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HELP Statutory Demand

Hi All

I was hoping that some of you nice people could help me. Today in the post my husband received a Statutory Damand from RED debt collection services. It is for a cc dept from before we met and we have been married for 7 years now, i know he has not paided anything or acknowledged the debt to any one. He has been ignoring letters from them before but his is the first statutory demand. My husband is out of the country untill the start of April and he has asked my to deal with it, which is no problem, but i don't know what to do.

Thanks in anticipation
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Comments

  • RAS
    RAS Posts: 35,758 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 10,000 Posts Name Dropper
    Poodle

    You need to know the status of this statuatory demand. if it is for real, then you need some urgent help.

    If it is a frightener, your hubbie needs to send a Statute barred letter.

    So you really need to know what that piece of paper means. Please ring one of the debt chrities here http://www.moneysavingexpert.com/loans/debt-help-plan#help
    If you've have not made a mistake, you've made nothing
  • Thanks

    I will phone one tomorrow when my DD is a nursery, its quiet then.

    Just been looking on the net, and I am confused about "formally served". This just came by normal post, no signature or any thing, does that mean it has not been formally served and is a scare tatic.

    Thanks BigPoodle
  • you need to take the statutory demand seriously and contact one of debt charities as advised by ras.
    Do you know how much the alledged debt is?
  • Hi

    The total dept is £2914.98, it does not say if any of it is charges or interest. I will definatly be taking your advice and phoning on of the help lines tomorrow.

    Thanks
  • BigPoodle wrote: »
    Hi All

    I was hoping that some of you nice people could help me. Today in the post my husband received a Statutory Damand from RED debt collection services. It is for a cc dept from before we met and we have been married for 7 years now, i know he has not paided anything or acknowledged the debt to any one. He has been ignoring letters from them before but his is the first statutory demand. My husband is out of the country untill the start of April and he has asked my to deal with it, which is no problem, but i don't know what to do.

    Thanks in anticipation

    Right, I received one of these today, from RED, (aka Lowell/Hamptons Legal/MacKenzie-Hall whatever...)
    I previously wrote the standard 'statute-barred' letter when Lowell/RED tried to collect a 7-years old account. I also sent them by rec.delivery a standard letter requesting proof of assignment and copies of original signed agreements etc...
    I received nothing and that was 3&1/2 months ago that they signed for my letter.
    Today I got the statutory demand it is RUBBISH!

    It is a COPY of a genuine court form and has NO stamp or local court details on it. IT IS PURELY INTIMIDATORY!!! A last throw of the dice as they cannot collect the alleged debt thru the legal court system as barred. It also says 'any offer considered'
    Yeah, right! If I could collect a debt lawfully I would collect it ALL, not less.

    BUT LISTEN TO THIS!! It goes without saying that it is unlawful and extortion for them to pursue me after not sending my documents as above. BUT LISTEN! THE DOCUMENT IS A FORGERY, TO MISREPRESENT AND MISLEAD!
    I CHECKED THE REAL ONE ON GOVT. FORMS AND RED HAVE CUT A BIT OF THE TITLE OUT!! It should be titled:

    [FONT=TimesNewRoman,Bold]
    ""Statutory Demand under section 268(1)(a) of the Insolvency Act
    1986. Debt for Liquidated Sum Payable Immediately Following a
    Judgment or Order of the Court""

    At the bottom it should be suffixed:
    "6.2 Statutory Demand under section 268(1)(a) of the Insolvency Act 1986. Debt for Liquidated Sum Payable Immediately Following a Judgment or Order of the Court 11/99"

    ***********RED HAVE CUT THE TITLE TO THIS:
    [FONT=TimesNewRoman,Bold]
    Statutory Demand under section 268(1)(a) of the Insolvency Act
    1986. Debt for Liquidated Sum Payable Immediately

    AND THE PAGE SUFFIX HAS BEEN DELETED!!!

