Tax issues with Marriage Allowance

Options
potts8
potts8 Posts: 60 Forumite
Name Dropper First Post First Anniversary Combo Breaker
edited 18 March 2019 at 6:13PM in Cutting tax
I seem to be having an absolute nightmare with HMRC with conflicting advice and information regarding marriage allowance and being a high rate tax payer.

As examples let say my gross salary is 52k per annum. I then pay 7k into my pension which is relief at source with Scottish Widows claiming basic tax on my behalf. I then claim the additional high rate back via HMRC with a change in tax code.
So in my mind my taxable income is then 45k which makes me a basic rate tax payer therefore eligible for marriage allowance.


HMRC can't seem to make their minds up on this and are now at the point where they can't answer this via webchat or the phone and now want me to write in.


Have I got it completely wrong?
«1

Comments

  • xylophone
    xylophone Posts: 44,427 Forumite
    Name Dropper First Anniversary First Post
    Options
    https://www.taxadvisermagazine.com/article/marriage-allowance



    Basic rate taxpayer
    The transferring partner must not have income taxable higher than the basic rate after the transfer of allowances; the recipient partner, meanwhile, must not be liable at a rate higher than the basic rate before the transfer of allowances. Bear in mind that gift aid donations and some pension contributions, for example, may increase the amount of income chargeable at the basic rate.

    Above seems relevant.
  • Dazed_and_confused
    Options
    As examples let say my gross salary is 52k per annum. I then pay 7k into my pension which is relief at source with Scottish Widows claiming basic tax on my behalf. I then claim the additional high rate back via HMRC with a change in tax code.
    So in my mind my taxable income is then 45k
    Have I got it completely wrong?

    Yes. Pension contributions to a "relief at source" scheme do not reduce your taxable income.

    They increase the amount of basic rate tax you can pay. Which in turn can reduce, or completely negate, the amount of higher rate tax payable.

    You say "I then pay 7k into my pension". So this would become a gross contribution of £8,750 once the pension company add the basic rate tax relief. Or do you actually mean you contributed £7,000 including the basic rate tax relief?

    Gross salary really has no relevance to someones tax position. Is the 52k what is shown, or is going to be shown, on your P60?

    It would be helpful if you could enlighten us with which tax year this problem relates to and what role you play in the Marriage Allowance application - are you the applicant or the recipient. You don't actually say.

    And finally what other taxable income do you have in the tax year concerned?

    Income such as dividends taxable at one of the 0% tax rates can have a big impact on things like this. You can lose entitlement to Marriage Allowance by being classed as a "higher rate taxpayer" but this doesn't always mean you have to actually be liable to pay any higher rate tax :o
  • potts8
    potts8 Posts: 60 Forumite
    Name Dropper First Post First Anniversary Combo Breaker
    Options
    So my P60 for 16/17 which is the year in question for my issue with the underpayment is 45k earnings and I paid £4050 into my pension including relief at 20%
    No other taxable income and I am the recipient of the allowance.


    So am I right in thinking all the pension contributions have done is made it so I have earned back the relief of the addition 20% tax however this doen't also entitle me to the marriage allowance even though I haven't paid a 40% tax this year?


    Am I trying to have my cake and eat it?
  • xylophone
    xylophone Posts: 44,427 Forumite
    Name Dropper First Anniversary First Post
    Options
    https://www.litrg.org.uk/tax-guides/tax-basics/what-tax-allowances-am-i-entitled

    The marriage allowance for 2018/19 is £1,190 and it enables a spouse or civil partner who is not liable to income tax at a rate higher than the basic rate to transfer £1,190 of their personal allowance to their spouse or civil partner. The recipient spouse or civil partner also must not be liable to income tax above the basic rate. The maximum tax saving you can get as a couple from the marriage allowance is £238 for the year.

    Note that the recipient spouse or civil partner does not receive an extra personal allowance of £1,190: instead they receive a tax credit of £238 that can be set against their tax liability. If the full tax credit cannot be used by the recipient, the balance will not be repaid.


    The question is were you liable to pay income tax above the basic rate?

    https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/tax-and-tax-credit-rates-and-thresholds-for-2016-17/tax-and-tax-credit-rates-and-thresholds-for-2016-17
  • potts8
    potts8 Posts: 60 Forumite
    Name Dropper First Post First Anniversary Combo Breaker
    Options
    xylophone wrote: »
    The question is were you liable to pay income tax above the basic rate?


