Your browser isn't supported
It looks like you're using an old web browser. To get the most out of the site and to ensure guides display correctly, we suggest upgrading your browser now. Download the latest:

Welcome to the MSE Forums

We're home to a fantastic community of MoneySavers but anyone can post. Please exercise caution & report spam, illegal, offensive or libellous posts/messages: click "report" or email forumteam@.

Search
  • FIRST POST
    • GreatApe
    • By GreatApe 6th Jan 20, 11:10 PM
    • 4,398Posts
    • 3,089Thanks
    GreatApe
    Tesla News & Discussion
    • #1
    • 6th Jan 20, 11:10 PM
    Tesla News & Discussion 6th Jan 20 at 11:10 PM
    For anything related to Tesla and adjacent technologies
Page 2
    • GreatApe
    • By GreatApe 15th Jan 20, 2:22 PM
    • 4,398 Posts
    • 3,089 Thanks
    GreatApe
    Comedy Gold.

    Replace a tube train that can carry an average of 240 people with an electric car that can carry 4 or 5 people (though we all know that cars/taxis usually carry just one or two people). Massive traffic jam occurs with hundreds of thousands of electric cars stuck in tunnels

    Re-use the existing tube tunnels but drill more tunnels to link the original tube lines together and to replace the existing lifts and escalators with roadways for the electric cars to get into and out of the tunnels.

    One BEV breaks down in a tunnel and all traffic stops in that tunnel. A terrorist fills his car with explosives and destroys a tunnel (much more explosive can be fitted into a car than a backpack). A car sets on fire, blocks the tunnel and fills it with noxious fumes. Tunnel is filled with motorists running here and there in panic (if they can actually get out of their cars in these tiny tunnels), many are killed due to smoke inhalation or crushed in the stampede.


    So back to reality....

    The Boring company is actually trying to build hyper links between major cities where the tunnel holds a vacuum and a pod travels with zero friction (from airi and the ground as it is probably a maglev type) at super speeds. The pods could be similar to the channel tunnel trains that carry cars, trucks and people.

    A much more sensible proposition than tunnels under a city filled with individual cars driving about.

    I must say though, this easily surpasses your nuclear powered showers, baths and central heating idea in its bonkeryness!

    However, you have achieved your purpose of disrupting the board and filling it with nonsense rather than discussions on renewables. So kudos to you there.
    Originally posted by pile-o-stone

    Hey stalker , I missed you
    It's been five mins since you last stalked me
    I was getting worried you'd given up

    Yes I didn't think of the terrorists or a broken down EV clogging up a tunnel
    Good thing terrorists are nice enough to not do anything on trains and good thing trains never break down because those would be easy ways to dismiss you so it's good that they can't ever happen

    What would I do without you!!
    • pile-o-stone
    • By pile-o-stone 15th Jan 20, 3:03 PM
    • 382 Posts
    • 643 Thanks
    pile-o-stone
    Hey stalker , I missed you
    It's been five mins since you last stalked me
    I was getting worried you'd given up

    Yes I didn't think of the terrorists or a broken down EV clogging up a tunnel
    Good thing terrorists are nice enough to not do anything on trains and good thing trains never break down because those would be easy ways to dismiss you so it's good that they can't ever happen

    What would I do without you!!
    Originally posted by GreatApe
    I understand you don't really like having the light of reason shone on your crazy ideas, but if you post them on a public forum then people will respond.

    The difference with a train breaking down is that the following train can be coupled to it and can push it along. Not too many car owners will be chuffed having to get out in an underground tunnel and couple their car to a broken down one and shove it along - especially as they will undoubtedly have a different a different destination to the car they are pushing.

    I've already covered the terrorist issue- you can pack much more explosives into a car than you can into a backpack.

    You seem to have quietly neglected to address the other points I raised....

