If there isn't a hard-border what would stop Eastern European immigrants entering UK via Ireland??

David_Evans

Herzlos wrote: »

WTO rules require a nation to protect it's borders and the most favoured nation rule means everyone must be treated the same outside an FTA. So we may choose to ignore goods coming in from the EU and consequently the rest of the world, but the EU won't. There will be some checks for goods at least going into the EU.

Not on the Irish border there won't.
I would bet my house on that.

There will probably be some kind of (perhaps unofficial) agreement between EU and UK about that. ie keep duties etc the same in EU/UK.

Or 'smuggling' will just be ignored.

Rich2808

HAMISH_MCTAVISH wrote: »

Then build more houses.

Because we're not going to cure a housing shortage by also creating a worker shortage.

Yes - that old chestnut.

Politicians of all parties have been saying 'we must build more houses' for two decades now. Still waiting!

Herzlos

David_Evans wrote: »

There will probably be some kind of (perhaps unofficial) agreement between EU and UK about that. ie keep duties etc the same in EU/UK.

That's essentially the backstop the UK suggested, agreed on and now wants to drop.


If we don't agree on something with a backstop then I'm not sure what'd happen. The EU can't leave the border open, but at the same time they can't introduce a border.


We'd need to agree to a FTA with the EU so they can treat us specially by ignoring the border, but the EU would need to do something else to prevent illegal goods coming in from the UK. Random checks at destination for UK sourced products, maybe.

J_Nostin

Rich2808 wrote: »

Yes - that old chestnut.

Politicians of all parties have been saying 'we must build more houses' for two decades now. Still waiting!

And you'll carry on waiting whilever the fat cats are allowed to exploit the shortage to make huge sums out of what little is built and landlords earn their fortune from high rents.
Less houses = increased competition for buyers or renters = increased prices. It's not rocket science.
That's why there is an increasing disparity between council & private rent - Birmingham's average council rent is £350/month vs the average private rent of £850/month. People have to pay private rent because there aren't enough council houses any more ( that argument might belong in a seperate thread) so shortage = increased rents in the private sector.

It's the same for wages and the influx of low-skilled workers. If an employer can hire for a low wage there's no incentive to mechanise or otherwise increase productivity, so there's no wonder the UK's productivity per worker is poor. That might also be why wages have been rising since the referendum. Reduce the flow of cheap workers and something has to give, so either wages rise to attract the workers; increase mechanisation; or do without.

None of this has anything to do with Brexit. We've been both importing workers and not building houses for decades.

andrewf75

Thrugelmir wrote: »

Canada...

Australia..

Both have very high rates of immigration, surely?

mayonnaise

andrewf75 wrote: »

Both have very high rates of immigration, surely?

Yep, both Canada and Australia have a higher net migration rate than the UK.

bugslet

David_Evans wrote: »

Or 'smuggling' will just be ignored.

Smuggling happens now. There's been a wine scam going on for years which evades import duty.

michaels

mayonnaise wrote: »

Yep, both Canada and Australia have a higher net migration rate than the UK.

Strictly controlled by points based visa systems - net result, higher wages for lower skilled workers as they do not have to compete with incomers for lower wage countries.

Zxcv_Bnm

Rich2808 wrote: »

Yes - that old chestnut.

Politicians of all parties have been saying 'we must build more houses' for two decades now. Still waiting!

Never figured out who the 'we' in that is

Rich2808

Skilled builders and tradesmen from across the world can build houses - you can prioritise them like the Kiwis have under their points and skills based system.

And if you don’t have to house so many low skilled tax credit and housing benefit claiming people who aren’t UK and Irish citizens and aren’t net contributors you could solve demand and supply too.