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    • peterg1965
    • By peterg1965 28th Aug 18, 12:11 PM
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    peterg1965
    SIPPs which offer access to cash deposit accounts
    • #1
    • 28th Aug 18, 12:11 PM
    SIPPs which offer access to cash deposit accounts 28th Aug 18 at 12:11 PM
    Are there any SIPPs which offer access to cash savings accounts which are accessible without going through an IFA?


    Having read a few old articles on this it would appear that you need a 'Full SIPP'. I want to move my HL SIPP into cash for two years and the rates available from HL are not competitive in comparison to what is available outside of a SIPP.
Page 1
    • peterg1965
    • By peterg1965 29th Aug 18, 7:21 AM
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    peterg1965
    • #2
    • 29th Aug 18, 7:21 AM
    • #2
    • 29th Aug 18, 7:21 AM
    A bit of searching and I have found some full SIPPs which offer this. Lots of names I have never heard of, but Standard Life is one of them.


    SL SIPP appears to offer 3 levels within their SIPP, the Level 3 offers access to external fixed rate savings accounts, but at a cost. I need to do a bit more research on charges associated with this.


    Has anyone any experience with the Standard Life SIPP?
    • dunstonh
    • By dunstonh 29th Aug 18, 9:40 AM
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    dunstonh
    • #3
    • 29th Aug 18, 9:40 AM
    • #3
    • 29th Aug 18, 9:40 AM
    Which Standard Life SIPP are you referring to? They have three.

    One via the Standard Life Wrap platform. One via the Standard Life Elevate platform and an older one via the old Life & Pensions book that is about to be sold off.
    I am an Independent Financial Adviser (IFA). Comments are for discussion purposes only. They are not financial advice. If you feel an area discussed may be relevant to you, then please seek advice from an Independent Financial Adviser local to you.
    • peterg1965
    • By peterg1965 29th Aug 18, 9:57 AM
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    peterg1965
    • #4
    • 29th Aug 18, 9:57 AM
    • #4
    • 29th Aug 18, 9:57 AM
    Which Standard Life SIPP are you referring to? They have three.

    One via the Standard Life Wrap platform. One via the Standard Life Elevate platform and an older one via the old Life & Pensions book that is about to be sold off.
    Originally posted by dunstonh




    Its the 'SIPP' I selected from the Standard Life web page on the Pension drop down. I think its called the "Active Money Self Invested Personal Pension" which has the three Levels of Investment. Level 1, basic limited options (300 funds), Level 2, more advanced (2000 funds) and the level 3, Full SIPP (with external offerings).
    • peterg1965
    • By peterg1965 29th Aug 18, 10:33 AM
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    peterg1965
    • #5
    • 29th Aug 18, 10:33 AM
    • #5
    • 29th Aug 18, 10:33 AM
    Just to add, I've spoken to SL and a not so knowledgeable person, SL don't offer external 'sippable deposit accounts' , so either the website is misleading or the person was not familiar with the SIPP investment options.


    It appears that there are quite a number of available 'sippable deposit accounts' with fixed rate offerings:


    https://!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!/accounts-for-pensions/


    The 2 year 1.85% fixed Investec/Close Brothers is what would suit my purposes precisely, but it accessing them through a SIPP with reasonable low (or ideally zero) additional charges to make it worthwhile.


    I have c£212,000 that I would transfer from my HL SIPP which I am still contributing to and want to access in just over 2 years time.
    • dunstonh
    • By dunstonh 29th Aug 18, 10:39 AM
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    dunstonh
    • #6
    • 29th Aug 18, 10:39 AM
    • #6
    • 29th Aug 18, 10:39 AM
    I think its called the "Active Money Self Invested Personal Pension" which has the three Levels of Investment.
    That is the one that will end with the sale of their old book. I dont know if they plan to move it to move existing to Elevate or let it be sold on.

    Just to add, I've spoken to SL and a not so knowledgeable person, SL don't offer external 'sippable deposit accounts' , so either the website is misleading or the person was not familiar with the SIPP investment options.
    Virtually all SIPPs have a cash account. So, maybe they were mixing that up with what you want. What you are after is very niche and not popular. So, availability is limited. However, some of the traditional SIPP providers should do the job. Less likely on mainstream multi-wrapper platforms though.
    I am an Independent Financial Adviser (IFA). Comments are for discussion purposes only. They are not financial advice. If you feel an area discussed may be relevant to you, then please seek advice from an Independent Financial Adviser local to you.
    • peterg1965
    • By peterg1965 29th Aug 18, 10:50 AM
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    peterg1965
    • #7
    • 29th Aug 18, 10:50 AM
    • #7
    • 29th Aug 18, 10:50 AM



    Virtually all SIPPs have a cash account. So, maybe they were mixing that up with what you want. What you are after is very niche and not popular. So, availability is limited. However, some of the traditional SIPP providers should do the job. Less likely on mainstream multi-wrapper platforms though.
    Originally posted by dunstonh


    Thanks. I am surprised that they aren't very popular, but there you go! I will get interest in the HL SIPP if it is all sat there in cash, but not very much, and it would amount to about £1100 over the two years.