    What about building the expense on/off ramps to replace the existing escalators and lifts down to the tube lines? what about the expense of building connecting tunnels between the existing tube lines? will there be enough space to fit the on/off ramps or do you envisage spiral ramps to the tunnels that replace the existing tube stations that the cars can drive down?
    5.18 kWp PV systems (3.68 E/W & 1.5 E).
    Solar iBoost+ to two immersion heaters on 300L thermal store.
    Vegan household with 100% composted food waste
    Mini orchard planted and vegetable allotment created.
    • GreatApe
    • By GreatApe 15th Jan 20, 3:16 PM
    • 4,398 Posts
    • 3,089 Thanks
    GreatApe
    I understand you don't really like having the light of reason shone on your crazy ideas, but if you post them on a public forum then people will respond.
    Originally posted by pile-o-stone
    I'm perfectly happy debating ideas good or bad or crazy

    You know what they say Great minds discuss ideas; average minds discuss events; small minds discuss people

    Guess which one you're doing or trying to direct this to?
    We're talking about me
    I guess it could be worse
    We could be talking about you
    • pile-o-stone
    • By pile-o-stone 15th Jan 20, 3:27 PM
    • 382 Posts
    • 643 Thanks
    pile-o-stone
    I'm perfectly happy debating ideas good or bad or crazy

    You know what they say Great minds discuss ideas; average minds discuss events; small minds discuss people

    Guess which one you're doing or trying to direct this to?
    We're talking about me
    I guess it could be worse
    We could be talking about you
    Originally posted by GreatApe
    Interesting that you've now chosen to discuss me rather than discuss the holes I poked in your ideas. Small minds you say?



    Talk about shooting yourself in the foot!! Your lack of self-awareness is staggering!
    5.18 kWp PV systems (3.68 E/W & 1.5 E).
    Solar iBoost+ to two immersion heaters on 300L thermal store.
    Vegan household with 100% composted food waste
    Mini orchard planted and vegetable allotment created.
    • GreatApe
    • By GreatApe 15th Jan 20, 3:28 PM
    • 4,398 Posts
    • 3,089 Thanks
    GreatApe
    I've already covered the terrorist issue- you can pack much more explosives into a car than you can into a backpack
    Originally posted by pile-o-stone

    Stop talking about explosives you'll get James bond on my !!! and I'm a giver not a taker

    Your idea is silly. You don't target £40,000 BEVs that might have 4 passangers one of whom is you
    Plus these acts are very rare because most people are sane

    As for tunnels and breaking down I thought you lot were trying to sell me on the idea EVs don't break down

    The solutions to this is easy
    You can literally push/pull it out the way to the next exit
    I'd also imagine 3 tunnels
    One say north one south and one is a spare for maintenance and accidents if either of the other two have problems

    Or of course simply design for lower rates of breakdowns
    Dual motor and individual powerpack and electronics
    That solves the power side
    The only other thing is maybe wheel problems
    Engineer to lower that risk too
    Perhaps double tires like on vans so if one goes it's not game over

    Anyway whatever it's clear I'm talking to a giant of a mind in you
    I feel inferior and am starting to get panic attacks
    Time to walk the imaginary dog woof woof
    • GreatApe
    • By GreatApe 15th Jan 20, 3:29 PM
    • 4,398 Posts
    • 3,089 Thanks
    GreatApe
    Interesting that you've now chosen to discuss me rather than discuss the holes I poked in your ideas. Small minds you say?

    Talk about shooting yourself in the foot!! Your lack of self-awareness is staggering!
    Originally posted by pile-o-stone

    I love you too x
    • GreatApe
    • By GreatApe 15th Jan 20, 3:44 PM
    • 4,398 Posts
    • 3,089 Thanks
    GreatApe
    What about building the expense on/off ramps to replace the existing escalators and lifts down to the tube lines? what about the expense of building connecting tunnels between the existing tube lines? will there be enough space to fit the on/off ramps or do you envisage spiral ramps to the tunnels that replace the existing tube stations that the cars can drive down?
    Originally posted by pile-o-stone
    Who said I want or think BEV tunnels should replace the existing tube network?
    I said they make sense as new lines in existing cities and future mega cities
    I'd imagine this would be a whole new level of public transport
    Imagine a second tube network. An underground motorway in London

    Imagine these more as like buses
    Many many more stops
    With stops resembling small car parks
    With these BEVs coming above ground unloading the 4 passangers and picking up another 4

