Can te guarantor terminate the tenancy agreement if still in fixed term?

drv1981 · 19 January 2009 at 7:29AM

Hi guys, further on from my previous thread re guarantors:
http://www.landlordzone.co.uk/forums...t=16000&page=3

I need to consider this.

The contract for tenancy does not include me anywhere only in guarantor form, which can be seen on the thread link shown which i have typed out etc.

If the tenancy contract was fixed for 6 months and periodic there after, and i as acting guarantor gave notice to termnate the contract in month 4, 2 months notice to end of the tenancy agreement prior to 6 month fixed ending o, can this be accepted as notice, where the tenants and guarantor no longer have communication and the tenants would not move out on their own accord, thus if a guarantor is guaranteeing the tenants, and a level of consideration has passed from the tenants to guarantor as no explicit consideration other than the tenants benefit is indicated in my guarantee form, then surely as i have the power to guarantee the tenants indefinetly, i have the power to serve notice to end it?? as i am the reason the contract was accepted, there has to be some level of detriment to pass to the landlord in termination.

see case:
http://www.landlordzone.co.uk/forums...t=16000&page=3

for all details re guarantee form i filled in in 2006

thanks

pinkshoes · 19 January 2009 at 9:18AM

Surely you would need to hand in your 2 months notice as guarantor, saying that as from <date>, you will no longer be guarantor for <name people> living at <name address>?

This then gives the landlord the opportunity to either accept them as tenants without a guarantor, or to give them their 2 months notice to move out.

tbs624 · 19 January 2009 at 10:40AM

drv1981 - my view differs from that of Pinkshoes and you have already had good advice from both Jeffrey and Paul G over on LLzone. Ultimately, this would be one for the courts to decide. As a guarantor you can't give notice to "terminate the contract".

Signing up as a guarantor is not something you can dip in and out of - it's not a commitment to be taken lightly, and if you are unsure of the full meaning of this type of document, the time to have got proper legal advice was *before* you signed up.

As with anything else, you can try to negotiate the terms then & get the guarantor agreement reworded - ie I'll only do it for the intial fixed term or, as in the case of parents of students being asked to sign up as guarantors on a JS&L contract, signing that you will only guarantee the equivalent proportion of your own's offspring's rent to a maximum of £xxx rather than standing with JS&L alongside other parents guarantors for the whole lot should the other tenants default. (The LL is of course entitled to refuse to accept this and to look for other tenants)

Debt_Free_Chick · 19 January 2009 at 10:48AM

I think you could be in a sticky spot here. From your other post, the tenants have done a runner owing three months rent and the LL is taking you to court for the debt ....yes?

As I understand it you're relying on this part of the guarantor's agreement:-

If the Tenancy Agreement is assigned with your consent, or is terminated by agreement or by re-entry or otherwise all future liability on my part shall cease

thus if a guarantor is guaranteeing the tenants, and a level of consideration has passed from the tenants to guarantor as no explicit consideration other than the tenants benefit is indicated in my guarantee form, then surely as i have the power to guarantee the tenants indefinetly, i have the power to serve notice to end it??

The clause in the agreement is not giving you an option to terminate either the tenancy or the guarantor agreement. The clause simply confirms that when the tenancy ends, your liability as the guarantor will also end.

Essentially, you were agreeing to be the guarantor for so long as the tenancy continued.

The LL should have acted when you wrote to say that you were no longer willing to be a guarantor. But then, you should have taken (more) action when the LL failed to respond to you. I doubt that the Court will let you completely off the hook - but you might not be held liable for the full amount.

To be honest, I think you need a solicitor to look over the entire story and paperwork for this. Although I note that 2 solicitors replied to the other thread and thought you were liable

You are likely to need a clever creative solictor to get out of your guarantor obligations - but you'll need to weigh up the cost of advice against the debt that the LL is chasing you for.

Interesting situation - let us know how you get on. And hang around for other replies as some may disagree with my view of the situation.

(Posted before I saw tbs624's post)

tiggerjr82 · 30 June 2010 at 4:32PM

Hi all,

I have a tenant with her mother as guarantor (think I have posted about this before but want to clarify something) - the mother sent me a letter saying she no longer wanted to be guarantor (please note that the fixed term has ended and the tenancy is now rolling) - I served 2 months notice to the tenant because of this. If the tenant does not vacate on the stated date I assume the guarantor remains liable for rent until the tenant leaves the property?
Thanks

King_Drax_I · 8 May 2011 at 11:22PM

What happens if the AST has ended (the six months is up) and there is no new contract? In this particular case there is no apparent clause in the contract saying what happens once the six months is up. It doesn't mention periodic anything, there's been no re-negotiation or anything. Any ideas?

BitterAndTwisted · 9 May 2011 at 12:38AM

A periodic tenancy naturally arises once the fixed-term has ended and the tenant carries on occupying the property. No new contact is required, all of the terms of the original agreement still hold

King_Drax_I · 10 May 2011 at 9:11PM

I'm sure they do, but the guarantor can be released. Here's a clipping from a document on the subject from the Citizens' Advice Bureau internal advice sheets:

"In some situations, a guarantor will have guaranteed the rent for a fixed term tenancy, for example, a twelve month assured shorthold tenancy. If the fixed term expires and the tenancy continues as a periodic tenancy, or a new fixed term tenancy is agreed without the involvement of the guarantor, the guarantor's responsibility will usually come to on end".

G_M · 10 May 2011 at 9:35PM

Don't understand why a 2 year old thread has been resurrected but:

You need to read the wording on the Deed of Guarantee that you signed.

Normally it is for the life of the tenancy, so if it moves from fixed term to periodic the guarantee liability remains.

The whole point of a guarantee is that the tenant, for some reason, is not reliable or trusted. That reliability/trust may be earned during the period of the fixed term, but only the parties involved can decide.

However, the landlord, when setting up a tenancy + guarantee, cannot anticipate whether he will have gained sufficient trust by the end of the fixed term, so is likely to want to ensure that the Guarantee continues.

Cissi · 10 May 2011 at 9:37PM

King_Drax_I wrote: »

I'm sure they do, but the guarantor can be released. Here's a clipping from a document on the subject from the Citizens' Advice Bureau internal advice sheets:

"In some situations, a guarantor will have guaranteed the rent for a fixed term tenancy, for example, a twelve month assured shorthold tenancy. If the fixed term expires and the tenancy continues as a periodic tenancy, or a new fixed term tenancy is agreed without the involvement of the guarantor, the guarantor's responsibility will usually come to on end".

(My emphasis)

Yes, but the OP has tried to terminate the agreement 4 months into the initial 6-month term. No chance in my opinion, sorry! This illustrates the dangers of signing up to be a guarantor I'm afraid...

bris · 10 May 2011 at 10:37PM

A guarantor will move onto a periodic tenancy with the tenant and can't end it it. The guarantor can give the required notice to end it but if the tenant fails to vacate the property then the guarantor remains liable until they do. I use guarantors for about half of my tenants and these are legally binding terms (Scottish law) however a guarantor does not have to agree to a new fixed term.
This is point 6 and 7 from my guarantor agreements

6. If the tenancy is for a fixed term, then this guarantee applies for the whole of the term and is not revocable during that term.

7. If the tenancy is periodic or has become periodic by agreement or the operation of law, then this guarantee may be terminated by written notice by the Guarantor subject to the Tenant vacating at the earliest legally permissible date required for possession. If the Tenant fails to vacate on this earliest date then the guarantee shall continue until the Tenant vacates.

Can te guarantor terminate the tenancy agreement if still in fixed term?

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