nest refund, I've left my job.( sorted)

Marcon

stu12345_2 said:

marcon, wrong I've done the sums , I rent council and when I get my OAP pension in a few years, I will get housing benefit, council tax benefit, and pension credit.

if I accrue a private pension , all the benefits will drop
I fully intend that not to happen, it's a secret tax by the government 

I also have debts to clear over next few years, it may take much longer than a few years. everything is not black and white, in they you are losing out.
 a newspaper did the calculations a couple of years ago and proved if you don't own your own home and rent social in retirement , you be as well maximising all benefits pensioners can get.

and you have then also fully enjoyed every £ you have earned in your working life by avoiding a variable pension that could easily be worth much less than you've ever paid, pensions dropped 50% in the crash if 20008 and the internet bubble of 2000, 

You're assuming all those benefits will still be available...which could be your error, I fear.

Silvertabby

stu12345_2 said:

marcon, wrong I've done the sums , I rent council and when I get my OAP pension in a few years, I will get housing benefit, council tax benefit, and pension credit.

if I accrue a private pension , all the benefits will drop
I fully intend that not to happen, it's a secret tax by the government 

I also have debts to clear over next few years, it may take much longer than a few years. everything is not black and white, in they you are losing out.
 a newspaper did the calculations a couple of years ago and proved if you don't own your own home and rent social in retirement , you be as well maximising all benefits pensioners can get.

and you have then also fully enjoyed every £ you have earned in your working life by avoiding a variable pension that could easily be worth much less than you've ever paid, pensions dropped 50% in the crash if 20008 and the internet bubble of 2000, 

Are you sure about that?  You are likely to have accrued the full new State pension by the time you retire.  This is just a couple of pounds over the pension credit (PC) limit, so you won't be entitled to PC or the myriad other means tested benefits that being in receipt of PC opens the door to.

Yes, you may well get housing and council tax benefits, but that will be your lot.  

stu12345_2

that's over a £100 a week in top ups eg housing benefit and council tax benefit, far more than I would have to save in an auto enrolled pension,

ti get £5000 in a pension a year would mean it would have taken be worth £250,000  on a drawdown of 4% a year

the auto enrolment was brought in by current gov a a secret tax, to avoid them building social housing, cos they know there will be 6 million pensioners in private rents where the landlord will not take housing benefit, or to get folk to start huge mortgages when they can't afford them.and have to repay them for years and years, maybe 35 years. 

which the gov take as care home fees.

auto enrolments us a con.

defined benefit pension maybe the only way to go if you have one, but that is paid very a tax payers anyway.

i rest my case

booneruk

It's lucky the entire nation doesn't withdraw themselves from private pension saving and decide to maximise the lean on the state.

stu12345_2

booneruk said:

It's lucky the entire nation doesn't withdraw themselves from private pension saving and decide to maximise the lean on the state.

when homes where ok prices , it was fine to buy a cheap home and ,get a defined benefit  civil service, army, police  pension 

or you could get a regular other normal job, rent council or housing association, pay your OAP national insurance for years, get an OAP pension and get housing benefit, council tax too ups like my wife's parents did until they died recently.

now their council house is being used by a new family and rightly so 
 the gov in their wisdom lol made house prices unattainable, by having 0.5% interest since 2008 thus  inflating house prices , it's 13 times the average wage in my town to buy a home.
 the gov encouraged buy to let mortgages, refused to build more social homes.

 the gov knew this plan was doomed and so brought in auto enrolment. it's a stealth tax for their incompetence over the years.

what happens in the next  gov party will be very interesting, as nobody wants to rent private or looking at homes to buy that are stupid ratios  compared to average wages.

the more folk learn what is going on , the better imo

8 million rent social, 7 million rent private, there is no way on earth landlords will put 7 million on the streets cos their buy to let mortgage won't take housing benefit.

this auto enrollment is a social experiment as well as incompetence and wrong policies by gov of recent times 

the gov knows they have to start building social homes, they get their money back via rent over  the years. my council has been collecting rent on my flat since 1963 when it got built.
the council told me they made their money back many times over.

JoeCrystal

stu12345_2 said:

 the gov knew this plan was doomed and so brought in auto enrolment. it's a stealth tax for their incompetence over the years.

