I've been Suspended...

Scoobs85

Can I return? I think I would be able to however the relationship could be very frosty moving forwards but I have recieved a number of messages since from other members of management concerned. One of which has been really concerned about me as a person which is nice. The two managers in the suspension meeting didnt seem to enjoy what they were doing but I dont hold anything against them they were carrying out orders.

Whether I would want to is another thing. My team would welcome me back with open arms I know that, but it would be uncomfortable. I've never sworn at anyone and I think the desperate situation I've been in would sit well at a tribunal which is my full intention. I believe I may, as you say, get a slap on the wrist which I would accept. Hopefully the area manager can delve into the history. Unfortunately if you keep getting picked on and bullied your head is going to go down. I work on confidence, I'm at my best when I'm confident.

I really shouldn't be going through this. A previous employer when my mum passed away in 2006 literally threw an arm round me. Whilst I dont expect the same generosity (they paid me 2 months wages that week to make sure I had no money worries and told me to come back when I felt OK, it meant I returned in a week and half - that's what a fantastic employer does for you), some understanding and an arm is surely not too much to ask.

This employer harps on about mental health and how its important people are understood but they do not practice what they preach.

theoretica

Scoobs85 wrote: »

The problem is this manager is clever with words, I will give him that, he isnt stupid by any nature. Whilst I am not thick I maybe cannot explain things and am not articulate with my information.

You might find it worthwhile thinking before hand what you might want to say and how to phrase things. Maybe even take written notes in - but obviously don't write anything you would object to everyone else in the meeting seeing.

Scoobs85

I will definitely do that. In fact I may take a pack in with me ready

Blatchford

Scoobs85 wrote: »

I think the desperate situation I've been in would sit well at a tribunal which is my full intention...….

This employer harps on about mental health and how its important people are understood but they do not practice what they preach.

You have less than two years continuous employment, and so therefore you cannot make a claim of unfair dismissal. There is no evidence of discrimination in anything you have said either - simply having a mental health condition does not mean that all actions you don't like / agree with are discrimination; and there is no evidence that a period of depression since August will qualify as a disability anyway.

Tribunals do not care whether something "sits well" with them. They do not consider anything other than the law. There is no evidence that your manager is allegedly different with you BECAUSE you have a mental health condition, and so simply because you say he doesn't like you isn't going to make a case of discrimination. As already said, applying the employers sickness absence policy is not unlawful, it's his job. It may well be that your previous employer was "nicer" (although employers altogether are getting tougher these days, and they may not be so nice now) but that is not the legal benchmark. If that is the employer that you want, the answer is simple - go back and get a job there again.

I think you need to be realistic - the manager is not going to lose their job over your allegations. You might. So forget about what you think other people are thinking, don't try to take the moral high ground because that may well backfire on you. Stick to facts that you can prove.

pinkshoes

So at the end of your shift, the “store was not ready”, you gave a reasonable explanation why, your boss refused to let you leave but you had to leave in order to take your children to school.
You offered an alternative solution to phone later after the school run.

Your actions sound more than reasonable. It was unreasonable of them to ask you to stay beyond the end of your shift. It is your legal obligation as a parent to make sure your children attend school.

Why was the store not ready? Whose fault was this?

You should calmly fight your corner, but ultimately with less that’s 2 years service you can be dismissed for any reason.

Most places I have worked with a night shift have struggled to get decent permanent night shift staff. Sounds to me like someone doesn’t like you.

nicechap

Scoobs85 wrote: »

Thank you guys for your honesty. I appreciate the comments even if they are direct. There is no point in sugar coating it all and saying everything will be fine when I feel deep down it's not.

My line manager definitely has a problem with me, I have no issues with him. However after the conversation I did submit a grievance. There is evidence, my team has spotted differences in the way I'm treated and others are and how I am visibly uncomfortable when I am in. This is now with the area manager and they are progressing this. I will however in a meeting with them, which I'm sure will happen state I do not want them to lose their job. They may have put me in a corner but I'm not going to do that to someone with potentially mortgages, kids etc. I have my integrity in tact.

The long and short of this is the incident happened 45 minutes after my shift. I have to get the children to school and they know this. All other managers understand and comply with this request but I was told I could not leave until I gave an "honest" explanation of why the store was not completed. I stated again the reason why and the line manager stated he did not care, and that I'm not leaving. I eventually left at 8:15am and had to drive at a silly speed to get home and pick them up. At this point I expressed my concerns, that I feel he is bullying me. I provided a solution that I would call when I get home and can email but this was rejected and I was told to stay. I now have to hope I dont get a fine from the council.

