Back-to-back start home not selling - advice?

wiggy001 · 15 January 2008 at 1:37PM

Hi there, my first post looking for some advice on selling my property.

Long story short, I am trying to sell the following: http://www.rightmove.co.uk/viewdetails-9639900.rsp?pa_n=2&tr_t=buy

It was valued at around £170k back in May last year. Went on the market with agent 1 for £172k and I rejected an offer after a few days of £160k.

Fast forward to today and I am on the market with agent 2 for £160k, and the best offer I've had recently is £145k (I now need as close to asking price as possible to finance my next move).

- I'm getting the viewings in (so don't believe price to be an issue)
- The house is clean, modern looking and clutter free
- The agent is being honest with potential buyers as to the fact it is a small, back-to-back house (ie no rear garden)

but

- It is in one of the nicer areas of town and, as such, you could buy a larger place in a not-so-nice area fairly nearby for similar money

The feedback I am getting is that it is not big enough for people's needs (how big does a first time buyer need?!), in particular the lounge.

Admittedly, the lounge is setup for my/the girlfriend's convenience (ie 1 sofa facing the tv/dvd/stereo) so I wonder if people are struggling to envisage a different (more "normal" setup) of 2 sofas?

Is it worth investing in a pair of sofas and a flat-screen tv so I can show a more "normal" setup?

Also, the bathroom could do with a refit (it's clean but still the original peach bath/sink etc) but some people have advised that this might not be necessary and I could be spending money for nothing.

If anyone has any tips or advice, then all would be greatfully received.

Thanks in advance
Dave

trudiha · 15 January 2008 at 1:59PM

I don't think that getting viewing means that price isn't an issue. I've been looking at all of the houses in my price range but some very obviously offer much better value than others and some are just plain overpriced.

I think that you need to sort out your front garden, alright it's not as big an asset as a back garden but your house does have a fairly large outdoor space for its size and you aren't showing it to its best advantage. Paint the fence, get some plants in pots, cut the grass and get rid of the weed thing that's in the foreground of your photo, failing that take a photo from a different position.

I don't really like the 3D floor plan either, it make that place look much boxier that a 2D one would.

I think that the rest of the house/detail are really well presented. Good luck with your sale.

maninthestreet · 15 January 2008 at 2:10PM

A pair of sofas will make the lounge look even smaller - it's only 9 foot wide. If there is also an armchair in that room as well, I would remove it and put it in storage. You have a widescreen CRT TV, which is much bigger than the equivalent flat-panel LCD TV - consider getting a flat panel TV (you can rent one, rather than buy), and put that leviathan of a TV in storage (or sell it, assuming someone will want to buy it). Additionally, remove what appears to be a PC and screen from that room, and put into a cupboard/wardrobe somewhere when not in use.

SerenaGoode · 15 January 2008 at 2:10PM

What have comparable properties sold for - I see plenty of Stanton Close sales on houseprices.co.uk but not sure which are similar properties?

Anyhow, I think your problem here may be one of timing. In a boom market you can get inflated prices for this kind of property. It's no-one's ideal choice because it's so cramped and small, but people see it as a step on to the housing ladder when the market is running out of sight.

But when the market stagnates or possibly falls, this is no longer the case. People get fussier about what they want, and start to look at (for instance) 2 beds and a garden as the least they'll consider. So demand falls for this kind of property and the market price also falls.

Depending on how optimistic you are about the medium term for the market, you could take an offer now, or hang on until the market improves (could be a long wait). I'm not convinced that spending money on the property will help that much - it's the fundamental issues of space that will be worrying people.

(To be honest I didn't know they still built back-to backs, but that's a different subject - I suppose it's more like a maisonette - in fact you might find that is a better description for the EA to use. "Back-to-back" has bad connotations for me at least, as it is generally a word used to describe the old slums).

PRINCE$$ · 15 January 2008 at 2:17PM

I recently bought a 1 bed back to back house fairly near to yours and I actually had a look at your advert at the time as it fit my criteria. The reason I didn't consider viewing it is the size unfortunately. The bedroom in particular is tiny. The house I bought is about the same distance to the stations, much bigger, and slightly cheaper though the area I live in is probably not quite as nice. Sorry if I sound negative, it is lovely :-)
BTW - I agree about the 3D floorplan, it makes it look like a shoebox!