    The list of available on the Investment Sense Website contains a lot of unfamiliar names/brands, and the ones I do recognise are IFA only products.


    Who would you regard as the 'Traditional SIPP providers'?
    • xylophone
    • By xylophone 29th Aug 18, 10:58 AM
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    xylophone
    • #8
    • 29th Aug 18, 10:58 AM
    • #8
    • 29th Aug 18, 10:58 AM
    https://www.closebrothersam.com/individual/what-we-do/self-directed

    https://www.closesavings.co.uk/sapphire-sipp-fixed-term-deposits

    A possibility?
    • dunstonh
    • By dunstonh 29th Aug 18, 11:14 AM
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    dunstonh
    • #9
    • 29th Aug 18, 11:14 AM
    • #9
    • 29th Aug 18, 11:14 AM
    I am surprised that they aren't very popular, but there you go!
    Pensions are generally wrappers for long-term holdings. So, that means investments. Cash is very short term and the cash account is usually suitable for that. Not many use them for deposits. So, its a bit of supply and demand issue.
    Who would you regard as the 'Traditional SIPP providers'?
    Probably the ones you haven't heard of as they are not usually the big insurance companies. James Hay, Suffolk Life etc. If you were to name some of the ones you have found that do offer deposits, we can say if they are known brands in that area.
    I am an Independent Financial Adviser (IFA). Comments are for discussion purposes only. They are not financial advice. If you feel an area discussed may be relevant to you, then please seek advice from an Independent Financial Adviser local to you.
    • Thrugelmir
    • By Thrugelmir 29th Aug 18, 11:36 AM
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    Thrugelmir
    Thanks. I am surprised that they aren't very popular, but there you go!
    Originally posted by peterg1965
    Commercial overnight deposit rates are very low. Banks don't require the money currently.
    “If the financial system has a defect, it is that it reflects and magnifies what we human beings are like. Money amplifies our tendency to overreact, to swing from exuberance when things are going well to deep depression when they go wrong. Booms and busts are products, at root, of our emotional volatility.”
    ― Niall Ferguson
    • peterg1965
    • By peterg1965 29th Aug 18, 11:44 AM
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    peterg1965
    I think its the Close Brothers SIPP which may hit the mark. They deal with HNWI so not sure if I fit the bill there!


    They are offering a fixed rate deposit account of 1.85% which would give me about £8000 over the two years which is perfect. No admin fee, and I need to check the costs of a transfer in and any charge for cash holdings.


    James Hay/My SIPP/LV where a couple of other names on the list.
    • dunstonh
    • By dunstonh 29th Aug 18, 12:16 PM
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    dunstonh
    Remember that the SIPP fees may exceed the cash deposit terms. Does it have to be a SIPP? You can get some cash accounts on stakeholders and PPPs which will have lower charges and allow UFPLS. The net return on those may be better overall.
    I am an Independent Financial Adviser (IFA). Comments are for discussion purposes only. They are not financial advice. If you feel an area discussed may be relevant to you, then please seek advice from an Independent Financial Adviser local to you.
    • peterg1965
    • By peterg1965 29th Aug 18, 1:58 PM
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    peterg1965
    Remember that the SIPP fees may exceed the cash deposit terms. Does it have to be a SIPP? You can get some cash accounts on stakeholders and PPPs which will have lower charges and allow UFPLS. The net return on those may be better overall.
    Originally posted by dunstonh

    No it doesn't have to be a SIPP at all, its the charges (minimum) and interest rate (maximum)on the cash that is the priority, I don't really care about the wrapper. My intent is to crystallise in 2 years, take the tax free money and then probably reinvest in a cautious income portfolio in readiness to start drawdown in about 5 years from now. If I have to transfer again in two years, so be it.


    It's just that I am keen to preserve the current value plus the next two years contributions and to take out all risk. I cannot afford to loose value in the next couple of years, for good reason.


    Can you please tell me who the SH/PPP providers are that you are thinking about Dunstonh
    • hyperhypo
    • By hyperhypo 31st Aug 18, 2:19 PM
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    hyperhypo
    very interesting to hear reasons for wanting to do this ...i have been dithering over when / how to transfer / create a cash pot of £50k within my current (150k) Sipp over next two years ...in readiness to spend the 50k over thewo years after that , prior to a DB scheme kicking in.
    Something's holding me back from doing it ...a siren voice saying keep it invested in your current mix of cautious/balanced MA type funds.