    So my understanding would be yes I was liable however due to paying X amount into my pension I haven't paid any tax above the basic rate for that year.
  • Dazed_and_confused
    Dazed_and_confused Posts: 6,458 Forumite
    Uniform Washer
    edited 19 March 2019 at 11:18PM
    Options
    You posts are still a little confusing.

    In one you say,
    No other taxable income and I am the recipient of the allowance.

    So what is the problem? Or do you actually mean you were the recipient of the (Marriage) allowance but this has been taken off you?

    If so what have you received from HMRC? A P800 calculation?

    And you do understand that a Marriage Allowance recipient doesn't actually receive any of their spouses Personal Allowance. They get a fixed deduction of their tax liability. A maximum of £220 in 2016:17.

    If you have received a P800 can you post the details of the calculation. Its possible you think something has been taken away and it hasn't.

    But there could be a problem. It still isn't clear.
  • Dazed_and_confused
    Options
    Your pension position is as still unresolved as well. You originally said £7k into a relief at source scheme. This would make your P60 £52k.

    But you say your P60 showed £45k and you then refer to £4k going to a relief at source scheme.

    How many pension schemes are you in and what exactly happened during 2016:17?

    I would suggest avoiding all contact with HMRC until you have a better grasp of the position otherwise you will end up confusing them and it will need up even more complicated. And harder to unpick. If anything actually needs unpicking.
  • potts8
    potts8 Posts: 60 Forumite
    Name Dropper First Post First Anniversary Combo Breaker
    Options
    Your pension position is as still unresolved as well. You originally said £7k into a relief at source scheme. This would make your P60 £52k.

    But you say your P60 showed £45k and you then refer to £4k going to a relief at source scheme.

    How many pension schemes are you in and what exactly happened during 2016:17?

    I would suggest avoiding all contact with HMRC until you have a better grasp of the position otherwise you will end up confusing them and it will need up even more complicated. And harder to unpick. If anything actually needs unpicking.


    52k and 7k pension were example figures as stated and then it was requested for some actual numbers which I used from 2016/17.
  • potts8
    potts8 Posts: 60 Forumite
    Name Dropper First Post First Anniversary Combo Breaker
    Options
    You posts are still a little confusing.

    In one you say,



    So what is the problem? Or do you actually mean you were the recipient of the (Marriage) allowance but this has been taken off you?

    If so what have you received from HMRC? A P800 calculation?

    And you do understand that a Marriage Allowance recipient doesn't actually receive any of their spouses Personal Allowance. They get a fixed deduction of their tax liability. A maximum of £230 I think in 2016:17.

    If you have received a P800 can you post the details of the calculation. Its possible you think something has been taken away and it hasn't.

    But there could be a problem. It still isn't clear.


    My wife who earns less than 11k transfers the marriage allowance to myself.
    I'm not sure if I still have the P800 as as far as I was aware 2016/17 was closed off however this year I have been paying £523 due to an underpayment of tax from a previous year.

    From phoning HMRC they are telling me this is because although I had previously had the MA benefit from 16/17 the calculation after had deemed that I wasn't eligible.
    My P60 show that I didn't pay any high rate tax that year and the advisor on the phone told me to call HMRC and re-claim MA for that year.
  • Dazed_and_confused
    Options
    Firstly you cannot "claim" Marriage Allowance. If necessary your spouse would have to apply again.

    But if your P60 showed £45k then you would be higher rate for 2016:17.

    The Personal Allowance was £11,000 and basic rate band was £32,000 so income of £45k puts you firmly into the higher rate band.
This discussion has been closed.
Meet your Ambassadors

Categories

  • All Categories
  • 343.3K Banking & Borrowing
  • 250.1K Reduce Debt & Boost Income
  • 449.7K Spending & Discounts
  • 235.3K Work, Benefits & Business
  • 608.1K Mortgages, Homes & Bills
  • 173.1K Life & Family
  • 248K Travel & Transport
  • 1.5M Hobbies & Leisure
  • 15.9K Discuss & Feedback
  • 15.1K Coronavirus Support Boards