PasturesNew · 15 January 2008 at 2:31PM

wiggy001 wrote: »

It was valued at around £170k back in May last year. Went on the market with agent 1 for £172k and I rejected an offer after a few days of £160k.

When an estate agent markets a property at a price, they are really just guessing based on what similar properties have sold for in the last year and so they bung a bit on and see if anybody bites.

The market has changed significantly in the last 6 months, and shows signs of continuing to do so. Buyers are more wary now.

A house is only worth what somebody is prepared to pay for it and what a seller is willing to sell it for. So far, the house has proven that it is worth £160k as you had a willing buyer at that price.

The house has now been on the market for 8 months. In that time you have had 1 offer. If you had taken that offer at the time, it would have been sold for the price you are now asking.

So you are now probably chasing the market down.

Although other houses are priced similarly - and looking at what's available on the rightmove site for a 1-bed house I'd certainly look at yours as one of my "top 5 for viewing", the fact they are for sale and not sold is an indicator that perhaps the market is now not willing to pay these prices.

wiggy001 wrote: »

the best offer I've had recently is £145k (I now need as close to asking price as possible to finance my next move).

So the house is now worth £145k. Have you tried offering less for the house you are after?

wiggy001 wrote: »

- I'm getting the viewings in (so don't believe price to be an issue)

People starting to look at houses will usually view all those in their price range that don't look too awful.

wiggy001 wrote: »

- The house is clean, modern looking and clutter free

As are your competitors probably.

wiggy001 wrote: »

- The agent is being honest with potential buyers as to the fact it is a small, back-to-back house (ie no rear garden)

I think calling it a back to back house might put off potential viewers. In my opinion, one of these is nicer looking than a straight terrace. But the name, to me, is offputting.

wiggy001 wrote: »

- It is in one of the nicer areas of town and, as such, you could buy a larger place in a not-so-nice area fairly nearby for similar money

Without local knowledge we only have your word for this, so I will discount it for the purposes of my answer.

wiggy001 wrote: »

The feedback I am getting is that it is not big enough for people's needs (how big does a first time buyer need?!), in particular the lounge.

If it is small, perhaps it is. Have you compared your room sizes to your competitors?
Or perhaps it feels small: lighting, furniture layout, colours.

The lounge is 9', which can be a challenging space.

wiggy001 wrote: »

Admittedly, the lounge is setup for my/the girlfriend's convenience (ie 1 sofa facing the tv/dvd/stereo) so I wonder if people are struggling to envisage a different (more "normal" setup) of 2 sofas?

Is it worth investing in a pair of sofas and a flat-screen tv so I can show a more "normal" setup?

Seems excessive. However, you might like to spend an hour or so shuffling the room round to see if you can get it to look better/bigger. When I was selling my house I used to spend time prior to any viewing sorting out the house - which included moving furniture about JUST for the viewing, then moving it back again when they walked out the door.

wiggy001 wrote: »

Also, the bathroom could do with a refit (it's clean but still the original peach bath/sink etc) but some people have advised that this might not be necessary and I could be spending money for nothing.

People would prefer to see a white set, but there's no point going to the trouble/expense as the EA hasn't said this is a problem. I have seen on the TV where people have gone and got some free designs/plans and put those out for viewers, so they can see what could be done and the quotes for how much. It helps them visualise it rather than letting them think it'd be too expensive and not worth the hassle.

At the end of the day, the market has changed a lot since you put your house up for sale. People are finding it harder to obtain mortgages and are holding off in case prices drop. They don't want to be in negative equity by this time next year if they can see that by waiting a bit they might be able to get a 2-bed for the same money next year.

A lot will tell you to drop the price. I would on the surface agree. Being the cheapest of available options would always help it to sell quicker. I have no idea if that would be right for your house/location. But it's certainly something you need to have a full and frank discussion face to face with your estate agent about.

Good luck!

SerenaGoode · 15 January 2008 at 2:40PM

PasturesNew wrote: »

A house is only worth what somebody is prepared to pay for it and what a seller is willing to sell it for. So far, the house has proven that it is worth £160k as you had a willing buyer at that price.

I agree with the rest of you post. Just a niggle with this statement - what that offer proves is that it was worth £160K in May. It doesn't provve anything about what it is worth now.

