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  • FIRST POST
    Kimou
    Wonga and ID theft
    • #1
    • 15th Feb 12, 4:40 PM
    Wonga and ID theft 15th Feb 12 at 4:40 PM
    Hi,

    I am curious to find out whether anybody has been targeted for identity theft and told that you may not be able to retrieve your money due to it being a loan comany that has taken it?

    I have just had over £2000 taken out of my Barclays account by Wonga. I've never had any dealings with them before yet someone has somehow managed to use my bank account to pay for four loans that have not been paid into that [my] account. And I have, apparently, no rights due to it being a finance company.

    It has been reported to the bank's fraud team and also Wonga's fraud dept. I've yet to hear back from them, but is it really so? Do I have no protection at all?

    Any comments would be much appreciated.

    Thanks
Page 1
    • DCFC79
    • By DCFC79 15th Feb 12, 5:00 PM
    • 27,192 Posts
    • 17,261 Thanks
    DCFC79
    • #2
    • 15th Feb 12, 5:00 PM
    • #2
    • 15th Feb 12, 5:00 PM
    My first thought is do you have any loans with any other PDL co's who are linked with wonga eg part of same group.
    Je Suis Charlie
    • meer53
    • By meer53 15th Feb 12, 5:17 PM
    • 8,207 Posts
    • 11,615 Thanks
    meer53
    • #3
    • 15th Feb 12, 5:17 PM
    • #3
    • 15th Feb 12, 5:17 PM
    Who told you that you have no rights ? Have you spoken to your bank yet ?
  • Kimou
    • #4
    • 15th Feb 12, 5:18 PM
    • #4
    • 15th Feb 12, 5:18 PM
    @DCFC79
    Hi, No. This is completely out of the blue. I don't even have bank statements delivered anymore. I have no idea how they came to have my details as I'm extremely careful with disposing my correspondence and my bank details.
    Last edited by Kimou; 15-02-2012 at 5:22 PM.
  • Kimou
    • #5
    • 15th Feb 12, 5:21 PM
    • #5
    • 15th Feb 12, 5:21 PM
    @ Meers53.
    It was the bank that told me this, or rather that I very very little rights. They need to ascertain whether Wonga are willing or not to give over the details of where the money went.
    I shall seek other independent advice, but I thought mayber perchance someone here has been in a similar predicament.
  • LovelyLeeds
    • #6
    • 15th Feb 12, 5:24 PM
    • #6
    • 15th Feb 12, 5:24 PM
    I have just had over £2000 taken out of my Barclays account by Wonga. I've never had any dealings with them before yet someone has somehow managed to use my bank account to pay for four loans that have not been paid into that [my] account. And I have, apparently, no rights due to it being a finance company.
    Originally posted by Kimou
    Have you ever agreed to pay a Wonga PDL for a friend or family?
  • Kimou
    • #7
    • 15th Feb 12, 5:30 PM
    • #7
    • 15th Feb 12, 5:30 PM
    @LovelyLeeds
    No. No dealings whatsoever with them. There's aboslutely no connection with me in any way.
    It's blatant ID theft, and this will manifest in any enquiries by the respective fraud units. That's why I can't understand that seeing it is so, how come I am not protected by my bank and only in the instance of it being a finance company that they can't protect me.

    I even asked the investigator "is there a potential for me to not reclaim my money" and he replied "yes, there's a real chance of that happening".
    It's beyond absurdity.
  • LovelyLeeds
    • #8
    • 15th Feb 12, 5:37 PM
    • #8
    • 15th Feb 12, 5:37 PM
    @LovelyLeeds
    No. No dealings whatsoever with them. There's aboslutely no connection with me in any way.
    Originally posted by Kimou
    I can't believe they wont try to help - keep us informed on any progress you make. Good luck.
    • meer53
    • By meer53 15th Feb 12, 5:41 PM
    • 8,207 Posts
    • 11,615 Thanks
    meer53
    • #9
    • 15th Feb 12, 5:41 PM
    • #9
    • 15th Feb 12, 5:41 PM
    I can't believe they won't refund either. They have to refund unless they have proof of why they shouldn't. It could just be card fraud rather than ID fraud.
    The OP needs to push Barclays for more information.
    • magpiecottage
    • By magpiecottage 15th Feb 12, 5:50 PM
    • 9,070 Posts
    • 5,545 Thanks
    magpiecottage
    FSA Rule BCOBS 5.1.11R says:

    " (1) Where a banking customer denies having authorised a payment, it is for the firm to prove that the payment was authorised.

    (2) Where a payment from a banking customer's account was not authorised by the banking customer, a firm must, within a reasonable period, refund the amount of the unauthorised payment to the banking customer and, where applicable, restore the banking customer's account to the state it would have been in had the unauthorised payment not taken place."

    That suggests that the bank is wrong. You might wish to contact them again and "remind" them of this rule.
    It is a statement of fact, not an advertisement, that I investigate complaints against small firms of financial advisers for a living.

