of the benefit to the driver of the first
    two hours being free.
    47. It seems to me that the principles underlying the doctrine of penalty ought not to
    strike down a provision of this kind, in relation to a contract such as we are concerned
    with, merely on the basis that the contractual provision is a disincentive, or deterrent,
    against overstaying. When the court is considering an ordinary financial or
    commercial contract, then it is understandable that the law, which lays down its own
    rules as to the compensation due from a contract breaker to the innocent party, should
    prohibit terms which require the payment of compensation going far beyond that
    which the law allows in the absence of any contract provision governing this outcome.
    The classic and simple case is that referred to by Tindal CJ in Kemble v Farren (1829)
    6 Bing. 141 at 148:
    “But that a very large sum should become immediately payable, in consequence
    of the non-payment of a very small sum, and that the former should not be
    considered a penalty, appears to be a contradiction in terms, the case being
    precisely that in which courts of equity have always relieved, and against which
    courts of law have, in modern times, endeavoured to relieve, by directing juries to
    assess the real damages sustained by the breach of the agreement.”


    This judgment makes clear that the Court of Appeal would also consider the charge in this case a clear penalty. The purported contract with the motorist is a clear consumer financial contract where the loss is easily calculable unlike in Parking Eye v Beavis. There is clear financial interaction between the operator and motorist .There is no commercially or socially justifiable deterrent value in the charge as the vehicle would have been fully entitled to park in return for payment of a small parking tariff (had the requirement to do so clearly been advertised) and the contractual term is clearly the attempt to impose payment of a large sum in consequence of the non payment of a very small sum. Any real loss can only be the small parking tariff and it is only that to which the landowner , not the Operator , may be entitled. The demanded charge is without intellectual dishonesty, a clearly unenforceable penalty .



    6) The ANPR system is neither reliable nor accurate.

    Euro Car Parks’ evidence shows no parking time, merely photos of a car driving in and out. It is unreasonable for this operator to record the start of 'parking time' as the moment of arrival in moving traffic if they in fact offer a pay and display system which the driver can only access after parking and which is when the clock in fact starts. The exit photo is not evidence of 'parking time' at all and has not been shown to be synchronized to the pay and display machine clock nor even to relate to the same parking event.

    As keeper I cannot discount that the driver may have driven in, realised it was pay and display then driven out. The BPA even mention this as an inherent problem with ANPR on their website;
    URLLINKbritishparking.co.uk/How-does-ANPR-workURLLINK


    The BPA's view is: 'As with all new technology, there are issues associated with its use:
    Some ‘drive in/drive out’ motorists that have activated the system receive a charge certificate even though they have not parked or taken a ticket. Reputable operators tend not to uphold charge certificates issued in this manner...'

    Additionally under paragraph 21.3 of the BPA Code of Practice, parking companies are required to ensure ANPR equipment is maintained and is in correct working order. I require Euro Car Parks to provide records with dates and times of when the equipment was checked, calibrated, maintained and synchronised with the timer which stamps the photo to ensure the accuracy of the ANPR images. As the parking charge is founded entirely on 2 photos of my vehicle entering and leaving the car park at specific times (not shown within the photographic evidence), it is vital that Euro Car Parks produces evidence in response to these points.

    In addition to showing their maintenance records, I require Euro Car Parks to show evidence to rebut the following assertion. I suggest that in the case of my vehicle being in this car park, a local camera took the image but a remote server added the time stamp. As the two are disconnected by the internet and do not have a common "time synchronisation system", there is no proof that the time stamp added is actually the exact time of the image. The Operator appears to use WIFI which introduces a delay through buffering, so "live" is not really "live". Hence, without a synchronised time stamp, there is no evidence that the image is ever time stamped with an accurate time. Therefore I contend that this ANPR evidence from the cameras in this car park is just as unreliable and unsynchronised as the evidence put forward in the recent case of ParkingEye v Fox-Jones on 8 Nov 2013. That case was dismissed when the judge deemed the evidence from ParkingEye to be fundamentally flawed because the synchronisation of the camera pictures with the timer had been called into question and the operator could not rebut the point. As its whole charge rests upon two timed photos, I put Euro Car Parks to strict proof to the contrary.