One consolation for the OP is that if the market price of your place is falling, you may find the same applies to other places you want to move to. If you bite the bullet and take a lower price, you may be able to get something for good value elsewhere.

Also, there's not much you can do about this - but when something has been on the market for 8 months that becomes a problem in itself. I kept an eye on the area I was interested in for ages before starting to seriously search - many people do the same and keep an eye on all property in their price range on Rightmove. When something fails to sell for months on end it starts to look like a turkey even if that isn't fair.

Good luck anyway.

PasturesNew · 15 January 2008 at 2:44PM

SerenaGoode wrote: »

I agree with the rest of you post. Just a niggle with this statement - what that offer proves is that it was worth £160K in May. It doesn't provve anything about what it is worth now.

I know. It's always hard to word this little essential factor so it is received as implied and not ripped apart by people.

I am always torn between not mentioning it or opening a hornet's nest.

To be honest, if I were in his position right now I'd have taken the £145k and banked it, grateful it was all over. Living with the uncertainty of a sale is a nightmare I lived with for a year.

oasisfeverish · 15 January 2008 at 3:08PM

Just my thoughts as I'm not to far from Orpington.

In the advert;

No mention of the huge green space around the corner, with playground facilities, could help potential buyers visualise that the lack of garden, could be compensated by the open space that they could use.

Carlton Parade - no mention in the advert about local amenities and just a bit further is Orpington Walnut Shopping Centre either.

Cray Ave and Sevenoaks Way - loads of superstores.

There's no getting away from the fact that's it's a 1 bed smallish starter home, but you need to get the EA to be more descriptive about the local area to make up for it.

Try to remember what made you first want to buy it, and see if this can fit with today's advert.

wiggy001 · 15 January 2008 at 3:19PM

Hi all, and thanks for the quick feedback - much appreciated.

In answer to a couple of points:

Trudiha: fair point about the "weed thing" - I'll tell my neighbour to tidy up the remnants of their once-neat hedge! As for the floorplan, there is a 2d one as well. TBH, that 3d one wasn't there a couple of days ago, so I'll speak to my agent about that - it doesn't even accurately show the layout!

Maninthestreet - no armchair as well, just one sofa. My point was that two small sofas and a flatscreen tv instead of one sofa and my leviathan tv may help people visualise how they'd probably have it? Fair point about the pc - that'll be gone for the next viewing.

Serenagoode - of those showing on Houseprices.co.uk, only number 14 is the same size as mine (albeit with no front garden and only 1 parking bay to the front, 1 other elsewhere in the close). Other 1 bed houses have sold for similar amounts in other roads nearby. Also, the estate agent isn't using "Back to back" (just me!), they call it a terraced (as per the advert)

Prince$$ - Do you mind if I ask where you bought in the end, as it's naturally a struggle to find out what people are choosing over my place, and whether you are from the area or bought to let? Much appreciated...

PasturesNew - I've actually had several offers over the 8 months from £160k when it first went on through to £145k recently. had about 5 offers in total.

Offering less for my next purchase doesn't really help too much - £160ish is kind of my break even point, so if I get £15k under this, I'll be £15k-ish in debt after moving. If I get £15k off the next house I buy, that's only £15k over the next 20+ years.

As for competitors, yes mine is probably on the smaller side to most of the same price, but most are in what is locally considered to be less desirable areas (really trying not to sound like a snob with that comment!), or without the off-street parking. fair point though.

Have done the juggle things about bit but have been given some more ideas from posts here, so will see what I can do in this respect.

Thanks again for all the advice:beer:

SerenaGoode · 15 January 2008 at 3:26PM

wiggy001 wrote: »

Serenagoode - of those showing on Houseprices.co.uk, only number 14 is the same size as mine (albeit with no front garden and only 1 parking bay to the front, 1 other elsewhere in the close). Other 1 bed houses have sold for similar amounts in other roads nearby. Also, the estate agent isn't using "Back to back" (just me!), they call it a terraced (as per the advert)

Hi, the Rightmove link says 'back to back'.

I hope you get what you want, but you have to bear in mind that in a falling market, the previous sale prices may not be matched by what you can get.

Cheers.

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Back-to-back start home not selling - advice?

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