    In other words thay are using a tool/form that would be applicable if a court ruling/judgement had ALREADY been applied previously (which of course it HASN'T been and CAN'T have been as the debt is barred) and ALTERING it to mislead and intimidate.

    THIS ALONE IS A CRIMINAL ACT SURELY???
    NOTWITHSTANDING THEM PURSUING ME AFTER NOT SUPPLYING THE DOCS I PAID £1 FOR 3&1/2 MONTHS AGO!

    I am off work Friday 22nd. so am printing off my Royal Mail proof-of-receipt for the £1 request, taking a copy of that letter plus this faked form and making an official criminal allegation and complaint against the director named on the form in my local police station.
    I will let you know what happens.

    Here is my response sent today to RED/LOWELL/whatever etc..



    210208
    YOUR REF. 10xxxxxx
    MR.A.BARTLE,
    Thank you for your photocopy of a 'Statutory Demand' document which pre-empts bankruptcy proceedings. As you know this is a document which would be stamped by a court and have my local County Court specified on it if correct.
    The form is dishonest and altered to mislead:
    You have deleted the end of the title which would have been "......Immediately Following a
    Judgment or Order of the Court" (which of course has not and could not be made in respect of this alleged debt)
    You have altered the rule and form number too. I will be presenting this evidence in my criminal complaint as described below.
    This form is of course missing the bottom line which states:
    "6.2 Statutory Demand under section 268(1)(a) of the Insolvency Act 1986. Debt for Liquidated Sum Payable Immediately Following a Judgment or Order of the Court 11/99"
    As of course you know this alleged account has not got, and you cannot obtain for it, a CCJ or Order of Court for as it would be statute barred.
    You would also not be able to commence bankruptcy proceedings while an alleged debt is in DISPUTE.
    Good try, I'm sure it would intimidate the ignorant.
    I will briefly remind you that I admit or owe NO debt to you or your company.
    I wrote to you and denied owing this alleged debt back in November, and I wrote via recorded delivery as per my right under the Administration of Justice Act enclosing £1 requesting proof of original signed agreement, and proof of assignment of this alleged account.
    As you know your company signed for this £1 payment and request two days later according to Royal Mail's 'track'n'trace' facility. Under the Act failure to provide these documents within 12 days to the alleged debtor is a complete defence to ANY County Court action, and to continue ANY pursuit over the matter if you do not supply those documents within 30 days is a criminal offence under the same.
    In 3 months to now you have failed in your legal obligation to provide them. As you will also know, bankruptcy is a last resort in matters like this, and as such is always preceded by a County Court Judgement. Bankrupty proceedings would cost you between £600 and £1700 pounds with no guarantee of getting an order, or the payment back.
    Due to the failings of yourselves previously as detailed above, the CCJ option in no longer obtainable to you and thus the bankruptcy option is extremely unlikely.
    I wrote explaining that I acknowledge no debt to yourselves, and that I believed it to be a Statute Barred debt regardless, as I do not owe it and thus had made no payments on it or written requests for account in the previous 6 years.
    The alleged debt is NOT legally recoverable as statute barred, and I do NOT intend to make any payments regarding it.
    The very letter that I am replying to here is unlawful for the reasons stated above. It is technically attempted extortion, criminal and vexatious.
    I am going to make an official complaint to the Police and a criminal complaint against Mr. Bartle the named person responsible for this extortion attempt. Hopefully you will hear about this when, or shortly after you receive this letter.
    In the meantime please DO commence bankruptcy proceedings against me. That in itself would compound your criminal behavious thus far, and in the unlikely event we got to a court, would give me the opportunity to provide details of you/your company's criminal behaviour to a Judge.

    Yours xxxxxx
    [/FONT][/FONT]
  • Go Lowellcrooks!

    ***mops his brow as he stands off his soapbox****

    Great letter - should be used by all! I did put a question to this forum ages ago about these debt recovery companies - can they operate with a criminal conviction? Interesting eh?
    'Proud To Be Dealing With My Debts' : Member number 632
    Nerds rule! :cool:
  • fermi wrote: »
    Hi lowellcrooks, :)

    A statutory demand does not have to pass through OR be stamped by a court.