    So hearing what you're planning to do has encouraged me to do something ..i need to retain / cement of current value and only way to do so is to sell down assets now into cash. Did you ever consider cash like alterntives ...bonds ?
    • Thrugelmir
    • By Thrugelmir 31st Aug 18, 2:57 PM
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    Thrugelmir
    Something's holding me back from doing it ...a siren voice saying keep it invested in your current mix of cautious/balanced MA type funds.
    Originally posted by hyperhypo
    A fear of missing out? Rather than being happy with what you've got possibly.
    “If the financial system has a defect, it is that it reflects and magnifies what we human beings are like. Money amplifies our tendency to overreact, to swing from exuberance when things are going well to deep depression when they go wrong. Booms and busts are products, at root, of our emotional volatility.”
    ― Niall Ferguson
    • Gatser
    • By Gatser 31st Aug 18, 8:54 PM
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    Gatser
    Can you please tell me who the SH/PPP providers are that you are thinking about Dunstonh
    Originally posted by peterg1965

    Yes... Can we please name names....

    This is something I have done with part of my pension pot.
    I have used a MINERVA SIPP with INVESTACC Pensions Admin.
    The admin charge is £480 but on £212k this is only 0.23% and it gives access to cash deposits paying 1.85% over 2 years so you still make 1.6% net.... far better than those cash accounts paying a mere 0.25%!
    THE NUMBER is how much you need to live comfortably: very IMPORTANT as part 1 of Retirement Planning. (Average response to my thread is £26k pa)
    My Other NUMBER: ZERO Working Days to SEMI-retirement: Achieved!
    • hyperhypo
    • By hyperhypo 1st Sep 18, 7:16 AM
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    hyperhypo
    Thrugelmir...possibly that , but certainly a need to sort out the cash / liquidity absence within the current plan....

    Gatser...my aegon sipp charges 0.23% plus funds up to £250k but £75 each year for drawdown , so perhaps i should consider a transfer too..
    • peterg1965
    • By peterg1965 1st Sep 18, 12:55 PM
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    peterg1965
    very interesting to hear reasons for wanting to do this ...i have been dithering over when / how to transfer / create a cash pot of £50k within my current (150k) Sipp over next two years ...in readiness to spend the 50k over thewo years after that , prior to a DB scheme kicking in.
    Something's holding me back from doing it ...a siren voice saying keep it invested in your current mix of cautious/balanced MA type funds.

    So hearing what you're planning to do has encouraged me to do something ..i need to retain / cement of current value and only way to do so is to sell down assets now into cash. Did you ever consider cash like alterntives ...bonds ?
    Originally posted by hyperhypo
    The reason I am looking to do this is to minimise the risk in my SIPP between now and Sept 2020. I have a resonably complicated pension situation, the SIPP only being a relatively small portion of my pensions. In 2020, I need to pay off the mortgage of a second property with the PCLS from the SIPP and that will be a specific amount - £63500 and I am carefully managing the SIPP to ensure it doesn’t go above c£265000 in Sept 2020 for LTA reasons. I have a further c £42000 to add to the SIPP (inc reliefs) over the next two years and need to do this for income tax/ personal allowance reasons.

    If I can get a guaranteed 1.8% interest on the SIPP with a cash savings account that will work out perfectly. I can them revert back to investing the drawdown fund post crystallisation, and I would consider a transfer into a simple low cost PPP or SIPP at that stage to do this.



    Yes... Can we please name names....

    This is something I have done with part of my pension pot.
    I have used a MINERVA SIPP with INVESTACC Pensions Admin.
    The admin charge is £480 but on £212k this is only 0.23% and it gives access to cash deposits paying 1.85% over 2 years so you still make 1.6% net.... far better than those cash accounts paying a mere 0.25%!
    Originally posted by Gatser
    Gatser, that looks like it could be a good call, I have had a quick look at Minerva SIPP website and will be calling to discuss with them on Monday. £480/years isn’t so bad if I am getting 1.8% interest but I want to ensure there are no additional charges for holding cash. I also need to find out if I can still contribute over the next two years and not incur additional charge based on that.

    The website doesn’t list specific savings accounts from third party banks/building society, so hopefully that means that any ‘SIPPable’ saving account is permissible investment.

    I feel I’m potentially getting somewhere now!
    • Gatser
    • By Gatser 2nd Sep 18, 7:34 AM
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    Gatser
    The Close Bros offering appears ok if you are happy to have just their cash deposit account and the interest rate attached.
    I prefer a SIPP that allows choice from all available cash deposits
    THE NUMBER is how much you need to live comfortably: very IMPORTANT as part 1 of Retirement Planning. (Average response to my thread is £26k pa)
    My Other NUMBER: ZERO Working Days to SEMI-retirement: Achieved!
    • Gatser
    • By Gatser 2nd Sep 18, 7:48 AM
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    Gatser
    PeterG: Investacc do not list any cash accounts because you can choose any SIPPable deposits you want.
    They provide a great service with the form filling cash deposits set up too.
    The other charge you will find is once you commence DD, £100 to cover payment processing and HMRC reporting etc which seems reasonable...
    THE NUMBER is how much you need to live comfortably: very IMPORTANT as part 1 of Retirement Planning. (Average response to my thread is £26k pa)
    My Other NUMBER: ZERO Working Days to SEMI-retirement: Achieved!
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