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  • FIRST POST
    genesisman80
    Advice about an Employer who will not pay DEO of Employee
    • #1
    • 23rd Nov 11, 10:57 AM
    Advice about an Employer who will not pay DEO of Employee 23rd Nov 11 at 10:57 AM
    My Girlfriend is a PWC and we live together for seven years!

    We have been battling the NRP for six and half of those years through the CSA.

    In that time he (NRP) has tried every trick in the book not too pay including moving Tax Credits/Child Credits on children that are not his to his g/friends name and bank account, moving jobs, moving out of the house and then into a flat and then back again, going on the dole... etc

    He has had a job now for a year, he was contacted and instructed to pay CSA which he did very randomly.

    Finally he got a DEO and now his employer plays the game of not answering phones, blaming absent people from Payroll, blaming company accountant, to simply not paying.

    This has gone on for the last five months with the last payment received three months ago.

    What can my g/friend PWC do as the CSA seem to just issue threatening letters to NRP and his employer whom laugh at them.

    Many thanks

    Genesisman80
Page 1
    • NotSuchASmugMarriedNow
    • By NotSuchASmugMarriedNow 23rd Nov 11, 11:16 AM
    • 481 Posts
    • 1,061 Thanks
    NotSuchASmugMarriedNow
    • #2
    • 23rd Nov 11, 11:16 AM
    • #2
    • 23rd Nov 11, 11:16 AM
    Why do you think the employer won't do the DEO? What do you personally think his motives for doing this are? Because sometimes, figuring out the motive provides us with the answer.
  • genesisman80
    • #3
    • 23rd Nov 11, 11:23 AM
    • #3
    • 23rd Nov 11, 11:23 AM
    We dont know at this stage and time, we do not know the where NRP works yet somehow CSA have always told him where PWC works....

    We know its somewhere in Leicester! His Managing Director must think he is able to get around the LAW!

    According to less than helpful CSA Belfast if Employee goes to Employer and says I'm struggling with bills take less or no MONEY from me this month they can do that?

    Which would render a DEO pointless surely?

    Genesisman80
  • CornishBloke29
    • #4
    • 23rd Nov 11, 12:58 PM
    • #4
    • 23rd Nov 11, 12:58 PM
    We know its somewhere in Leicester! His Managing Director must think he is able to get around the LAW!
    Originally posted by genesisman80
    His employer has a legal obligation to apply the DEO, the company can be fined for not doing to.

    The workaround is the employee becomes a subcontractor such as an IR35 etc. Or there isnt enough money in his wages to pay the DEO. He is entitled to a protected income which is the same as what he would get if he is on benefits, so he might go and sign on and work cash in hand, illegal, but almost impossible hard to prove unless he admits to it.

    Go talk to him, tell him what you have said here.
  • genesisman80
    • #5
    • 23rd Nov 11, 1:15 PM
    • #5
    • 23rd Nov 11, 1:15 PM
    Cornish Bloke,

    NRP doesnt give a monkey's he has tried every trick in the book to avoid payment and now has his employer playing the same game.

    The NRP is a lousy parent and he play's games with his children and mind games with others.

    If I saw him in the street I doubt I could be civil!

    I really want advice so that I can tell PWC how to get the CSA to do there job (Belfast office anyone?) and to make sure they send in the inspectors they blab on about to force employer to do the DEO properly.

    Genesisman80
    • NotSuchASmugMarriedNow
    • By NotSuchASmugMarriedNow 23rd Nov 11, 6:28 PM
    • 481 Posts
    • 1,061 Thanks
    NotSuchASmugMarriedNow
    • #6
    • 23rd Nov 11, 6:28 PM
    • #6
    • 23rd Nov 11, 6:28 PM
    could the NRP and the Managing Direcgtor be the same person?
    • PreludeForTimeFeelers
    • By PreludeForTimeFeelers 23rd Nov 11, 7:38 PM
    • 1,836 Posts
    • 996 Thanks
    PreludeForTimeFeelers
    • #7
    • 23rd Nov 11, 7:38 PM
    • #7
    • 23rd Nov 11, 7:38 PM
    Cornish Bloke,

    NRP doesnt give a monkey's he has tried every trick in the book to avoid payment and now has his employer playing the same game.

