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[MSE Lawrence]

Poll between 23 June - 01 July 2008.

Would you buy cheap child-sweatshop made clothes?

There’ve been reports this week that some Primark clothes have been finished off using child labour. If this is confirmed, will it change the way you shop there?


Which of the following is closest to your view?

A. Who cares. It’s a different culture, it's not our business. - 10% (917 votes)
B. It’s cheap and that’s more important to me. - 8% (730 votes)
C. I don’t believe it's worse than any others, so there’s no choice. - 23% (2066 votes)
D. I’ll avoid it unless I can’t find a cheap viable alternative. - 20% (1763 votes)
E. I’ll never shop there again. - 15% (1310 votes)
F. I've never shopped there anyway. - 24% (2147 votes)

This vote has now closed, but you can still click 'post reply' to discuss below. Thanks

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[bryanb]

You left out the view that these kids may be orphans in a society that has no social benefits, and maybe this is the only way for them to survive.

[geri1965]

I've been thinking about this a lot over the last few days, and I'v made a decision not to buy clothes from Primark, Asda and Tesco because their names keep cropping up over and over again and I can't ignore it any longer.

However, I know someone who works in the trade and she says it's pretty much endemic - suppliers cannot say with any certainty what conditions their clothes are being made under, so it really doesn't matter if you buy from Gap or Matalan, Debenhams or M&S - the chances are there are shady practices going on at their factories as well.

I think the industry as a whole needs to get it's act together - but with the demand for cheap clothing and the need to make money, I doubt it will ever happen and companies will continue to pay lip service to demands to improve standards whilst turning a blind eye to what's really going on and claiming ignorance.

[Idiophreak]

I don't really shop at Primark anyway, since this kinda thing was dragged up once before.

I appreciate that a lot of other places might not be much better, but I'm happier (not very MSE, I know), I think, paying more to someone who's gonna do the same thing...because at least, then, it's the manufacturer's greed that's causing the problems, not mine...a lot of the things in Primark I just can't see how they could be made fairly for the price they sell them...

I'll also add that I would pay more for things I know are manufactured ethically...

[torbrex]

I buy what I want to buy at a price I want to pay, I have little regard of how it is produced.

[before hollywood]

no-one can be sure of where anything is made these days, well not in clothes anyway

[Barneysmom]

The nearest I can get to answer this one is 'I'll never shop there again'.
But I don't shop there anyway, it's cheap and it shows. I went in to have a look and some things had buttons hanging off, threads loose.
You might be able to buy a shirt from a supermarket for £3-4 but you can see straight through it, the fabric is so thin. Ok if you like displaying your bra but not for me.
I prefer second hand from charity shops.
I wonder why there are no big mills over here in Britain any more, it's time (and I wish I could do it) that some were opened.

[Eeyore2008]

I'd love to say that I'll never shop there again but the worrying thing is that I'll probably shop there more with the way the economy is going. I'm currently on statutory maternity pay and seeing all my bills going up around me but yet I can go to Primark and fill my babies wardrobe entirely with gorgeous clothes for about £30...very tempting!!

[MSE Martin]

We're adding in an I've never shopped there anyway... option - there've been 185 votes so far... and while its a tiny skew adding it in at this stage - a poll typically has 10,000+ replies so it'll only skew the poll by a negligible amount I'd suspect.

[Edinburghlass]

Its a tough one for me as I do most of my clothes shopping in Tesco and my daughter loves Primark, so do I for the prices I pay.

I listened to this being discussed on JV at lunchtime and I think answer A where it says its a different culture is very valid. If the likes of Primark pull out of China what is going to happen to these kids, they still aren't going to go to school so are they going to be left to beg on the streets? Neither option is ideal but what can we do about it?

I watched part of a programme on BBC3 or 4 late one night where some UK youngsters actually went to work in some of these factories although I don't think it was China probably India. The rules they had to work to, for me as a foreigner watching was pretty daunting and quickly reduced these kids to tears trying to adapt to the strict rules.

I'm going to think about this a bit more before voting but part of me feels that even a little money makes a difference to their families albeit doesn't make it right.

[Jenferdog]

I think its morally wrong for people who can afford to pay a little more to buy these clothes cheaply knowing that children have suffered to make them, however, how else would the families these children are from survive? Prostitution in some cases, begging, things much worse than sewing sequins on a top for hours on end I am sure. Their government should ensure that there are other ways to make a living. Glad I am not a politian.

[geri1965]

Originally Posted by Edinburghlass

I watched part of a programme on BBC3 or 4 late one night where some UK youngsters actually went to work in some of these factories although I don't think it was China probably India. The rules they had to work to, for me as a foreigner watching was pretty daunting and quickly reduced these kids to tears trying to adapt to the strict rules.