Nope, the whole point of auto-enrollment is to recognise that only a minority in the private sector save into a pension scheme, especially since most employers don't bother to contribute. Indeed, auto-enrollment is one of the rare successes of government policies from both sides. Since it kicked in roughly a decade ago, there has been a massive increase in the value of savings and, more importantly, the number of members saving or having access to a pension scheme to which the employers have to contribute.

The pension freedom for the DC schemes also made it easy for members to withdraw funds without paying taxes or little taxes if they plan to withdraw them carefully over multiple years.

Anyone not taking up auto-enrollment is essentially taking a pay cut overall. I am sure your former employers appreciated you saving them money and you paying more taxes overall.

The last thing to remember is that the most likely party in government is committed to reforms to workplace pensions and improving security in retirement. So, potentially more changes and likely better contribution rates from employers on top

stu12345_2

to get £5000 a year in housing and council tax top ups for me will need £250,000 private pension in drawdown or swapped for an annuity., that's a lot to save up , I retire in 11 years, if I don't pay bills, don't eat, don't go out, don't pay rent , council  tax,  clothes, water bills, ,I may get that point just before I die.

Ive read some reports and lengthy ones from institutions who admit auto enrollment only suits those that have bought a home years ago and own it outright when they are oaps, as fir the rest you will only penalise yourself if you rent eg social by enrolling into this stealth tax scheme by the current gov .

the more folk learn as more and more folk are becoming fewer home owners now and that will swing the vote, the grey voters are dying off.

JoeCrystal

stu12345_2 said:

Ive read some reports and lengthy ones from institutions who admit auto enrollment only suits those that have bought a home years ago and own it outright when they are oaps, as fir the rest you will only penalise yourself if you rent eg social by enrolling into this stealth tax scheme by the current gov .

That is interesting, but I haven't come across such reports before. Could you forward or link me to the relevant institution's reports? Again, it is not a stealth tax scheme.

stu12345_2

it was about 5 years ago I googled auto enrolment reports, I read a few and it did come to the conclusion it only works for those that own homes in retirement.

puting 4% away and 3% from employer above the min. threshold would result in a pension that would pay around £30 a week in retirement, that's if we don't have what we've seen in last 2 years, US equities halved, Google, Tesla stock etc
folk can't even afford to put anything away, bills are sky high, rents from buy to let sky high, house prices way out of wack with median wages, median , not average, that's important, a few high paying jobs creates a false number eg the  average.

if you are above 45 came the report, haven't got a mortgage that you will clear by 67, and can save into auto enrollment  at the same time,then under no circumstances should you auto enrol came the report., you are only penalising yourself for housing benefit and council tax support etc when retired

the gov are targeting young folk, but young folk won't and can't pay silly house prices, won't and can't pay private rent either, they live at home

the only proper solution is more social homes,  where rents are fair, and affordable , folk will have capital at end of month to spend into to the economy, businesses have customers ,and also where gov gets it's money back via the rents over and over again over the years, like as in the flat I rent, then the further generations get to rent the social home and so on and so on.

I think auto enrolment was implemented when gov realised it got all its policies wrong 

they thought how can we fool the young folk of today, and not reveal we made a pigs ear of things, yes,  create auto enrollment and do away with defined benefit pensions 

just like when John major brought in the national lottery , which I did a speech on at college in 1999.
where it is a tax on a tax for the stupid. you pay for it after your net pay when you buy a ticket , the gov takes a cut in tax on the tickets, one person wins millions, the odds are 17 million to one or something  like that, you have to be really thick to play the lottery, and the gov makes tens of millions a week in tax.!!!

stu12345_2

a little snippet I just googled.
yes it says you need to be in auto enrolment with 12% min, probably  much more than that, contribution for 45 years to make even a "reasonable"private pension

, and the average age of anyone in auto enrolment is 38., putting less than the 12% 


and they are going to be in for hell of a shock thinking they will get £100 a week . minimum when they get their pot when they retire.

I can imagine their voices , I put £40 a month away for 20 yrs, why isn't it worth £250,000.
, what a swindle 

https://www.moneymarketing.co.uk/opinion/paul-lewis-the-five-cons-of-auto-enrolment/#