    The ramps on/off wouldn't be too difficult you'd have the tunnel close to the surface near the station car parks or even totally on the surface. So the tunnel can surface every km or so. The cars that don't need to stop keep going past. The cars that do need to stop to let passangers off just exist at this point and the cars that need to enter enter at this point

    These stations can be in underground's areas themselves like the basements of larger buildings like shopping centers or on the surface

    The high acceleration and deceleration possibly with EVs would keep these surface stretches small. 0-60 in say 4 seconds means you'd only need a 'runway' of 60 meters. That's just 10 car lengths

    Anyway you're boring me
    If this relationship is going to work you need to spice thing up
    I have to go tell off an emplyee for being unproductive over the last three weeks
    I'll try to ignore how I spent the last hour or two hours
    • Martyn1981
    • By Martyn1981 15th Jan 20, 5:20 PM
    • 10,066 Posts
    • 15,281 Thanks
    Martyn1981
    I understand you don't really like having the light of reason shone on your crazy ideas, but if you post them on a public forum then people will respond.

    The difference with a train breaking down is that the following train can be coupled to it and can push it along. Not too many car owners will be chuffed having to get out in an underground tunnel and couple their car to a broken down one and shove it along - especially as they will undoubtedly have a different a different destination to the car they are pushing.

    I've already covered the terrorist issue- you can pack much more explosives into a car than you can into a backpack.

    You seem to have quietly neglected to address the other points I raised....

    What about building the expense on/off ramps to replace the existing escalators and lifts down to the tube lines? what about the expense of building connecting tunnels between the existing tube lines? will there be enough space to fit the on/off ramps or do you envisage spiral ramps to the tunnels that replace the existing tube stations that the cars can drive down?
    Originally posted by pile-o-stone
    Just a thought, and I can't back it up at all, just thinking out loud, but how about tunnels for cyclists?

    Cardiff is suggesting a congestion charge now, add to this the cost of approx £1m/km of converting roads to cycle lane friendly, which seems to just involve the adding of an orange resin, and the Boring Company's suggestion of $10m/mile for a tunnel that can cope with a car, so perhaps two way cycling, would be a solution?

    TBH cycling is great, and I used to do 2,500 - 3,500 miles pa, till an artic misjudged his overtake and broke my confidence (and my pelvis, arm, shoulder blade etc). Would be boring (no pun intended) in a tunnel, but safe and dry, and if one way, perhaps some wind assistance from the air supply system!
    Mart. Cardiff. 5.58 kWp PV systems (3.58 ESE & 2.0 WNW)

    For general PV advice please see the PV FAQ thread on the Green & Ethical Board.
    • pile-o-stone
    • By pile-o-stone 15th Jan 20, 5:40 PM
    • 382 Posts
    • 643 Thanks
    pile-o-stone
    Just a thought, and I can't back it up at all, just thinking out loud, but how about tunnels for cyclists?

    Cardiff is suggesting a congestion charge now, add to this the cost of approx £1m/km of converting roads to cycle lane friendly, which seems to just involve the adding of an orange resin, and the Boring Company's suggestion of $10m/mile for a tunnel that can cope with a car, so perhaps two way cycling, would be a solution?

    TBH cycling is great, and I used to do 2,500 - 3,500 miles pa, till an artic misjudged his overtake and broke my confidence (and my pelvis, arm, shoulder blade etc). Would be boring (no pun intended) in a tunnel, but safe and dry, and if one way, perhaps some wind assistance from the air supply system!
    Originally posted by Martyn1981
    Bikes are the solution, not the problem. I think the answer is to ban cars from cities:
    https://www.treehugger.com/cars/ban-cars-in-cities.html

    "More than 40,000 Americans were killed by cars in 2016 — the equivalent of a fully-loaded Boeing 747 falling out of the sky once every three days. It’s more than the 33,000 annual gun deaths, and more than the 20,000-plus people killed by synthetic opioids that year. Half of those automobile fatalities occurred in urban areas; about 6,000 of them were pedestrians."

