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CSA1 - does income include student loans and grants?
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# 1
drsue2012
Old 24-03-2011, 1:23 PM
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Default CSA1 - does income include student loans and grants?

Any help appreciated please.

My friend has a case under the old CSA scheme (pre-2003).

He is currently suffering from depression and his job is insecure. He has been offered a full time place at University. If he takes up the place, he intends to continue working part-time and apply for student finance. He will be entitled to a student maintenance loan and a maintenance grant.

I have scoured the booklet which explains how assessed income is calculated. Student loans and grants are NOT mentioned.

Are student maintenance loans and grants classed as income when calculating assessed income?

Thank you for your help.
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# 2
mrsspendalot
Old 24-03-2011, 2:14 PM
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Under CSA 2, as a student he would get a nil assessment, but if he continued to work part time and earned over 100 per week, he would get assessed on those part time earnings. Not sure how it works on CSA 1, but I can't imagine it would be too much different.
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# 3
drsue2012
Old 24-03-2011, 2:23 PM
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Thanks mrsspendalot. Just not too sure with CSA1 - as they seem a law unto themselves! He asked the financial adviser at the university - and they didn't seem to know but assumed that student loans and grants would be counted as income. I can find NO evidence for this anywhere - but he needs to know. It could mean the difference between him being able to take up his place at University or not.
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# 4
mrsspendalot
Old 24-03-2011, 2:37 PM
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I'm sure that later on Kelloggs36 will be on the board, and she used to work on CSA1 cases (if I recall correctly) so she will know a more accurate and definitive answer. I wouldn't have thought that Uni financial officers would know about CSA1 in enough detail to be able to answer that anyway, as it is very complex, and it is an old system now too.

Has he phoned the CSA to ask them?
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# 5
drsue2012
Old 24-03-2011, 2:54 PM
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Having had a lot of hassle with them - I don't think he is any longer capable of talking to them in a civil manner! I have emailed a general question to them - but I am very aware from some of the postings that their advice can be contradictory on different occasions. Just trying to gather as many facts and as much evidence as possible to enable him to plan, and budget, and make a decision about his future.
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# 6
kelloggs36
Old 24-03-2011, 6:51 PM
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i'm sure that the loan and grant are counted as income - but as with CS1 it isn't as simple as just looking at the income. What are the housing costs too?
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# 7
drsue2012
Old 24-03-2011, 7:10 PM
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Thanks for your reply. Housing costs - current mortgage is 341 a month.

His current situation is a monthly gross income of 2500, just over 1800 net of which he pays 513 to CSA for his 12 year old daughter. ((I'm staggered that nothing can be done about this as it seems a rather hefty sum. I'm in the other foot. My ex earns 57k per annum and I get 600 a month for my 2 daughters.)) I am trying to help him with a few budget scenarios - working 2, 21/2 or 3 days a week - with a resulting net earned income varying between 876 and 1330 a month, topped up with loan, grant and bursary.

I can't actually find any written statement that student loans etc are considered in the assessed income calculation.
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# 8
sarflee
Old 24-03-2011, 8:36 PM
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I know nothing about student income and CSA, but from a logical point of view (not that logic and CSA should be used in the same sentence), how can a loan be classed as income??
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# 9
drsue2012
Old 24-03-2011, 8:55 PM
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I have just found some information on the Gingerbread site, though I think it refers to new scheme . It states that a NRP who is a full time student is eligible for the nil rate of child support. However the PWC can ask for a variation if part-time earnings exceed 100 per week.

Does this also apply to CSA1? And does this mean that child support assessment disregards the loan and grant and the first 100 per week of earned income before calculating the assessed income?
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# 10
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Old 24-03-2011, 10:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sarflee View Post
I know nothing about student income and CSA, but from a logical point of view (not that logic and CSA should be used in the same sentence), how can a loan be classed as income??
As its a loan that u can potentially never pay off, unlike a bank loan.

I had to go on IS when i started college as i am a single parent and was told that i was unable to apply for a bursery, then when i started uni, this year, i had to come off IS as my student loan is classed as income. i get a grand total of 379 a month, which im assuming stops in may when uni finishes.
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# 11
kelloggs36
Old 25-03-2011, 12:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drsue2012 View Post
I have just found some information on the Gingerbread site, though I think it refers to new scheme . It states that a NRP who is a full time student is eligible for the nil rate of child support. However the PWC can ask for a variation if part-time earnings exceed 100 per week.