Blood Sweat & T-Shirts - I saw that as well, it was actually very shocking.

I was a little confused about the recommendations being made by War on Want - not to boycott clothes from India, because that would be disastrous for the workers, but to be a bit more discerning seemed to be the general gist of it. Which is fine, in theory, but how can you be discerning when you don't know what conditions the clothes were made under? It's easy to avoid the very cheap clothes (and I don't tend to shop in Primark anyway, I'm more of a Debenhams/M&S type person) but you can't be certain about what goes on at their factories either.

[emmy05]

im not a primark fan, but isnt this the same of most of these clothes companies, not so long ago, this was about tesco .............

[lynzpower]

totally with you Geri.

Many M&S items these days are fairtraded, and at 6.00 for ladies tops there really isnt much in it between reasonably ethically traded, and exploitative.

It bothers me that on the programme last night,when the girl was shown the child labour that had gone into making the garments, that the guy goes "would you still wear this knowing whos made it, or will it stay unused in your drawer" practically encouraging her to waste the item ( wait until it becomes dated in your drawer then throw it in the bin!) Ive had some items from these sort of budget places, and some HAVE lasted remarkably well. What better way to treat your belongings than to use them responsibly and not to waste!!

Dont think by buying French connection, ralph lauren or any other big name you remove illegal labour - course you dont. the workers ar paid the same carp money no matter which labels they have to stick inside.

I dont disaagree with child labour in general, I was a child that worked, I want the options for my kids to work too, eg paper rounds, sat jobs, limited hours around school work etc. It is tremendously beneficial that kids work .

The issue made on last nights programme was that the top retailed at 7 quid, the pieceworker got like 20p. So theres a massive profit margin, on top of this the multiproducers want paying. If Primark gave the peiceworker 2.00 per garment made, it would not be seen as poverty pay at all! Its the profit margins inbetween that are the exploiter, not the work!

[cherrylips]

I totally agree with lynzpower that where possible we should buy fairtraded clothes, I think even Tesco are doing some very cheaply now. Charity shops are also a great option environmentally and ethically as the money you pay goes direct to needy people and the product is not landfilled.
I also agree that it's hard to know which retailers are better than others as the problem probably is endemic and, for me too, the issue is not children earning (starving, begging or prostitution would be far worse) but the percentage paid to the pieceworker.
However, I think the most powerful way we can show ALL retailers that the practise of exploitating the most vulnerable workers with pitiful pay and conditions is to boycott when we do hear of these stories coming out. You can be sure all eyes are on Primark's prfits at the moment and if they see that these dip (even short term) as a result of the story, it sends them the most powerful message that this is not the way we want to shop. They might then look at their own practices before they too get rumbled.

[drandall]

Originally Posted by bryanb

You left out the view that these kids may be orphans in a society that has no social benefits, and maybe this is the only way for them to survive.

I am so pleased to see someone else asking this, my concern is that if we collectively do stop - what happens to the workforce - $11 is $11 more than they'll get on the streets. But please don't take me as an apologist for the way some of these children are treated, it is not acceptable and the real answer is for governments to enforce their own child labour laws which so often exist only on paper.


David

[susan1]

Originally Posted by Barneysmom

The nearest I can get to answer this one is 'I'll never shop there again'.
But I don't shop there anyway, it's cheap and it shows. I went in to have a look and some things had buttons hanging off, threads loose.
You might be able to buy a shirt from a supermarket for £3-4 but you can see straight through it, the fabric is so thin. Ok if you like displaying your bra but not for me.
I prefer second hand from charity shops.
I wonder why there are no big mills over here in Britain any more, it's time (and I wish I could do it) that some were opened.

agreed, i usually buy good quality clothes from charity shops and e-bay.bought a helly hanson winter jacket recently, i did feel slightly guilty as they obviously hadn't a clue that they cost neary£200 new and it was nearly new.

[frugallass]

Originally Posted by bryanb

You left out the view that these kids may be orphans in a society that has no social benefits, and maybe this is the only way for them to survive.

I agree with this statement too.......

the subject I'm concerned about in the current credit crunch is me and my family

[MORPH3US]

From my POV, just as I would love to buy free-range chicken and organic veg, I would love to buy ethically produced clothes, but I simply cannot afford it.....

So i'm affraid that I will continue to buy from Primark.

To be fair to them though, they have taken action on this anyway so good on them.

[teddyco]

I think we should fix the problems in THIS country before we start trying to fix problems in other nations!