Home » Forums

[MSE Lawrence]

Poll between 14-20 April 2009:

How many hours do you work?

An EU Parliament vote means the UK’s current opt-out from maximum working week laws is likely to be scrapped in 2011. This means it’ll be legally impossible to exceed 48hrs of work per week, regardless of the job you do. I thought it’d be interesting to see how many MoneySavers this change would impact, by asking...

In a typical week, how many hours do you work for paid employment?

If you have more than one job, combine the hours for each together. If there’s no such thing as a typical week, average it out.

01. Unemployed. - 3% (372 votes)
02. Unemployed (student). - 2% (238 votes)
03. Retired. - 2% (262 votes)
04. Paid Hourly: 1 to 15 hours. - 2% (250 votes)
05. Paid Hourly: 16 to 30 hours. - 5% (669 votes)
06. Paid Hourly: 31 to 36 hours. - 2% (259 votes)
07. Paid Hourly: 36 to 40 hours. - 6% (748 votes)
08. Paid Hourly: 41 to 45 hours. - 2% (286 votes)
09. Paid Hourly: 46 to 60 hours. - 3% (418 votes)
10. Paid Hourly: over 60 hours. - 1% (124 votes)
11. Salaried NO overtime: 1 to 15 hours. - 1% (85 votes)
12. Salaried NO overtime: 16 to 30 hours. - 4% (506 votes)
13. Salaried NO overtime: 31 to 36 hours. - 5% (587 votes)
14. Salaried NO overtime: 36 to 40 hours. - 20% (2506 votes)
15. Salaried NO overtime: 41 to 45 hours. - 10% (1185 votes)
16. Salaried NO overtime: 46 to 60 hours. - 11% (1381 votes)
17. Salaried NO overtime: over 60 hours. - 3% (348 votes)
18. Salaried WITH overtime: 1 to 15 hours. - 0% (57 votes)
19. Salaried WITH overtime: 16 to 30 hours. - 1% (105 votes)
20. Salaried WITH overtime: 31 to 36 hours. - 1% (84 votes)
21. Salaried WITH overtime: 36 to 40 hours. - 4% (466 votes)
22. Salaried WITH overtime: 41 to 45 hours. - 2% (270 votes)
23. Salaried WITH overtime: 46 to 60 hours. - 2% (296 votes)
24. Salaried WITH overtime: over 60 hours. - 1% (80 votes)
25. Own Company: 1 to 15 hours. - 0% (46 votes)
26. Own Company: 16 to 30 hours. - 1% (71 votes)
27. Own Company: 31 to 36 hours. - 0% (50 votes)
28. Own Company: 36 to 40 hours. - 1% (68 votes)
29. Own Company: 41 to 45 hours. - 1% (111 votes)
30. Own Company: 46 to 60 hours. - 2% (208 votes)
31. Own Company: over 60 hours. - 2% (210 votes)
32. Other. - 1% (122 votes)

Voting has now closed, but you can still click 'post reply' to discuss below. Thanks

[Olliebeak]

Hey - for once in my life, I'm in the majority!!!

[A little stressed!!]

This is crazy! Some employees want all the hours they can get, to pay off debts, or save for a wedding/holiday! Where does this leave them!

Also businesses who need the hours done will have to hire more people, on less hours, this will cost more uniforms, more time training etc.

How are we supposed to work ourselves out of a recession if we're not allowed to work?!

Also the government will be getting less tax, as people won't meet thresholds.

I really don't understand what these idiots think of when they come up with these laws! Probably the same bunch who decides HIPs were a good idea for a stagnant housing market!!!

[AHAR]

I used to be in the "Salaried NO overtime: 36 to 40 hours." option but when the payscales of the different types of staff where I work were harmonized, my hours went from 37 to 35 per week without a corresponding salary decrease. Which was nice.
There's rarely anything which can't wait until tomorrow so I rarely do overtime. Time and a half doesn't kick in until over 37 hours though.

[naughty_10382]

46-60 hours, paid hourly here. I work approx 45-50 hours a week, sometimes a bit more, sometimes less. I need to do about 45 to get enough money to pay for everything I have to pay for!

[ceridwen]

Originally Posted by Olliebeak

Hey - for once in my life, I'm in the majority!!!

Just what I was thinking - yep 36-40 hours salaried, no overtime. Thats 36-40 hours too many - roll on retirement

Its long past time for the law to make QUITE sure and certain that no-one can work more than 48 hours a week - how on earth does anyone even manage 48 hours AND have a life? I've had several part-time jobs at once - on top of my full-time job - and it was all I could do to manage to have a life too - I was using up evenings and holiday time right left and centre to fit in those jobs. I often find myself missing out on going to things as it is - due to lack of time and/or energy after that full-time job.

