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  • FIRST POST
    • angelin
    • By angelin 14th Jun 19, 1:56 PM
    • 211Posts
    • 860Thanks
    angelin
    What happens when my landlords leasehold runs out?
    • #1
    • 14th Jun 19, 1:56 PM
    What happens when my landlords leasehold runs out? 14th Jun 19 at 1:56 PM
    And goes back to the freeholder (the council own the land) my landlord has never mentioned it running out. Ive rented for 20 years (I know). Rumour on my street is that the council owns the land and so do Tescos. Ive checked the land registry and it seems my flat only has five years left on it. I assume my landord bought it fifty years ago knowing this. I absolutely have no clue how this works and I cant see anything on the internet. Do i get served notice from my landlord or does it just play out until the council evict me? I am a key worker locally but i dont think there is such a thing as a council list anymore.

    Should i mention it to my landlord or just keep quiet. Its very worrying but i guess this is the price you pay for renting all your life.
Page 1
    • Carrot007
    • By Carrot007 14th Jun 19, 1:59 PM
    • 2,667 Posts
    • 2,304 Thanks
    Carrot007
    • #2
    • 14th Jun 19, 1:59 PM
    • #2
    • 14th Jun 19, 1:59 PM
    A lot depends on wheather your landlord was allowed to sublet.


    Do what ever you like but prepare a contingency fund.
    • Smellyonion
    • By Smellyonion 14th Jun 19, 2:01 PM
    • 247 Posts
    • 184 Thanks
    Smellyonion
    • #3
    • 14th Jun 19, 2:01 PM
    • #3
    • 14th Jun 19, 2:01 PM
    Are you in a position to purchase the property and fund the lease extension? This may be a way for you to get a decent deal on the property if it adds up.
    I would imagine that your landlord should be aware of this, once his lease expires, the property is immediately not under the ownership of landlord.
    • angelin
    • By angelin 14th Jun 19, 3:11 PM
    • 211 Posts
    • 860 Thanks
    angelin
    • #4
    • 14th Jun 19, 3:11 PM
    • #4
    • 14th Jun 19, 3:11 PM
    My landlord owns hundreds of properties in London so will be up on everything. Ive always looked after the property and its reLly good value for London. I’ll never be in woth a chance to own a London property so buying it wont be an option. Im at a loss as to what the council will do. The street is full of businesses so i cant imagine they will evict everyone overnight but, what do I know?
    • babyblade41
    • By babyblade41 14th Jun 19, 3:16 PM
    • 1,238 Posts
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    babyblade41
    • #5
    • 14th Jun 19, 3:16 PM
    • #5
    • 14th Jun 19, 3:16 PM
    Would it be an idea to ask the council direct ? I am no expert on this at all but sense you are really worried
    • Fire Fox
    • By Fire Fox 14th Jun 19, 3:20 PM
    • 25,155 Posts
    • 29,398 Thanks
    Fire Fox
    • #6
    • 14th Jun 19, 3:20 PM
    • #6
    • 14th Jun 19, 3:20 PM
    And goes back to the freeholder (the council own the land) my landlord has never mentioned it running out. Ive rented for 20 years (I know). Rumour on my street is that the council owns the land and so do Tescos. Ive checked the land registry and it seems my flat only has five years left on it. I assume my landord bought it fifty years ago knowing this. I absolutely have no clue how this works and I cant see anything on the internet. Do i get served notice from my landlord or does it just play out until the council evict me? I am a key worker locally but i dont think there is such a thing as a council list anymore.

    Should i mention it to my landlord or just keep quiet. Its very worrying but i guess this is the price you pay for renting all your life.
    Originally posted by angelin
    If the long lease expires, the property reverts to the freeholder of the building. This is not necessarily the same as who owns the land. The freeholder would have to take appropriate steps to remove any occupants, should they wish to do so.
    Declutterbug-in-progress.⭐️⭐️⭐️ ⭐️⭐️
    • bouicca21
    • By bouicca21 14th Jun 19, 3:20 PM
    • 4,639 Posts
    • 7,465 Thanks
    bouicca21
    • #7
    • 14th Jun 19, 3:20 PM
    • #7
    • 14th Jun 19, 3:20 PM
    Maybe you should check who owns the freehold. Rumour may not be correct.
    • lisyloo
    • By lisyloo 14th Jun 19, 3:25 PM
    • 25,441 Posts
    • 13,643 Thanks
    lisyloo
    • #8
    • 14th Jun 19, 3:25 PM
    • #8
    • 14th Jun 19, 3:25 PM
    I am pretty sure you cannot be evicted overnight.
    These things usually take quite some time and there is notice.

    I think I’d keep quiet but start making contingency plans.
    If initially you don’t have a clue what will happen there is still nothing stopping you saving into a separate account.

    Sometimes I find it easier to create a separate account with my bank e.g. I have one for household bills and one for tax, one for general savings etc.
    • steampowered
    • By steampowered 14th Jun 19, 3:30 PM
    • 3,641 Posts
    • 3,753 Thanks
    steampowered
    • #9
    • 14th Jun 19, 3:30 PM
    • #9
    • 14th Jun 19, 3:30 PM
    Your tenancy agreement will remain binding on the council, when the freehold reverts to them.

    The council could of course give notice to terminate your tenancy once any fixed term has expired, in exactly the same way that your landlord could.