    From: http://www.insolvency.gov.uk/guidanceleaflets/dealingwithdebt/howtomakesomeone.htm
    Also a Statutory Demand can take two forms.

    Either:

    Form 6.1,

    Statutory Demand under section 268(1)(a) of the Insolvency Act 1986. Debt for Liquidated Sum Payable Immediately England & Wales pdf.gif

    OR

    Form 6.2,

    Statutory Demand under section 268(1)(a) of the Insolvency Act 1986. Debt for Liquidated Sum Payable Immediately Following a Judgment or Order of the Court England & Walespdf.gif

    You have been served with the first of these two, NOT an incorrect form.

    However, the "Statute Barred" status of the debt, and the non-compliance with the CCA request gives you plenty of grounds to get the SD set aside. :)

    Yes I dropped a b*llock there you are quite right. I read somewhere last year that this was the new tactic of debt recovery firms, that as too many people are cute to the statute-barred/CCA defence they are avoiding the CCJ - route altogether and pressing or threatening for bankruptcy.

    I DIDN'T send the letter as worded above, I spotted the TWO DIFFERENT titles/forms just after I posted the garbage above. I actually changed it to your 'FORMAL COMPLAINT' letter regarding their failures to supply under the CCA and that further pursuit since that expiry is criminal, harassing and vexatious.

    ON A MORE WORRYING NOTE!
    IF THIS TACTIC IS BEING USED, it is worrying that as a recipient I cannot see ANY difference between a downloaded form they have filled in with the alleged debts details in order to intimidate and printed and sent on to me OR a genuine one that has been lodged with the courts!!!
    So taking YOUR advice to be on the 'safe side' I apply to set it aside, what if:
    1. I cannot tell WHICH local court this should be set aside in, i.e.I live near 2 or 3? Do I send a set-aside form to ALL 3 in hope that I hit the correct one?

    2. WHAT IF, as many suspect here, this is simply an empty threat as the debt is barred and they have NOT really formally issued this,and I then apply to set it aside at the local courts and they HAVEN'T GOT A CLUE WHAT I'M ON ABOUT as it's not been actually entered? I'd be wasting my time and look a right prat!

    3. SURELY there must be some official court communication with me regarding this (if genuine) and sending me my rights as with a CCSummons that has been genuinely applied for.

    4. If I ignored it and it WAS real, it doesn't actually mean anything UNLESS the claimant/creditor actually PROCEEDS with the petition does it? If I ignored it and they DID petition me i could actually have the judge set it aside in the actual hearing surely, when presented with the documents and letters pertaining to their criminal and vexatious behaviour? I couldn't see a judge granting the petition on those grounds alone.

    INTERESTINGLY, what if a petition was presented and we turned up in front of the judge, and I pointed out that the petitioners' behaviour was extortive and illegal under the CCA/Admin Of Justice Act, and I wished to pursue the matter with a criminal complaint? Surely upon the seeing and hearing this evidence the judge would have to abandon the hearing and nullify it, as its continuance would be a furtherance of the petitioners unlawful and criminal behaviour/harassment???

    What do you people think?
  • STATUTORY DEMANDS CAN BE FOUGHT SUCCESSFULLY.

    I recently sent this long e-mail to Lowell Financial.
    You have contacted us regarding the account with the above reference number, which you claim is owed by ourselves.

    We would point out that under the Limitation Act 1980 Section 5 “an action founded on simple contract shall not be brought after the expiration of six years from the date on which the cause of action accrued.”

    We would also point out that the OFT say under their Debt Collection Guidance on statute barred debt that “it is unfair to pursue the debt if the debtor has heard nothing from the creditor during the relevant limitation period”.

    The last payment of this alleged debt was made over six years ago and no further acknowledgement or payment has been made since that time. Unless you can provide evidence of payment or written contact from us in the relevant period under Section 5 of the Limitation Act, we suggest that you are no longer able to take any court action against us to recover the alleged amount claimed.