    That is why I know my way around both the FCA Handbook (for financial businesses) and the Conduct of Authorised Persons Rules (for CMCs).
    • DCFC79
    • By DCFC79 15th Feb 12, 5:52 PM
    • 27,192 Posts
    • 17,261 Thanks
    DCFC79
    I reckon they got your details via your pc, is your pc secure, had any viruses etc.
    Je Suis Charlie
    • RobertoMoir
    • By RobertoMoir 15th Feb 12, 5:52 PM
    • 3,349 Posts
    • 4,080 Thanks
    RobertoMoir
    @ Meers53.
    It was the bank that told me this, or rather that I very very little rights. They need to ascertain whether Wonga are willing or not to give over the details of where the money went.
    I shall seek other independent advice, but I thought mayber perchance someone here has been in a similar predicament.
    Originally posted by Kimou
    You always have rights. I can actually see why they might be careful about situations like this (read below for what I think might be happening) but being "in finance" doesn't make any company into some mighty morphing power ranger of being able to take money from anyone they want with no justification.

    Without knowing what was said in the phonecall and how it was said, we're all shooting in the dark but I wonder if this is what happened...

    ... we get a lot of people here who take out PDLs then (for whatever reason) can't pay on the agreed date. These people are then often surprised and upset to find that the PDL company can (and does!) hoover their account out of as much funds as possible to get as much of their debt back. These people often complain here that "they've got no right to do that, now I have no money to live on" without realising that they've signed over to the PDL the right to do exactly that as part of their original agreement with them...

    ... so anyhoo, where I'm going with this, is that I wonder if the bank advisor thought you were in that situation, or if they're instructed to be careful about what they say to people in case that turns out to be the situation.

    I would write to them at this point, spelling out absolutely clearly that you've got no connection, no association at all with the PDL company and see what sort of reply you get.

    You do also need to consider something - if the debt was taken from your bank card - clearly someone has your bank card number who should not have it. I'd phone the bank to sort out this particular issue as a separate thing from the wonga problem, if you haven't already.
    Last edited by RobertoMoir; 15-02-2012 at 5:55 PM.
    Former Bailiff.
    I'm here to help but I reserve the right to be blunt and to the point rather than sugar-coat my replies.


    The problem with consolidation loans is the absurd idea that "more credit" is the answer to too much credit.
  • iaintw
    if you been a victim of fraud you should report it to police straight away and also your bank.
    if you got CCP or other specialist organistian the best thing is to ring them up.
    • meer53
    • By meer53 15th Feb 12, 5:59 PM
    • 8,207 Posts
    • 11,615 Thanks
    meer53
    I think you're right RobertoMoir, the bank will have to do their investigation first, but they should still be refunding the customer. Wonga will be able to tell them whether the debt belongs to the OP or not.
  • Tight as a Drum
    Why on earth are PDL companies allowed to pay the loan into one account and take repayments from another? Surely that's just open to abuse.
    If you're going through hell, keep going - Winston Churchill
    • rdchick
    • By rdchick 16th Feb 12, 10:38 AM
    • 1,644 Posts
    • 4,732 Thanks
    rdchick
    Why on earth are PDL companies allowed to pay the loan into one account and take repayments from another? Surely that's just open to abuse.
    Originally posted by Tight as a Drum
    Yep, they all seem to offer this I believe... which is madness...

    also loving the Power Ranger reference... nice! xxx
    Life is too short not to love what you do.
    • blacksta
    • By blacksta 16th Feb 12, 10:56 AM
    • 909 Posts
    • 447 Thanks
    blacksta
    Hope this is sorted asap - How can one protect his or her bank account details
    I owe £3233 @ 0%
  • Kimou
    I can't believe they wont try to help - keep us informed on any progress you make. Good luck.
    Originally posted by LovelyLeeds
    The bank is keeping their cards close to their chest. And yes, I most certainly will keep all informed so some foreknowledge can be gained for all.
  • Kimou
    I can't believe they won't refund either. They have to refund unless they have proof of why they shouldn't. It could just be card fraud rather than ID fraud.
    The OP needs to push Barclays for more information.
    Originally posted by meer53
    I called Barclays again this morning and they've assured me that their team is on the case, though they're powerless to do anything until Wonga reply to them. Once Wonga return their requests they can initiate a case and hopefully I can get a temporary refund whilst its ongoing- she says. She even had the brass neck to suggest I organise a temporary overdraft to offset the debt I'm now in. Probably at a cost. And I wouldn't be surprised if I charged a bank charge of £22 for being overdrawn.
  • Kimou
    FSA Rule BCOBS 5.1.11R says:

    " (1) Where a banking customer denies having authorised a payment, it is for the firm to prove that the payment was authorised.

    (2) Where a payment from a banking customer's account was not authorised by the banking customer, a firm must, within a reasonable period, refund the amount of the unauthorised payment to the banking customer and, where applicable, restore the banking customer's account to the state it would have been in had the unauthorised payment not taken place."

    That suggests that the bank is wrong. You might wish to contact them again and "remind" them of this rule.
    Originally posted by magpiecottage
    Thanks for this.
    Though at present it is pending the response from Wonga.
    The problem is that I've kept records of whom I've spoken to, but there have been so many people and from different departments; it gets a bit confusing on who I'm actually supposed to be sorting this out with.

    I've been with them over 25 years now, so a little support would be nice.
    I asked them that I thought they were supposed to monitor spending trends, and the woman said that due to so many transactions they can't monitor them all.
    I get paid weekly; I have a few accounts; All have, not much, but enough money to sustain me, so that alone should've set off some alarm bells to me acquiring a loan at over 4000% APR
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