[lynzpower]

this is probably me:

15. Salaried NO overtime: 41 to 45 hours.

Up till recently, I didnt take a lunch break either meaning my employer getting Somewhere IRO 50 hours a month out of me for nada Ive said now I have to take my lunch break, and start and end at the right time, Im not going in early or staying late unless someone wants to pay me for it IM sure there will be a workaround, for example vouchers could be offered for overtime?

[mquine]

What about for those of us who are contracted to work for X hours a week but who have to do unpaid overtime? It's common for certain professions.

[mazza111]

05.
am only contracted to 24 hrs but in run up to xmas i work around 50+ hrs a week.

[Skyhigh]

Only 48 hours?

I'm salaried to work 35 hours a week but also work another 25-30 hours a week self employed....which is 60-65 hpw.

48 would not be good...

[forestlands]

Have a smallholding, work 60 plus hours a week, more a way of life!. 60 breeding ewes + tups/rams and lambs, 12 dairy goats inc. a billy, 7 sows/gilts and a boar, poultry 49 . Most people with poultry have 49 as over that number you have to register and get DEFRA on your door step every time there is a sniff of a sick chicken in UK!! Two working Collies - retired like me .

Enjoy my work, keeps me fit, good money saving!!!

Keep utility and traditional breeds, feed traditional way, use seasonal crops and free range.

Run the smallholding on my own - love it!!

[BigMikeyG]

I work 35 hours a week with no paid overtime although probably once fortnightly I will work an extra hour or something to get it done. Not to bad in comparison to some of the replys before me.

[bikerchick1066]

I have a full time job of 37.5 hours and also have a waitressing job three evenings a week, so normally do around 54 hours a week.

As ceridwen says, don't have time for much of a life, but apart from small mortgage, no debts either.

It's a bit of catch 22 situation. Need the extra job to have money for the good things in life, but don't have the time to spend the money!

[teddyco]

A quote from the following BBC News article:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/7991616.stm

"Who would this affect?

At the moment about one in 10 UK employees work more than 48 hours a week, according to the latest government figures. These people, including those who earn extra overtime, would be stopped from doing so.

But it would also affect all of us who want a choice about our hours. For example, if your partner loses their job and you are offered extra paid hours at work, you can take them, even if it means working more than 48 hours a week. Under the plans proposed in Brussels, this option would be ruled out.
Freedom would be replaced with frustration. Researchers working on cures for diseases would be unable to point to the importance of their work and put in longer hours. Ambitious people who want to work extra hours would be told to go home.

Unsurprisingly, the UK government is fighting hard in Brussels to keep the opt-out, and the majority of countries support its retention. It may surprise you that removing the opt-out is even being considered in a recession, when the last thing the economy needs is an extra restriction from Brussels.

The MEPs who want to end the opt-out say that longer hours mean exploitation. This would be true if people were forced to work them. But the opt-out that we have now means you can only work longer hours if you choose to opt out of the 48-hour working week. And the figures show that only a small minority do work longer hours.

Some MEPs who propose a ban on longer hours cite health and safety grounds. But the opt-out doesn't affect people like airline pilots and lorry drivers who rightly have separate rules. Nor does it affect Britain's health and safety legislation, which is the best in the world.
We think people should make their own decisions about whether to work longer hours. You know your own ambitions and circumstances and can take them into account. The opt-out allows you to do so, and this doesn't need amending in Brussels."

[tazliveshere]

I really hope they don't bring this in as it would be a disaster for people like us.
I am in full agreement that nobody should be compelled to work more than 48 hours but some of us have no choice.
I cannot work as I am a full time carer for our disabled son, we have no family to help us out and childcare for children like him is non existent.
My husband works an average 60-70 hour week to support us all. This is not because he wants to or to give us a great lifestyle it is to enable us to live!
We are trying very hard to clear our considerable debts and are making some headway but we still have a long way to go.
If he was only allowed to work 48 hours it would probably result in bankruptcy and repossession for us.
How would this help anyone?

[irishwench69]

I can't believe this ruling tbh......it's just not going to work!

I work in healthcare and work well over 48 hours a week - 60+ is typical. I'm also on-call for a lot of the remainder. (I voted category '17').

I don't get paid overtime or get any extra - and I'm not going to stop doing the hours even once this becomes illegal.......it's just not an option with the type of work that I do.....

People will just do it on the quiet or lie about how many hours they've done / are doing......