Does this also apply to CSA1? And does this mean that child support assessment disregards the loan and grant and the first 100 per week of earned income before calculating the assessed income?
You are looking at CS2 cases and this is CS1 so the rules that apply are different.
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# 12
drsue2012
Old 25-03-2011, 12:40 PM
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Thanks kelloggs36. I understand the rules are different - but where are the rules? Are they available to mere mortals? Is there some document or publication that I can look at?
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# 13
drsue2012
Old 25-03-2011, 4:53 PM
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If anyone else is interested - I contacted the CSA Helpline and I asked them:

If a full time student is in receipt of a student maintenance grant, a student maintenance loan and a university bursary, and also has a part-time job - assessed income under the old CSA scheme (pre-2003) will only take into account his part-time job earnings as income?

They replied:

Thank you for your email to the Child Support Agency.

A full time student is exempt from paying maintenance, and is entitled to work part time up to 24 hours per week without it affecting the assessment. Please see below for guidance on nil assessments:

A small number of Non-Resident Parents do not have to pay child maintenance.

These include:
Students in full time education (full-time means 12 hours education per week at a recognised school or college).
  • Young people (aged 16 to 19) in full-time non-advanced education (that is, up to A level, NVQ level 3 or equivalent);
  • Prisoners.
  • People living in a nursing home or residential care, which are receiving help with fees.

I'm still a little sceptical though - with the reputation CSA have and I have not seen this information written anywhere else!


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# 14
kelloggs36
Old 25-03-2011, 5:57 PM
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They used to be online but they took them off!!! I will check the orange volumes (still available online) to be sure, but the decision makers' guide was removed a while ago and this was what they used.
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# 15
creatureofthenight
Old 10-05-2011, 4:36 PM
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Hi, I am in the same-ish boat but its CSA 2 i think. Does any kind person know where I stand? I am off to uni in sept. I will be getting a part time nhs bursary and student loans. I am also eligible for child tax credits. My husband pays CSA for his 2 children and the child tax credits are taken into account with his earnings. So while i am at uni he will be the main carer for our children so wont be at work. Does this mean that the csa will assess our payments on the income from my student loans and CTC~??? i know when he was out of work before and I was at work the CTC where used to calculate a payment to the csa but not my earnings.
Once we know when I am busy at uni then he can go to work around my timetable but to start with it will be like this, Anyone know anything about this?? apologies if I have posted this is the wrong place
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# 16
mrsspendalot
Old 10-05-2011, 5:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by creatureofthenight View Post
Hi, I am in the same-ish boat but its CSA 2 i think. Does any kind person know where I stand? I am off to uni in sept. I will be getting a part time nhs bursary and student loans. I am also eligible for child tax credits. My husband pays CSA for his 2 children and the child tax credits are taken into account with his earnings. So while i am at uni he will be the main carer for our children so wont be at work. Does this mean that the csa will assess our payments on the income from my student loans and CTC~??? i know when he was out of work before and I was at work the CTC where used to calculate a payment to the csa but not my earnings.
Once we know when I am busy at uni then he can go to work around my timetable but to start with it will be like this, Anyone know anything about this?? apologies if I have posted this is the wrong place
They won't count any income from your student loans, but they may count the CTC. I say may because they don't always. Seems to depend who you speak to! I would plan for them to count it and then at least you won't get any surprises.
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# 17
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Old 10-05-2011, 9:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kelloggs36 View Post
They used to be online but they took them off!!! I will check the orange volumes (still available online) to be sure, but the decision makers' guide was removed a while ago and this was what they used.
For CS2 there's no such thing as the decision maker's guide these days, there's just online business procedures (well, on the CSA's intranet), which are updated quite often.
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# 18
creatureofthenight
Old 13-05-2011, 2:09 PM
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Thankyou Mrsspendalot I will err on the side of caution they are a little tricky to deal with at times
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# 19
creatureofthenight
Old 13-05-2011, 2:19 PM
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sorry me again...do you know if my husband should sign on while i am a student as he will be not employed for a time? He is self employed at the moment so how does that work? again if i am annoyingly in the wrong place in the forum i apologise .
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# 20
mrsspendalot
Old 13-05-2011, 6:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by creatureofthenight View Post
sorry me again...do you know if my husband should sign on while i am a student as he will be not employed for a time? He is self employed at the moment so how does that work? again if i am annoyingly in the wrong place in the forum i apologise .
He should only sign on if he is going to be actively looking for work.
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