Something everyone should consider

Beate · 21 June 2007 at 3:00PM

I know!

BANKBANDIT_2 · 21 June 2007 at 3:04PM

. hahahahaahhaahahhaahah SORRY :A

you lost me along time ago

crazyworld_2 · 21 June 2007 at 3:12PM

LozBingley wrote: »

Where are you getting this -£35 from :rotfl:

I'm getting the -£35 from the balance Scottjack said they started with.

They had a balance of -£10, the bank then applied a charge of £25, their balance is now -£35

I don't see how that is so difficult to comprehend. However, please use as many of those little smiley faces as you feel appropriate:D

A certain percentage of any future deposit over the original £25 charge is then applied to the original balance of -£10. And in addition is short of what it should be, on top of the penalty charge, as the examples i've already given show.

As i've said previously, i've been through my statements and noticed a discrepancy between what I thought the difference should be because of the charges, and what it actually was, before I realised what i've said in this thread is the case.

Ok, i'll play. Just on your first example:

"I have £20 in my account
I take out £30 (oops) I'm now at -£10
The bank charges me £30. I'm now at -£40
I put in £50 and I'm at +£10 which is down by £30 that the bank took"

In the above case you appear to be accepting that although you've deposited £50, you've already lost the £30 from the charge, as you said "the bank charges me £30", and you've also acknowledged that you're still down by £30 after covering the charge with £30 of the deposit and an additional £20 of that £50.

I'm not arguing with you on that at all, you're right, you've lost out on more than the £30 charge.

crazyworld_2 · 21 June 2007 at 3:18PM

Well it seems pretty simple to me, you've already been charged by the bank, and you're still short of where you should be after depositing more than the amount of the charge.

Anyway, must fly, have other things to do, nice chatting and all.

By the way Loz, please don't send private messages if you choose not to accept them yourself.

LozBingley · 21 June 2007 at 3:22PM

crazyworld wrote: »

Ok, i'll play. Just on your first example:

"I have £20 in my account
I take out £30 (oops) I'm now at -£10
The bank charges me £30. I'm now at -£40
I put in £50 and I'm at +£10 which is down by £30 that the bank took"

In the above case you appear to be accepting that although you've deposited £50, you've already lost the £30 from the charge, as you said "the bank charges me £30", and you've also acknowledged that you're still down by £30 after covering the charge with £30 of the deposit and an additional £20 of that £50.

I'm not arguing with you on that at all, you're right, you've lost out on more than the £30 charge.

not at all - you've counted the £30 twice! Its the same £30!!

I've used the same figures on all 3 examples so tell me how much they owe me if I don't go overdrawn? :rotfl:

Look, if I deposit £50 and they have already charged me £30 then I affectivly deposit £20. ie £50-£30=£20 you can't count the £30 twice!

LozBingley · 21 June 2007 at 3:24PM

crazyworld wrote: »

Well it seems pretty simple to me, you've already been charged by the bank, and you're still short of where you should be after depositing more than the amount of the charge.

Anyway, must fly, have other things to do, nice chatting and all.

By the way Loz, please don't send private messages if you choose not to accept them yourself.

I do accept you just didn't work out how to send it mate
Same way you can't figure out your calculator :rotfl:

princesskez26 · 21 June 2007 at 3:33PM

LozBingley wrote: »

I do accept you just didn't work out how to send it mate
Same way you can't figure out your calculator :rotfl:

..........:rotfl:

LozBingley · 21 June 2007 at 3:50PM

crazyworld wrote: »

It seems it isn't my maths which is flawed.

Ok, i'll use the same example.

At a balance of -£20 following the deduction from your balance of the £30 charge you deposit £50.

You have effectively lost £30 of that £50 deposit. In effect, you've only actually deposited £20 from what your balance should have been (+£10)

So, would you not agree here that you've already lost £30? That seems like pretty basic maths to me.

I'll give you an even better example, I challenge you to go through all your statements, work out exactly what your balance would have been had the charges not been imposed in the first place.

