Light Switch - Neutral and Live Wires
Comments
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brightontraveller wrote: »You cannot know what "wire" is without testing so advise based on a guess? Knowing termination points on switch etc isn't knowing existing installation is safe ,
Do you take liability or inform those you !!!8220;advise!!!8221; actions make them liable in the event of fire, electrocution.
Correct installation information is different than a blanket answer to cover all.. To do so safely correctly user needs to identify live, neutral etc if they can then they wouldn't need advice...
This isn't to say only electricians should fit items but its stupid, dangerous to give advice without knowing all the info in situations like this ...
I think your being abit OTT and assuming what i'm going to tell people.
When people ask me along the lines of "how easy is it to fit a smart switch like that one" it would be very condescending of me to say "Sorry i cannot tell you as you may injure yourself or cause a fire".
What i do say when someone asks me something like that is " It's easy to do but you need to have both a Live wire and Neutral wire connected to the switch and not many houses have these; i had to run a wire from the light fitting". I was discussing this with someone who was moving soon into a new build and so the question about if new houses would have a neutral wire came up.0 -
It seems to me that the Smart Switches are not optimally designed for British house wiring.
The switch unit should be next to the ceiling rose, where the uninterrupted power is, and then the switch lead can be taken over entirely by the smart switch. Either the original switch plate could be retained (in which case it would offer two-way switching with smart override), or the wiring could connect to a small switch circuit on a new plate.
I'm sure that would be more straightforward than re-wiring, or paying £185 for the LightwaveRF ones.0 -
If you don't know the answer then clearly you are not qualified to advise anyone else, leave it to the experts.
What i want to know is if newer houses are likely to have this and from what year so i can correctly advise people when they ask about how easy it is to wire up smart light switches.
Electricity kills, as already said it's irresponsible advising anyone to undertake electrical work.0 -
If you don't know the answer then clearly you are not qualified to advise anyone else, leave it to the experts.
Electricity kills, as already said it's irresponsible advising anyone to undertake electrical work.
So if you installed a light switch in your house and one of your friends asked you how easy it was to do or how exactly you did it, would you seriously not tell them?. I would find that very childish if someone refused to tell me how they did something.
There is a big difference between telling someone how you did something and actually telling them they should do it. If i simply tell them how i did something then i don't see any problem with that and it's up to them to decide if they want to/are able to do it themselves.0 -
How you or how they your question wasnt how did you install a switch but how to advise them ? If its made for uk meets requirements, regulations and design is suitable for non competant person instalation then it would have comprehesive instructions, but many "smart light switches."are simply not made for uk markets despite being availible here which is the make that you wish to advise on ?So if you installed a light switch in your house and one of your friends asked you how easy it was to do or how exactly you did it, would you seriously not tell them?. I would find that very childish if someone refused to tell me how they did something.
There is a big difference between telling someone how you did something and actually telling them they should do it. If i simply tell them how i did something then i don't see any problem with that and it's up to them to decide if they want to/are able to do it themselves.0 -
I've already mentioned the LightwaveRF switches as an easy to wire switch but if you want something even easier that requires no wiring at all, you could use Hue lightbulbs and one of these switch covers to mount the Hue switch over the original switch:
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Philips-Hue-Dimmer-Remote-UK-Light-Switch-Adapter-Cover/263504928799?_trkparms=aid%3D555018%26algo%3DPL.SIM%26ao%3D2%26asc%3D43781%26meid%3D066aef91698449788467c025c54d973b%26pid%3D100011%26rk%3D1%26rkt%3D12%26mehot%3Dpp%26sd%3D253249244914%26itm%3D263504928799&_trksid=p2047675.c100011.m1850
The original switch stays in place and you can access it by popping the Hue switch out of the mount, so you can still easily isolate the bulb.
The only downside to these I can see is that if somebody that wasn't familiar with the setup tried to change the bulb they might do so with the lamp holder live. Probably not a major risk and you're unlikely to be changing Hue bulbs frequently but something to bear in mind.0 -
brightontraveller wrote: »How you or how they your question wasnt how did you install a switch but how to advise them ? If its made for uk meets requirements, regulations and design is suitable for non competant person instalation then it would have comprehesive instructions, but many "smart light switches."are simply not made for uk markets despite being availible here which is the make that you wish to advise on ?