    The NRP is a lousy parent and he play's games with his children and mind games with others.

    If I saw him in the street I doubt I could be civil!

    I really want advice so that I can tell PWC how to get the CSA to do there job (Belfast office anyone?) and to make sure they send in the inspectors they blab on about to force employer to do the DEO properly.

    Genesisman80
    Originally posted by genesisman80
    The employer have up until the 19th of the month following the deduction to send in the money, so if they take money from him on 1st October, they don't have to sent that money into the CSA until 19th November. If they fail to do this, someone will ring to find out why, if it is because the NRP didn't earn enough then it will be added on to the next collection. If the employer doesn't speak to the CSA then a warning letter will be sent out. If they ignore this letter then the CSA will send out their criminal compliance inspectors. I would call the CSA, and ask if the DEO has been missed - if so, ask them to issue the warning letter. If this has already been sent, ask if they are going to refer the case to Compliance. If you have no joy with the person you speak to, ask for a supervisor callback, that way the team leader will call you back within a certain timescale (used to be 2 working days, think it is now 1 working day).
    • Marisco
    • By Marisco 23rd Nov 11, 10:21 PM
    • 25,527 Posts
    • 68,928 Thanks
    Marisco
    • #8
    • 23rd Nov 11, 10:21 PM
    • #8
    • 23rd Nov 11, 10:21 PM
    if it is because the NRP didn't earn enough then it will be added on to the next collection.
    Originally posted by PreludeForTimeFeelers
    They can't keep doing that though surely? Would they not reassess him if he regularly doesn't earn enough to pay what they say he should? I'm not saying that is what has happened here, it's just a question out of curiosity really.
    • kevin137
    • By kevin137 23rd Nov 11, 10:46 PM
    • 1,503 Posts
    • 985 Thanks
    kevin137
    • #9
    • 23rd Nov 11, 10:46 PM
    • #9
    • 23rd Nov 11, 10:46 PM
    They can't keep doing that though surely? Would they not reassess him if he regularly doesn't earn enough to pay what they say he should? I'm not saying that is what has happened here, it's just a question out of curiosity really.
    Originally posted by Marisco
    Yeah right, i had 8 months of not earning the same money due to periods of assault or sick at my work, and notified the CSA on all occasions, and when i went back to work they crucified me....! Left me with protected income as the arrears had been building while on SSP....!!!
    • PreludeForTimeFeelers
    • By PreludeForTimeFeelers 23rd Nov 11, 10:53 PM
    • 1,836 Posts
    • 996 Thanks
    PreludeForTimeFeelers
    They can't keep doing that though surely? Would they not reassess him if he regularly doesn't earn enough to pay what they say he should? I'm not saying that is what has happened here, it's just a question out of curiosity really.
    Originally posted by Marisco
    They wouldn't do it automatically, if the NRP is earning a lower amount than when they was assessed (by more than 5% to breach tolerance) then he/she would need to notify the CSA, so they could set an effective date for a reassessment. They can only do that type of change of circs when either party notifies them, legally.
  • Blob
    It took 8 months for a new assessment to be applied to my case and I knew nothing about it till I got handed a bill! The fact that I was not going to be left with the PI meant nothing to them in the slightest, all be it that PI was less than I would be left with less than I would have received on benefits after any CSA deductions. The Appeals Service took them to bits! Just why can they keep on making the same mistakes on the same cases and nothing be done against the people that work in the CSA, or are they beyond the Law as they think?

    OP, I suggest and however hard it is to do this, take a step back and ask just who is responsible for the arrears build up? The CSA is the most inefficient gov dept ever set up. At the highest levels of gov they have been slated. The High Court ad Court of Appeal has also taken them to bits, can they all be wrong? ICE has a back log of over a year! Think about it, simply put they are hopeless and hit the wrong people to meet targets and get bonuses!
  • genesisman80
    Thank you for all comments so far, The NRP isnt a managing director he hasnt the skills or capital to form a company.