IW x

[piglet15]

I think it sounds like a great idea. I have worked for the same pub company for the last 10 years; I am on a 48-hour contract but when they send the contract out they also send a WTD opt-out form with it, which you are "strongly advised" to sign. In the past 7 years of managing pubs I have rarely done less than 55 hours a week. Several times I have exceeded 100. Averages out at about 60. On top of that I have only been able to take my full holiday entitlement for the year once. I had one week off last year and when I asked if I could have a few days off recently was told that no, there was too much for me to be doing at the moment. I do not get overtime, and have worked out that I am earning significantly less than minimum wage at the moment. I have no experience in any other industry (and I do enjoy my job too), so I think that bringing in more stringent WTD regulations would be a great advantage to me and others in my situation - meaning we actually get a healthy home life!

[ceridwen]

Totally agree with piglet. There is always going to be "swings and roundabouts" with anything. However - I think we do need to make it a priority to protect those employees who are forced to "volunteer" (huh!) to work however-many-hours-their-employer-wants regardless. I am certainly very well aware of just how much pressure employers can and do put on people to "volunteer" for what the employer wants - and just how high a percentage of staff then "volunteer" against their will for something. I'm strongwilled enough to resist any pressure to "volunteer" for something unless I genuinely do wish to volunteer - but there is a HUGE percentage of employees that get pressurised into "volunteering" for whatever their employer wants.

I think a lot of employees were too scared about keeping their jobs anyway - BEFORE the current economic crisis came along - to do anything other than "volunteer" as required. The situation will be even worse now - where people will be thinking - "If I dont 'volunteer' for whatever my employer wants - then I may get made redundant".

Many people DO need a law in place - so they can state "I''d love to volunteer - but sorry....no can do...the law wont let me" and then go off and think "thank goodness - my employer cant argue with that...heh!"

...and Piglet...if you are earning "significantly less than minimum wage" - REPORT THEM...

[BobbinAlong]

Proper flexitime and paid overtime should be a requirement of the majority of jobs. OK there's some it wouldn't work for, but even shift patterns can be accomodated. Flexi is the best. The ability to take time off without using your annual holiday and perfect for those occasions such as repair men coming.

Just working an hour extra each day soon totals up the two days a month maximum we are allowed to take. We also get special dispensation to build up extra for Christmas shutdown leave. Formal clocking in and out is worth it for the reward and yes, there's set limits to what you can accrue or be owing.
Having had it I would make it a serious want for any other job - except the one I really want which is retirement with a decent pension :-)

[BarryP]

I answered 21 (36-40 hours salaried with overtime).

The reason the European Working Time Directive (EWTD) was introduced was to stop people unwittingly driving themselves to serious illness or worse by overworking. That is the reason why, in the UK, the EWTD is (theoretically) overseen/administered/monitored by the Health and Safety Executive.

Additionally it is not just about the maximum number of hours that can be worked in a week (averaged over 17 weeks and excluding sickness and holidays) but also quantifies the number of hours break one should receive between one period of work and another (11 hours) and the maximum number of days per week which can be worked (six out of seven which can be "commuted" to twelve in fourteen).

I can understand why some people are concerned about limiting themselves to 48 hours but I think the problem of long hours in this country is one which has created more problems than it has solved. A simple example to consider: would property prices be as high (and nobody, I don't think, would disagree that they are exorbitant in most parts of the UK) if people had not, in the past, worked all the hours that they could to afford the repayments on their mortgage? (People should, perhaps, think about buying houses to live in not as an "investment" but that's another argument).

Don't you think that working people in other advanced industrial countries in Europe actually look at their cousins in the UK and laugh? Who, if they really didn't have to, would want to work more than 48 hours per week? It should also be borne in mind that the EWTD affects all citizens in the EU not just those of us in the UK so to claim that the introduction of the "no opt-out" clause will somehow make the UK "less competitive" - as many disingenuous politicians claim - is a myth...unless they really want us to compete with those poor souls in the "developing world" as it is patronisingly described.

The problem with us is that we have become used to paying the most in Europe for our homes, goods and services; accepted relatively low wages generally without complaint; become subject to the "long hours, low pay" business model prevalent in the United States of America (because we have become subject to the USA's "cultural imperialism" - unlike the rest of Europe) and are now trapped in a cycle which we don't think we can get out of.

It is time for people to start acting collectively and break the psychological grip which long hours culture and its attendant problems has on us.

In the short term this will be extremely difficult but just look to see if your company still pays a dividend to its shareholders whilst asking you to accept a pay freeze or cut. That's usually a good indicator of where business' priorities lay.