    "It’s not just about banning cars. Cities also have to help their citizens live without a car. This means they must approve taller buildings, get rid of parking minimums, and expand public transit options. Build rail instead of roads. Turn gas stations into bike kiosks. Convert parking lots to sidewalks. Provide a fleet of low-speed zero-emission vehicles (like golf carts!) to make deliveries and help residents get around. And introduce better technology solutions to help everyone navigate the city more efficiently."


    "Others believe that self-driving autonomous cars will save us, but one of the best threads I have seen on Twitter (and a great use of 280 characters) suggests otherwise."

    This is the twitter post referenced:

    "I am becoming convinced that autonomous vehicles are designed to solve the problem of "I live in a wealthy suburb but have a horrible car commute and don't want to drive anymore but also hate trains and buses.""
    Last edited by pile-o-stone; 15-01-2020 at 5:45 PM.
    5.18 kWp PV systems (3.68 E/W & 1.5 E).
    Solar iBoost+ to two immersion heaters on 300L thermal store.
    Vegan household with 100% composted food waste
    Mini orchard planted and vegetable allotment created.
    • GreatApe
    • By GreatApe 15th Jan 20, 7:36 PM
    • 4,398 Posts
    • 3,089 Thanks
    GreatApe
    Just a thought, and I can't back it up at all, just thinking out loud, but how about tunnels for cyclists?

    Cardiff is suggesting a congestion charge now, add to this the cost of approx £1m/km of converting roads to cycle lane friendly, which seems to just involve the adding of an orange resin, and the Boring Company's suggestion of $10m/mile for a tunnel that can cope with a car, so perhaps two way cycling, would be a solution?

    TBH cycling is great, and I used to do 2,500 - 3,500 miles pa, till an artic misjudged his overtake and broke my confidence (and my pelvis, arm, shoulder blade etc). Would be boring (no pun intended) in a tunnel, but safe and dry, and if one way, perhaps some wind assistance from the air supply system!
    Originally posted by Martyn1981

    No this is a bad idea the volume is too low (much lower speeds) and the size of tunnel is the same or bigger. A model 3 is 1.4 meters high while a tall person can be 2 meters tall plus they need some additional height for lights etc. Walkways/cycleways underground would also become places for the homeless for gangs and kids doing all sorts so nobody would use them

    Cycle and scooters however could be above ground and follow major road lines in London
    Maybe 5 meters above Street level and mostly glass or plastic so mostly see through and ideally very attractive

    Only needs to hold two cycle and one walk line each direction so just 3 meters or so
    High useage places like hospitals could even have a direct line into their building at 1st floor level

    Especially with these 30 mile electric scooters I feel many many people would use them
    They would also be faster than buses for sure
    And super cheap as the electric for these things is something like 50 miles per KWh 0.1 penny a mile

    I'd be very very pro this Have rentable electric scooters on these overground lines too
    Every 1km or so you can have a staircase up/down and also lifts/ramps for the less able
    But much more frequently for able body people you can have a much more basic pole to slide down and a very cheap mechanical pole climber to climb a pole up foir meters. Probably 95% of people can use that the other 5% could use the less frequent more costly stairs and lifts
    • GreatApe
    • By GreatApe 15th Jan 20, 7:52 PM
    • 4,398 Posts
    • 3,089 Thanks
    GreatApe
    Bikes are the solution, not the problem. I think the answer is to ban cars from cities:
    Originally posted by pile-o-stone
    Not really probably more buses are the solution
    The problem with bicycles is their high externality costs of pain and suffering
    Seriously people fall and hurt themselves and any fuel or capital savings are lost in higher healthcare costs and a lot of personal cost in pain and suffering

    Deaths are also very common I knew one guy who died while cycling due to a bus
    Even I came within inches of being under a bus at age 17 cycling
    Never again after that experience
    Despite this I am pro bicycles and scooters
    But where possible (sub 2 miles) people should simply walk Or take the bus

    London bus prices for off peak should be reduced to just £1
    And the number of routes increased
    And of course they should be electrified
    And the London bus network also expanded to the commuter towns for the same £1 off peak £1.50 on peak
    • Martyn1981
    • By Martyn1981 16th Jan 20, 8:29 AM
    • 10,066 Posts
    • 15,281 Thanks
    Martyn1981
    Bikes are the solution, not the problem. I think the answer is to ban cars from cities:
    https://www.treehugger.com/cars/ban-cars-in-cities.html
    Originally posted by pile-o-stone
    I don't know if bikes only is a solution that can be 'sold' to everyone, but I agree that cycling is a massive part of the solution. Especially now that we have such great E-bikes, so those that are unfit, unhealthy, have hilly commutes etc. can also enjoy a cycle.