    The CSA and or Firm of NRP have messed up payments having paid erratically or having to be bullied into paying.

    CSA (Belfast) have said that they have sent out four warning letters to NRP Firm and also to an accountant who the firm said should be doing the deductions...

    Basically the NRP and Employer are doing smoke and mirrors to avoid, the NRP has a history of telling people lies about his Ex and how she lives in a mansion and drives the latest reg car when thats the furthest from the truth he really is a sad individual.

    The Csa rang up last week from 8 am until 11:50am and they kept getting the run around it wasnt until 11:50am that the MD finally answered the phone only to promise sending a BACS over to them for the non payment of Oct's money.... NRP gets paid at the end of every month!

    But June, July, Aug and Sept were all erratic and Sept money had to be bullied out of MD by CSA who used the inspector threat then... The CSA tell PWC that the case no longer has a case worker because they assumed that the DEO would sort things out, so its often between three people that the case is juggled between.

    I shall advise my g/friend PWC to chase up the CSA and demand to speak with Supervisor or call back with a view to going to Compliance Officers....

    Many thanks for advice given so far, feel free to contribute further.

    Genesisman80
    • PreludeForTimeFeelers
    • By PreludeForTimeFeelers 24th Nov 11, 9:07 AM
    • 1,836 Posts
    • 996 Thanks
    PreludeForTimeFeelers
    To save money on the phone bill, ask for a team leader to call back, they should do this within two working days.
  • Blob
    That will happen only if you are very lucky!!!
    • pd001
    • By pd001 24th Nov 11, 8:12 PM
    • 860 Posts
    • 239 Thanks
    pd001
    That will happen only if you are very lucky!!!
    Originally posted by Blob
    Totally agree!
    • poor country girl
    • By poor country girl 1st Dec 11, 2:30 PM
    • 32 Posts
    • 57 Thanks
    poor country girl
    if the employer is messing about the CSA should by now be either threatening or sending in inspectors (by inspectors read face to face officers) They have the ability to do this and it is a case of making a referral, not all officers are aware of this, so ring up and do some demanding - but always remember the person at the end of the phone is human too, a lot of them also have cases with the CSA and they don't want to hear what a .....the NRP is. Stick to the facts.

    Good luck!
    • poor country girl
    • By poor country girl 1st Dec 11, 2:31 PM
    • 32 Posts
    • 57 Thanks
    poor country girl
    To save money on the phone bill, ask for a team leader to call back, they should do this within two working days.
    Originally posted by PreludeForTimeFeelers
    Except the vast majority of team leaders have no idea what can or can't be done, they usually repeat to you what the case officer has told them - unless they have been a case officer, few of them have any idea what is actually involved in doing a case!
  • Blob
    Too right, they also have a problem in understanding the terminology of the CSA and have no idea about the Law they are bound by! This has been proved in Court when the CSA bod had to say he did not know the Law to the Judge, this produced a look of total disbelief from the Judge! It has also been proved in front of my MP, when 2 of them turned up, one was the Regional Manager for SRT!

    This must beg the question of just what chance have any of us got with them???
    • skibadee
    • By skibadee 1st Dec 11, 6:42 PM
    • 1,269 Posts
    • 764 Thanks
    skibadee
    Just to say the name of your GF's employer should not of been given to NRP.....as neither should his to her.
    • PreludeForTimeFeelers
    • By PreludeForTimeFeelers 1st Dec 11, 9:26 PM
    • 1,836 Posts
    • 996 Thanks
    PreludeForTimeFeelers
    Except the vast majority of team leaders have no idea what can or can't be done, they usually repeat to you what the case officer has told them - unless they have been a case officer, few of them have any idea what is actually involved in doing a case!
    Originally posted by poor country girl
    I'll admit that it depends on the team leader, the majority of the ones I've known have been pretty sound.
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