    I don't really know, but I imagine the council would either keep renting to you, or the council would seek to sell the freehold / sell an extension. There is no merit in them evicting people for the sake of it.

    The land registry will tell you who owns the freehold - no need to rely on rumours.
    • lookstraightahead
    • By lookstraightahead 14th Jun 19, 4:13 PM
    • 1,380 Posts
    • 1,286 Thanks
    lookstraightahead
    Is this something that could be a fresh start for you? The freedom that comes with renting is that sometimes you have more choice. Do you have to stay in London?
    • angelin
    • By angelin 14th Jun 19, 4:18 PM
    • 211 Posts
    • 860 Thanks
    angelin
    Well Im in my 50’s and London still excites me so, no I wouldnt want to move away but I certainly couldnt afford to move to a different property in London as I have a good deal here and my landlord is good if the flat has any issues. Eventually I will retire up North.

    Im off to check the land registry......
    • G_M
    • By G_M 14th Jun 19, 4:21 PM
    • 49,607 Posts
    • 61,584 Thanks
    G_M
    If the property reverts to the freeholder, that freeholder becomes yur landlord. Your tenancy agreement is otherwise unaffected.


    Provided they serve you the proper notice of the assignment to the new owner, and the new owner gives ou instruction on rent, you simply strt paying rent as directed.


    Of course, the new owner, now your landlord, may evict you by following the correct procedure (which will depend on your tenancy type). They may or may not.


    You say 20 years.Is that an estimate or an exact period? Wht exact date did your tenancy start? If 20 year I assume you have a standard AST (unless itis an 'agricultural tenancy' or the like).


    Do you have a fixed term tenancy, or has that lapsed (if ever)?
    If fixed term, is there a Break Clause?
    • angelin
    • By angelin 14th Jun 19, 5:42 PM
    • 211 Posts
    • 860 Thanks
    angelin
    I dont really understand the land registry its cost me 9 and im no further on Im sure it just used to be a case of typing the address and it told you the basics. From what the documents the flat was sold in 1936 for 96 years. Two of the shops have been given an extra 10 years from 2017 and the mayor of london owns the land
    • G_M
    • By G_M 14th Jun 19, 5:53 PM
    • 49,607 Posts
    • 61,584 Thanks
    G_M
    Land Registry Title online costs

    3 for the lease Title
    3 for the lease Plan
    3 for the freehold Title
    3 for the freehold Plan

    Are those what you bought? Or did you pay a commercial site for the exact same info but just for the freehold Title?

    But you also need the lease itself -as leaseholder, I assume you have this. If not, the land Registry may have on file. Or is that what you are looking at when you say
    " From what the documents the flat was sold in 1936 for 96 years."?


    If so, I don't see what it is you don't understand. Seems pretty clear. The lease runs out in 2032, and Mayor of London (se below) becomes your new landlord as explained above.


    "the mayor of london owns the land" Do you mean the freehold or something else?
    Last edited by G_M; 14-06-2019 at 5:57 PM.
    • angelin
    • By angelin 14th Jun 19, 6:04 PM
    • 211 Posts
    • 860 Thanks
    angelin
    I havent got the lease as I dont own the flat.yes thats what I paid 3 apop for pages of documents I can make head no tail of and Ive lost now as they dont make it easy. Im sure it just used to be A small table you could check the dates
    Last edited by angelin; 14-06-2019 at 6:14 PM.
    • bouicca21
    • By bouicca21 14th Jun 19, 6:28 PM
    • 4,639 Posts
    • 7,465 Thanks
    bouicca21
    I don’t think there was a mayor of London (as in the post currently held by Sadiq Khan) in 1936. Do you mean the Lord Mayor (of the City of London)?

    Leases do indicate the original purchaser and date of first purchase but that doesn’t mean that the original purchaser is still the owner of the lease. It may have passed through several other owners since 1936 - indeed it would be surprising if it hadn’t.

    And have you looked to see if there is a variation - in other words that the lease has been extended?
    • angelin
    • By angelin 14th Jun 19, 7:35 PM
    • 211 Posts
    • 860 Thanks
    angelin
    I cant see it on there its talking about a butchers shop and allsorts�� it says the land is owned by the Mayor and Burgesses of the Borough. It feels strange looking at it really as its not mine if that makes sense
    • G_M
    • By G_M 14th Jun 19, 7:39 PM
    • 49,607 Posts
    • 61,584 Thanks
    G_M
    I cant see it on there its talking about a butchers shop and allsorts�� it says the land is owned by the Mayor and Burgesses of the Borough. It feels strange looking at it really as its not mine if that makes sense
    Originally posted by angelin
    What is "it"?


    If you don't have the lease, what are you reading? The Title document is unlikely to refer to a butchers shop......


    Referring to "it" and 'documents' is not helpful.
    • bouicca21
    • By bouicca21 14th Jun 19, 7:55 PM
    • 4,639 Posts
    • 7,465 Thanks
    bouicca21
    Ok back to square one. Mayor and burgesses means the council of whatever borough it was in 1936, which presumably will now be subsumed into a London borough.
    • angelin
    • By angelin 15th Jun 19, 10:10 PM
    • 211 Posts
    • 860 Thanks
    angelin
    “It” refers to the documents that came up when I paid my 3 the flats are above shops so its talking about a Butchers which I assume was underneath in the 1930’s
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