Maybe "advise" was the wrong word to use. But as i said above i currently use the Sonoff Switches in my house (I only have two at the moment to see how good they are) which cost less than £12 each on eBay. It's described as the "EU" model and is made by ITEAD which is a chinese company. It does have a wiring diagram but all it basically shows is you need to run a neutral wire to it from the same circuit as the light bulb (as well as live in and out).
But as it's so cheap i don't want people to go out and order one after seeing mine and not realise they need a neutral wire and waste their money sending it back. So i always mention this requirement when people ask about it.Cornucopia wrote: »It seems to me that the Smart Switches are not optimally designed for British house wiring.
The switch unit should be next to the ceiling rose, where the uninterrupted power is, and then the switch lead can be taken over entirely by the smart switch. Either the original switch plate could be retained (in which case it would offer two-way switching with smart override), or the wiring could connect to a small switch circuit on a new plate.
I'm sure that would be more straightforward than re-wiring, or paying £185 for the LightwaveRF ones.
I do actually have a smart switch connected to a lamp that could be wired up as you said. The only reservations i have is that it relies on several systems to work and an internet connection so i wouldn't want to be in a position where i couldn't turn on the lights due to a fault.TheCyclingProgrammer wrote: »I've already mentioned the LightwaveRF switches as an easy to wire switch but if you want something even easier that requires no wiring at all, you could use Hue lightbulbs and one of these switch covers to mount the Hue switch over the original switch:
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Philips-Hue-Dimmer-Remote-UK-Light-Switch-Adapter-Cover/263504928799?_trkparms=aid%3D555018%26algo%3DPL.SIM%26ao%3D2%26asc%3D43781%26meid%3D066aef91698449788467c025c54d973b%26pid%3D100011%26rk%3D1%26rkt%3D12%26mehot%3Dpp%26sd%3D253249244914%26itm%3D263504928799&_trksid=p2047675.c100011.m1850
The original switch stays in place and you can access it by popping the Hue switch out of the mount, so you can still easily isolate the bulb.
The only downside to these I can see is that if somebody that wasn't familiar with the setup tried to change the bulb they might do so with the lamp holder live. Probably not a major risk and you're unlikely to be changing Hue bulbs frequently but something to bear in mind.
I have previously looked at the Hue system and the main reason i didn't get it was because it didn't control the switch directly. But that does look like a good solution to that.0 -
Sonoff do a "UK" model maybe start by telling others that :rotfl:Maybe "advise" was the wrong word to use. But as i said above i currently use the Sonoff Switches in my house (I only have two at the moment to see how good they are) which cost less than £12 each on eBay. It's described as the "EU" model and is made by ITEAD which is a chinese company. It does have a wiring diagram but all it basically shows is you need to run a neutral wire to it from the same circuit as the light bulb (as well as live in and out).
But as it's so cheap i don't want people to go out and order one after seeing mine and not realise they need a neutral wire and waste their money sending it back. So i always mention this requirement when people ask about it.
I do actually have a smart switch connected to a lamp that could be wired up as you said. The only reservations i have is that it relies on several systems to work and an internet connection so i wouldn't want to be in a position where i couldn't turn on the lights due to a fault.
I have previously looked at the Hue system and the main reason i didn't get it was because it didn't control the switch directly. But that does look like a good solution to that.0 -
Being described as an "EU model" doesn't mean that the unit has actually been approved for sale in the EU especially when you read about the number of counterfeit and poor quality electrical items that are sold on ebay.(I only have two at the moment to see how good they are) which cost less than £12 each on eBay. It's described as the "EU" model and is made by ITEAD which is a chinese company.0 -
brightontraveller wrote: »Sonoff do a "UK" model maybe start by telling others that :rotfl:
Then that definitely would be bad advise as the "UK" model is just a claim made by sellers in the UK when they sell the EU model
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