I stupidly am not a member of USDAW, wish I was now but I will ask to take our union rep in. She has in fact seen me visibly upset due to this manager before.

The problem is this manager is clever with words, I will give him that, he isnt stupid by any nature. Whilst I am not thick I maybe cannot explain things and am not articulate with my information.

I do have some very good friends in the management team, one in particular I know would support me to the hilt but I cannot pull her in as I am concerned that if I'm gone she will be their next target and I am not prepared to do that to her.

There is clearly more to this than you are acknowledging or sharing here. My overriding impression is that you seem to have a playground view of working relationships.

Sickness is generally not a disciplinary matter. Excessive sickness normally triggers something commonly known as attendance policy. Does your employer have any evidence that you might not have been honest about your sick period, such as facebook pictures of you on holiday?

To be accused of gross misconduct would be something else like lying. And if you've been asked to give an "honest" explanation of why your duties were not done in the usual time, and you then left without doing so then I suspect you have given management more grounds to believe the working relationship with you has broken down.

I would be looking for another role.

Blatchford

nicechap wrote: »

There is clearly more to this than you are acknowledging or sharing here. My overriding impression is that you seem to have a playground view of working relationships.

Sickness is generally not a disciplinary matter. Excessive sickness normally triggers something commonly known as attendance policy. Does your employer have any evidence that you might not have been honest about your sick period, such as facebook pictures of you on holiday?

To be accused of gross misconduct would be something else like lying. And if you've been asked to give an "honest" explanation of why your duties were not done in the usual time, and you then left without doing so then I suspect you have given management more grounds to believe the working relationship with you has broken down.

I would be looking for another role.

I do agree that there is always two sides to any story, and what might appear perfectly reasonable based on one side of the events doesn't make that side of events the accurate one. We are all guilty of subjective perspectives on life.

But just to clarify, many employers actually do use the disciplinary process for sickness absence. And those who don't simply use a process that is pretty much the same thing with the same results, but called something different to make it appear nicer. Whether you do the former or the latter is not important provided you have a set process that effectively says that certain amounts of sickness trigger certain events.

And I'd have to say that it could very well depend on how many decibels were involved in the "raised voice", what was said in those decibels, and in front of how many staff or customers as to whether someone might consider it gross misconduct. A question I've asked but which hasn't been answered.

But what I do note about the accounts of events is that they are all related to things that have nothing to do with the actual allegation. The poster wasn't trained properly, they get negative comments about their work, their team like them, and a couple of managers would stand up for them if they could. None of that explains what they did or why it was reasonable, although they keep insisting it does. If they carry on avoiding the facts and digress into red herrings, the only account will be that of the manager, and in that case yes, you are probably right and they will need to look for another job.

Scoobs85

The conversation was in a meeting room and there were only two people present, me and him. I made a reasonable request and it was rejected, I asked again, it was rejected. This was some time after the end of my shift. I gave an honest explanation, this was also rejected. I couldnt say anything or do anything right. I was not abusive, aggressive, intimidating. I couldnt do that. Yes the decibels went up but that was due to the situation. I was completely fair.

I do have another job which I am now moving to. It is with a previous employer so I am not concerned about references as my previous employer will now fill that role.

I will still pursue legal action against this employer should a resolution not be found to my own complaints

Scoobs85

Pinkshoes thank you for your response. The agreement has been in place for some time that I need to leave around 7.45am to get home, pick up the kids and take them to school. Every manager has been fine with this, apart from this one. My shift pattern is 9 till 7 but I arrive around 8am to do my admin work and finish 7.45am.

My solution was more than fair, he would have got the information and I would have been able to get home to get the kids to school on time. This manager has threatened me with disciplinaries on more than one occasion for things I have not done.

I appreciate now he has all the cards. It's unfair as I honestly hand on heart have done nothing wrong. I couldnt pin the fault of the store being incomplete on my team. What we have is a DelVol system which you put in the amount of hours, amount of kit to work and that works out if we are up or down.

This is inaccurate. Some boards may be mixed meaning that employee needs to move across the store taking them longer to complete. Also each employees figures are at 10 hours but this includes breaks so we get 9 hours 15 minutes from each.

If you take into account this means if you are 4 hours up and have 10 employees in, you instantly lose those hours. Also for the mixed boards these take longer. It's how long is a piece of string.

ohreally

Scoobs85 wrote: »

I will still pursue legal action against this employer should a resolution not be found

How do you propose to do this?