Now, after you've done that you'll discover the account balance you should have now.

An example for you from a real case, without charges, a balance should be +£500, instead your balance is at -£500.

The difference there is £1000 agree?

However, when you add up all your charges, they only work out at £800.

How did that additional £200 get there??

If my maths is wrong, how do you account for that?

OK Here is the maths!

You start with +£10
You get charged £30 so you are at -£20
You add £50 which takes you to +£30
You have only lost £30 that you were charged! ie £50-£30=£20

Yes the difference between a balance of +£500 and -£500 is £1000
£500 - £800 = -£300 there must be some more transaction for the £200!

There are times when a bank balance is higher than you available balance! When you deposit a cheque it takes several days to clear. Your statement balance differs from your available balance durring this clearing time.

Another time this happens is when you pay for something using your debit card. If I purchase petrol it takes the money from my account, reducing my availble balance but it does not appear on my statement for 3 to 5 days.

Your example above is missing £200 but you have not told us all the circumstances around this example.

Thanks

LozBingley :rolleyes:
(an accountant for 21 years with 3+ years experience in banking)

crazyworld_2 · 21 June 2007 at 5:08PM

Tried to send you this message privately, but as you appear to wish to be some sort of cheerleader in an effort to debunk what i've said I will post it here, as shown below, the message below shows up when I try to send you a private message:

"LozBingley has chosen not to receive private messages or may not be allowed to receive private messages. Therefore you may not send your message to him/her."

(Funny that isn't it considering what you've said above. Seems that you're either lying, or that you weren't aware of the fact that you couldn't or wouldn't accept messages.):rotfl:

LozBingley wrote:

Its all about adding up the correct figures :rotfl:

I'm sending you this privately as I don't wish my own financial details to be posted on the open forum.

In the example I gave in that thread, I did make it clear that the figures were gained from going through my statements. Therefore the argument you posted about transactions not showing up on statements does not seem to apply.

Right, now to my own case, having been an accountant for 21 years, I hope you follow this:

For a certain period in time my "In" column (money going into the account) totals £7719.60, my "out" column is £8223.61 (including the charges)

As you've acknowledged on the thread, the charges not only are debited from my balance, but they have an impact on the effective amounts deposited right?

My charges total £701.50 for this period

So the amount I deduct from the "In" column is £701.50 to arrive at the amount i've effectively deposited, correct?

After making the deduction that totals £7018.10 deposited, correct?

I've also another column with "adjusted out" (the total amount out - the charges) which works out at £7522.11

As you will see from the above figures, if the charges had never been applied the total amount I would have put in would have been £7719.60, and the total amount out would have been £7522.11, correct?

So now, purely because of the charges, instead of being +£197.49, I am -£1205.51

That's a lot more than purely the charge amounts wouldn't you agree? Those figures are the actual figures from my own statements.

If you wish to say that I am wrong in the way I have worked anything out, then please tell me where I am wrong, and what the true figures should have been. If i'm not wrong, then I would advise everyone to go through their own statements very carefully.

LozBingley · 21 June 2007 at 9:58PM

hang on let me print this out - and give me 10 mins to tell you whats wrong with it

ps I just checked my account and it says...

<TABLE cellSpacing=2 cellPadding=0 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD>If you do not want to send or receive private messages, you may disable the private messaging system. </TD></TR><TR><TD><LABEL for=cb_receivepm><INPUT id=cb_receivepm onclick="toggle_disabled(this.checked, 'pmoptions')" type=checkbox CHECKED value=1 name=options[receivepm]>Enable Private Messaging</LABEL></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

Note the tick is there

You need to tick the first box just below your private message that says

<TABLE cellSpacing=2 cellPadding=0 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD>Your options are currently set to accept private messages only from users on your buddy list. If you send a message to a user not on your buddy list, they will not be able to reply to you.</TD></TR><TR><TD><LABEL for=cb_anyway><INPUT id=cb_anyway type=checkbox value=1 name=sendanyway>Send message to users even if they are not on your buddy list.</LABEL></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

Something everyone should consider

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