    I recall a study a year or so back that found that E-bikes were just as good for health, as those using them were encouraged to do more / go further than they would on a normal bike, so they ended up doing as much cycling, just spread over more mileage. Cool.
    Mart. Cardiff. 5.58 kWp PV systems (3.58 ESE & 2.0 WNW)

    For general PV advice please see the PV FAQ thread on the Green & Ethical Board.
    • Cardew
    • By Cardew 16th Jan 20, 9:16 AM
    • 28,127 Posts
    • 13,956 Thanks
    Cardew
    Although this is getting off subject, I largely agree about cycling. However the dangers of cycling should not be ignored - see https://www.bikeparts.co.uk/blogs/blog/cycling-accident-statistics


    A large increase of 'born again' cyclists would inevitably add to those statistics.


    I worked in Central London for many years and there is a virtual war between cyclists and other motorists.
    • pile-o-stone
    • By pile-o-stone 16th Jan 20, 9:24 AM
    • 382 Posts
    • 643 Thanks
    pile-o-stone
    Although this is getting off subject, I largely agree about cycling. However the dangers of cycling should not be ignored - see https://www.bikeparts.co.uk/blogs/blog/cycling-accident-statistics


    A large increase of 'born again' cyclists would inevitably add to those statistics.


    I worked in Central London for many years and there is a virtual war between cyclists and other motorists.
    Originally posted by Cardew
    If cars are taken out of the equation, then the accident stats would fall off a cliff. You're victim blaming cyclists ('born again" or otherwise). The main problem is is attentive and dengerous/poor drivers. As a motorcyclist I have lost count of the number of cars that edge into the lane next tome on motorways and dual carriageways because their drivers are texting. Then you have the boy racers blasting about everywhere...
    Last edited by pile-o-stone; 16-01-2020 at 9:26 AM.
    5.18 kWp PV systems (3.68 E/W & 1.5 E).
    Solar iBoost+ to two immersion heaters on 300L thermal store.
    Vegan household with 100% composted food waste
    Mini orchard planted and vegetable allotment created.
    • JKenH
    • By JKenH 16th Jan 20, 9:27 AM
    • 1,261 Posts
    • 3,454 Thanks
    JKenH
    Cyclists In the wrong place cause a huge amount of congestion which translates to increased pollution and CO2. Buses and lorries crawling along as they are unable to overtake. I remember on a twisty section of one of the trans-Pennine routes north of Sheffield coming across a line of traffic about half a mile long behind what appeared to be an elderly cyclist struggling with the gradient. Once a fully laden 40 tonne HGV is down to 5mph it needs a big gap to accelerate past a cyclist.

    My wife is a keen leisure cyclist but recognises there is a time and a place for it.

    Continuous, not fragmented, cycle lanes are needed but where are we going to put them in our cities? Delivery lorries and inconsiderate motorist will still park on them.

    Anyway what’s all this got to do with Tesla’s?
    Northern Lincolnshire. 7.8 kWp system, (4.2 kw west facing panels , 3.6 kw east facing), Solis inverters, Solar IBoost water heater, Mitsubishi SRK35ZS-S and SRK20ZS-S Wall Mounted Inverter Heat Pumps, Nissan Leaf (plus some ICEs )
    • JKenH
    • By JKenH 16th Jan 20, 9:32 AM
    • 1,261 Posts
    • 3,454 Thanks
    JKenH
    The same story the world over. Peaks and troughs in EV take up caused by government policy. It is impossible to get a handle on just how well Tesla is doing against this back drop.