    The OFT Debt Collection Guidance states further that “continuing to press for payment after a debtor has stated that they will not be paying a debt because it is statute barred could amount to harassment contrary to section 40 (1) of the Administration of Justice Act 1970”.

    We await your written confirmation that this matter is now closed and that no further contact will be made concerning the above account after that last letter.

    Please supply me with All my personal data you hold including a complete list of transactions and charges (or alternatively a set of statements) relating to my account history with your organization or any you are representing. I also require a complete breakdown of each Late Payment fee and Over Limit fee charged to this account, or any similar related charges. The complete breakdown of each charge must contain the following:

    Hourly rate of each member of staff involved with each administration of the fees / charges. The time each member of staff spent on the administration of the fees/charges. Details of the work carried out and completed by each member of staff involved with each administration of the fees/charges. Total cost of the paper, envelopes, ink, and postage of each automated and manually written letter relevant to the issuing of the fees/charges, and any other costs incurred in each fee/charge including other employee’s involvement, their hourly rate, time spent on the involvement, and what their involvement consisted of.

    Additionally, where there has been any event in my account history over this period which has required manual intervention by any member of your staff, or any other person or any that you represent, I require disclosure of any indication or notes which have either caused or resulted in that manual intervention, or other evidence of that manual intervention in relation to my banking business with you or any that you represent. If you are unable to supply this data because there has been no such manual intervention, then please be so kind as to confirm this in your response.

    Furthermore please provide me with a copy of my contracts with you and any company you represent, and a copy of my original terms and conditions. I make this request under the Data Protection Act 1984 and 1998, and including the right of subject access under these acts.

    I understand that under the Consumer Credit Act 1974 section 78, I am entitled to receive a true SIGNED copy of any credit agreements and a statement of account on request.

    I understand a copy of any credit agreement along with a statement of account should be supplied within 12 working days.

    I further understand that under the Consumer Credit Act 1974 creditors are unable to enforce an agreement if they fail to comply with the request for a copy of the agreement and statement of account under these sections of the Act.

    I am writing in relation to the quantity and frequency of telephone calls that I have received from your company, which I deem to be personally harassing. I have verbally requested that these stop, but I am still receiving calls.

    I now require all further correspondence from your company to be made in writing only. I am of the view that your continued harassment of me by telephone puts you in breach of Section 40 of the Administration of Justice Act 1970, and the Protection from Harassment Act 1997. If you continue to harass me by telephone, you will also be in breach of the Communications Act (2003) s.127 and I will report you to OFCOM, Trading Standards and The Office of Fair Trading, meaning that you will be liable to a substantial fine. Be advised that any further telephone calls from your company will be recorded.

    Following recent contact with your company before I am prepared to take this matter of outstanding balance and make ANY payments I would like you to provide me with the following information.

    I do not acknowledge ANY debt to your company.
    I require you to supply the following documentation before I will correspond further on this matter.

    1. You must supply me with a true copy of the alleged agreement you refer to. This is my right under your obligation to supply a copy of the agreement under the legislation contained within s.78 (1) Consumer Credit Act 1974 (s.77 (1) for fixed sum credit) - your obligation also extends to providing a statement of account.

    2. A signed true copy of the deed of assignment of the above referenced agreement that you allege exists.

    3. You are notified that you are obliged to supply these documents, whether you are the original creditor or not under S189 of the CCA 1974.

    Non-compliance with my request is a criminal offence under the above Act and will result in a report being submitted to the relevant statutory authorities.

    As you are aware, a credit agreement that is not properly documented and signed by the customer is totally unenforceable under the CCA and therefore is a complete defence to any court claim that is issued.

    Take note at this stage, that any legal action you may contemplate will be both vigorously defended and contested. Plus take notice that this Capital One account was dealt with by way of an admin order at the County Court, which ended two years ago, and is now therefore statute barred.