    7) Lack of signage – no contract with driver - no adequate notice of the charge, maximum stay nor grace period.

    The signs were not visible from a distance and the words are unreadable. I put Euro car Parks to strict proof otherwise; as well as a site map they must show photos of the signs as the driver would seem them on entering the car park. A Notice is not imported into the contract unless brought home so prominently that the party ‘must’ have known of it and agreed terms. If the driver did not notice any signs; there was no consideration/acceptance and no contract agreed between the parties. Furthermore as stated (point #4) a suitable grace period must be allowed for the driver to find a suitable parking space, find the signs containing the parking terms, (should they be easily located), decide whether to accept these terms and leave the car park in a safe manner.

    Furthermore as the registered keeper; the driver has not been identified and I have no obligation to assist an operator in this regard, even if I was certain which of several drivers could have used the car that day. As liability for this charge depends entirely upon this operator fulfilling all requirements of Schedule 4, it is mandatory that the driver(s) are unambiguously and clearly informed of terms and the parking charge itself:

    (3) ''For the purposes of sub-paragraph (2) “adequate notice” means notice given by — (b)...the display of one or more notices which—

    (i) specify the sum as the charge for unauthorised parking; and

    (ii) are adequate to bring the charge to the notice of drivers who park vehicles on the relevant land.''

    For the purposes of this appeal, I have now visited this same car park that this operator alleges was the site of a 'contract' being formed. In fact, their signs are not visible from a car seat before parking and the words are completely unreadable and incapable of forming a contract before the act of parking (it is trite law that afterwards - after parking in this case - is too late).

    The parking charge itself is not in 'large lettering' and I note that the time on some signs (I do not know if this is consistent on all the signs) has been altered by a flimsy sticker at some point, by someone, to read: '4.5 hours maximum'. However I have no information as to when these stickers were applied and by whom and what the time limit in fact was, at the time of the alleged parking event. It could have been ten hours for all I know, and unlike the driver(s) on the day, when I visited recently for evidence and information to help with this appeal, I was specifically seeking out the signs and terms and still could not read the parking charge or time limit clearly, when expressly looking for it.

    The burden falls to the party trying to claim money, to produce irrefutable evidence that all their signs showed less time 'allowed' than the timing shown in their own photographs. It is obvious that the previous signage said something entirely different and that time cannot be assumed, it must be proved by this operator when the signs changed.

    I have stated this in my appeal to Euro Car Parks and in their reply to reject my appeal they included a picture of a sign. In fact when I subsequently visited, looking around the site on foot, I did not see any signage like that in the entrance of the car park and again, I believe this has been changed at some unidentified point. I put Euro Car Parks to strict proof otherwise.


    A Notice is not imported into the contract unless brought home so prominently that the party ‘must’ have known of it and agreed terms. I question the fact that the driver saw any sign like that and so there was no consideration or acceptance and no contract agreed between the parties.

    The sign also breaches the BPA CoP Appendix B which effectively renders it unable to form a contract with a driver.

    In the Beavis case, the Supreme Court Judge concluded that signs must be in 'large lettering and prominent' and very clear as to the terms by which a driver will later be bound.