    https://seekingalpha.com/news/3532259-new-tesla-registrations-nearly-halve-in-california
    Northern Lincolnshire. 7.8 kWp system, (4.2 kw west facing panels , 3.6 kw east facing), Solis inverters, Solar IBoost water heater, Mitsubishi SRK35ZS-S and SRK20ZS-S Wall Mounted Inverter Heat Pumps, Nissan Leaf (plus some ICEs )
    • ABrass
    • By ABrass 16th Jan 20, 9:53 AM
    • 294 Posts
    • 444 Thanks
    ABrass
    The same story the world over. Peaks and troughs in EV take up caused by government policy. It is impossible to get a handle on just how well Tesla is doing against this back drop.

    https://seekingalpha.com/news/3532259-new-tesla-registrations-nearly-halve-in-california
    Originally posted by JKenH
    It's worth remembering that it's a year on year decrease being reported. Which means it is comparing Q4 2018 with Q4 2019.

    That was the last quarter before the subsidies halved, which meant that Tesla were dumping every car they could make or scrape up from demonstrator fleets into the US market.

    Since then they've started delivering to other markets around the world. Heck they only started delivering the model 3 in the UK and China half way through 2019.

    But there is a glimmer of hope, in a sense. Now the federal tax credits for Tesla have expired it should be a smoother sales pattern in the future for the US.
    • Cardew
    • By Cardew 16th Jan 20, 1:11 PM
    • 28,127 Posts
    • 13,956 Thanks
    Cardew
    You're victim blaming cyclists ('born again" or otherwise). ...
    Originally posted by pile-o-stone

    Pray tell me where I am blaming anyone?



    As that article clearly shows, increased numbers of cyclists means increased accidents and a scraped bodywork on a 'guilty' car can mean a lot more to the two wheeler.
    • pile-o-stone
    • By pile-o-stone 16th Jan 20, 1:24 PM
    • 382 Posts
    • 643 Thanks
    pile-o-stone
    Pray tell me where I am blaming anyone?

    As that article clearly shows, increased numbers of cyclists means increased accidents and a scraped bodywork on a 'guilty' car can mean a lot more to the two wheeler.
    Originally posted by Cardew
    I saw "born again" as a derogatory verb intended to illicit thoughts of inept and dangerous cyclists, practically throwing themselves under cars due to their lack of skills. If that was not your intention, then I apologise.

    Regardless of your intention, there is a prevalence of victim blaming, Old Ken did it just before when he was moaning about cyclists getting in his way on country roads. Perhaps he should leave more time for his journey, drive carefully and enjoy the beauty of the Pennines? Alternatively choose a transpennine route that is barred for cycles and other slower moving vehicles - such as the M62.
    5.18 kWp PV systems (3.68 E/W & 1.5 E).
    Solar iBoost+ to two immersion heaters on 300L thermal store.
    Vegan household with 100% composted food waste
    Mini orchard planted and vegetable allotment created.
    • JKenH
    • By JKenH 16th Jan 20, 1:53 PM
    • 1,261 Posts
    • 3,454 Thanks
    JKenH

    Regardless of your intention, there is a prevalence of victim blaming, Old Ken did it just before when he was moaning about cyclists getting in his way on country roads. Perhaps he should leave more time for his journey, drive carefully and enjoy the beauty of the Pennines? Alternatively choose a transpennine route that is barred for cycles and other slower moving vehicles - such as the M62.
    Originally posted by pile-o-stone
    Think of all the extra CO2 generated by driving at 70 on the motorway and itís much further.

    I moan about horses as well. The huge amount of CO2 generated by a stream of cars having to accelerate again having had to slow down for a horse or cyclist is good enough reason in my view to ban them from main roads or make them pay RFL.

    I am though a huge fan of cycle racing.
    Northern Lincolnshire. 7.8 kWp system, (4.2 kw west facing panels , 3.6 kw east facing), Solis inverters, Solar IBoost water heater, Mitsubishi SRK35ZS-S and SRK20ZS-S Wall Mounted Inverter Heat Pumps, Nissan Leaf (plus some ICEs )
Welcome to our new Forum!

Our aim is to save you money quickly and easily. We hope you like it!

Forum Team Contact us

Live Stats

1,613Posts Today

8,469Users online

Martin's Twitter