    Our researchers have been doing some digging into the unlawful behaviour of your company, Lowell Portfolio 1 Ltd / Lowell Financial Ltd / Red, and have discovered some interesting facts. These we now intend to bring in a group civil action in the High Court case against you. This research has included interviews with present and past employees of your companies. Take notice that a complaint has been filed with Devon and Cornwall Police.

    1. That the aforementioned companies are in breach of their licence with the OFT, number Z8222569 which covers them for the tracing of consumer and commercial debtors and the collection on behalf of creditors, and the purchasing of trade debts, including rentals and instalment credit payments, from business only. Therefore, the attempted collection of consumer debt is not within your licence remit and therefore illegal.

    2. That the aforementioned companies send out 'solicitors' letters when in fact they have not come from any solicitor registered with The Law Society, and details of this have been passed to The Law Society for action to be taken, which will result in severe penalties and fines being levied on Lowell Portfolio / Lowell Financial / Hamptons / Red, whatever you call yourselves.

    3. That the aforementioned companies failed to satisfactory respond to consumers Section 78 (1) Consumer Credit Act 1974 requests and fail to produce genuine copies of credit agreements or the like, which is again an illegal act under the Consumer Credit Act 1974, and therefore our research and findings have been passed to the Office of Fair Trading for enforcement action to be taken against you. You agree and are aware that under law, such requests must be satisfied in full within 12 working days. In fact that is such requests are not fulfilled within 40 days, this becomes a criminal offence. A complaint has been filed with Devon and Cornwall Police log 319 of 22-02-08

    4. That the aforementioned companies sent out threatening Statutory Demands that are signed by an individual claiming to be a Government Minister, when in fact that person is not. Again, this is highly illegal, and a file with the assistance of the Police is being prepared and will be sent to The Crown Prosecution Service for action to be brought against your companies. Further, the service of such Statutory Demands by 2nd class post is in breach of the rules, and therefore not enforceable in court. This is in direct breach of Administration of Justice Act 1970, Section 40 onwards.

    5. That the aforementioned companies repeatedly telephone consumers chasing payments that are not owed, or are in dispute, despite being warned by the telephone regulator not to, and thus is in direct breach of Communications Act 2003, Section 127, and Human Rights Act 1990, Article 8 - Right to respect for private and family life, and Wireless Telegraphy Act 1949, misuse. All telephone calls to us have been recorded for use as evidence in the High Court, where we intend to claim for substantial damages against the aforementioned companies. A report is also being compiled and will be sent to the telephone regulator with a view to having the phone lines of the aforementioned companies cut off under The Protection from Harassment Act 1997.
    I have just got off the phone with a Nigel Bevan at Lowell Financial, and he has stated that he has withdrawen the Statutory Demand, and that they have no entitlement to collect the alleged sum, and that a full letter of apology will be with me on Monday morning.

    I await the letter before I stop the set aside court action I have taken, and then I will issue court proceedings against them for damages.

    I'VE WON!
  • RAS wrote: »
    Poodle

    You need to know the status of this statuatory demand. if it is for real, then you need some urgent help.

    If it is a frightener, your hubbie needs to send a Statute barred letter.

    So you really need to know what that piece of paper means. Please ring one of the debt chrities here http://www.moneysavingexpert.com/loans/debt-help-plan#help


    Err..is sending the 'statute barred' letter a good idea, as if in response to the statutory demand it simply confirms you received it......
  • STATUTORY DEMANDS CAN BE FOUGHT SUCCESSFULLY.

    I recently sent this long e-mail to Lowell Financial.


    I have just got off the phone with a Nigel Bevan at Lowell Financial, and he has stated that he has withdrawen the Statutory Demand, and that they have no entitlement to collect the alleged sum, and that a full letter of apology will be with me on Monday morning.

    I await the letter before I stop the set aside court action I have taken, and then I will issue court proceedings against them for damages.

    I'VE WON!

    Well done, great letter, I hope your threats are carried out to the letter and not just sayings....
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