    I have made my detailed submission to show how the applicable law (POFA), the BPA Code of Practice and case law (Beavis) undoubtedly supports my appeal, which I submit should now be determined in my favour.
  • Coupon-mad
    Coupon-mad Posts: 131,614 Forumite
    Name Dropper First Post Photogenic First Anniversary
    5) No genuine pre-estimate of loss – case can be differentiated from ParkingEye-v-Beavis

    I would just lose the 'GPEOL' words altogether:
    5) No comparable legitimate interest nor clear prominent signage terms – the case is a simple economic transaction (re a quantified tariff) which can be differentiated from the 'entirely different' complex contract in ParkingEye-v-Beavis
    PRIVATE 'PCN'? DON'T PAY BUT DON'T IGNORE IT (except N.Ireland).
    CLICK at the top of this/any page where it says:
    Forum Home»Motoring»Parking Tickets Fines & Parking - read the NEWBIES THREAD
  • Kc88
    Kc88 Posts: 9 Forumite
    Thank you very much for all your help Coupon-mad. Here's hoping POPLA will see the sense in my appeal.
  • Kc88
    Kc88 Posts: 9 Forumite
    Hi,
    So ECP have responded to my POPLA appeal and I have a few days to respond to them.

    Here is their response:
    This location is managed by Automatic Number Plate Recognition (ANPR) technology which takes a picture of the vehicle entering and exiting the site, these pictures are timed and therefore the duration of the stay can be calculated. All vehicle registration numbers are then matched against the data produced by the various means of paying for parking and a list of registration numbers where no payment has been made or where the motorist has stayed longer than the period paid is produced. After requesting vehicle keeper details from the DVLA, a Notice to keeper is sent to the keepers of the vehicles on this list. As a consequence at ANPR locations there will be no PCN issued to the windscreen neither will there be photographic evidence of the windscreen supplied in operator evidence packs.
    Parking Charge Notice XXXX was issued to vehicleXXX breach of terms and conditions D: no valid pay and display/permit was purchased at the Bromsgrove Street - Birmingham car park. This car park operates a 24 hour ANPR + P&D operation therefore all vehicles are required to purchase a valid ticket for the full duration of stay within the car park.
    In Mr XXX appeal to POPLA he states that the notice to keeper is not compliant with POFA 2012, no Land owner authority, noncompliance with the BPA code of practice, no minimum grace period allowed and unclear signage.
    Euro Car Parks would like to respond to the points raised with the following:
    This car park is LEASED by Euro Car Parks
    • Section 18.3 of the British Parking Association’s (BPA) code of practice explains that signs “must be conspicuous and legible and written in intelligible language, so that they are easy to see, read and understand.
    • Signage on site is clear, when parking on private land it is the driver’s responsibility to read the signage displayed and parked accordance with the terms and conditions as stated.
    • Euro Car Parks have provided photographic evidence showing that the appellant remained at the site for one hour and nineteen (Figure 1)
    • The signage clearly states the terms and conditions of parking, all drivers are required to purchase a valid pay and display ticket for the duration of their stay. Euro Car Parks can confirm that the signage on site clearly dispalys the tariff at Bromsgrove Street (Figure 2)
    • The signage clearly states the rules and regulations of parking, all drivers are required to purchcase a valid pay and display ticket payment for the duration of their stay.
    • Signage is visble when entering and inside of the car park and when entering private land it would be Mr XXX responsibilty to read the terms and conditions and adhere to them.
    • Figure 3 shows the lease between ECP and the land owners.
    • Euro Car Parks have erected clear and visible signage – there are three tariff bands. It is not within the drivers remit to interpret the signage or the site tariff in the way they see fit.
    • Euro Car Parks would like to point out that all terms and conditions of parking are clearly displayed, this includes the charge payable should a breach of the terms and conditions occur.
    • Contract law applies
    • According to BPA Code of Practise 13.4 – car park operators should allow the driver a reasonable period to leave the private car park after the parking contract has ended; before enforcement action is taken. If the location is one where parking is normally permitted; the grace period at the end of the parking period should be a minimum of 10 minutes. I can confirm that Euro Car Parks have given Mr XXX ’s the suitable grace period of 10 minutes
    • The contract (signage) clearly states the extra charges are that the driver will incur and have to pay if they decide to break the contract terms − for example, by parking longer than the time paid for or exceeding the maximum time limit applicable.
    • A pay and display payment is required for the full duration of the stay on site
    • The car park in question is on private land and upon entering such land vehicles are subject to the rules and regulations of parking as shown on the signage. This signage quite clearly states that if your vehicle is in breach of the rules and regulations of the car park then a parking charge notice (PCN) will be issued.
    C1 MB


    • On entry to private land it is the responsibility of the driver to check for signage and ensure that your vehicle has been correctly parked. Any vehicles found not adhering to the signage will be issued with a parking charge notice (PCN).
    • As previously advised the car park is camera controlled and any notes/ pay and display ticket displayed on the dashboard will not be seen.
    • Any form of parking ticket or ‘notice’ is issued under the law ‘of trespass and Contract Law’. A driver who is invited (or chooses) to park on private land and use the car parking facilities and pays a fee/s does so under a contract (signage) with the car park operator. The parking contract sets out the terms that apply to the parking service, including the price.
    • The contract (signage) clearly states the extra charges are that the driver will incur and have to pay if they decide to break the contract terms − for example, by parking longer than the time paid for or exceeding the maximum time limit applicable.
    • With regards to the reference to “Pre-Estimate of Loss/breach of consumer contracts 1999.” Please be advised that the Supreme Court has made judgement (04/11/15) that clearly sets out the issue of parking charge notices on private land (law of contract applies) and in particular pre-estimate of loss. The parking charge notice is enforceable on the basis that it protected a legitimate interest when the driver failed to adhere to the terms and conditions and was not extravagant, exorbitant nor unconscionable. The parking charge is not an unenforceable penalty and does not breach the Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999.
    • Mr XXX was sent both the PCN and Notice to keeper (section 2), were he was given the option to provide the name and serviceable address of the driver if he was not driving at the time of the contravention.

    I can confirm the signage on site is clear, it states the site is a 24 hour pay and display car park and that charges apply 24 hours a day and drivers must have a valid pay and display.
    Euro Car Parks maintains that Mr XXX ‘s appeal should not be accepted and that the notice has been issued correctly and should remain payable. As the pay and display ticket purchased was not purchased for the full duration; Euro Car Parks assets that the parking charge notice was issued correctly and should remain payable.


    Here is my proposed response to POPLA (I still need to cut it down some words to the 2000 character limit, but does this look okay?
    ECP have failed to address the non-compliance of NTK; according to Paragraph 9(2), ECP did not inform me as the keeper, that the driver is required to pay and that the parking charges were not paid in full. Also NTK fails to include the wording prescribed in Paragraph 9(2)(e) relating to the passing of driver details. Due to the non-compliance of the NTK, ECP have no lawful right to claim unpaid parking charges from the keeper.
    The NTK was still non-compliant in the images used as stipulated in CoP 20.5a where an image should not be altered, this again diminishes ECP right to pursue the alleged charge from the keeper.
    In ECP response they state incorrectly on bullet point 3 that the vehicle was on the site for 1hour and 19; however the figure provided shows otherwise – less than 16 minutes.
    Within the agreement provided by ECP there is no evidence that ECP is lawfully entitled to pursue charges in their own right in the courts which is a strict requirement within BPA CoP. Therefore ECP are not empowered by the landowner to pursue charges in court.
    ECP state that the signage contains the terms and conditions; however a vehicle entering a car park does not automatically agree to the terms and conditions. Only when the driver has decided whether they should stay or go (CoP 13.1-13.4). The code clearly states that a time no less than 20 minutes should be allowed for 1: entry and consideration of contract; 2: leaving the property; ECP have only considered the time it takes to exit (10 minutes), but not the time it takes to initially park and consider the terms offered. The CoP exists to protect consumers in the time it takes them to find a parking space, consider the contract and leave the car park. Since this time was not exceeded the terms and conditions were not agreed upon nor was a contract established.
    I question ECP statement that the charge was protecting a legitimate interest as there is no commercially or socially justifiable in the charge. Any loss of the small parking tariff would be to that of the landowner and not the operator (ECP)
This discussion has been closed.
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