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  • FIRST POST
    • Kotov
    • By Kotov 16th May 19, 2:08 PM
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    Kotov
    Tenant Eviction and Notice - Our Rights?
    • #1
    • 16th May 19, 2:08 PM
    Tenant Eviction and Notice - Our Rights? 16th May 19 at 2:08 PM
    Hi,

    Myself and my partner are currently tenants in a property we have lived in for almost 1 year. Our fixed term contract comes to an end on 1st July.

    Our letting agents contacted us well in advance of that on behalf of the landlord to tell us they would like us to renew the contract (and charge us several hundred pounds "administration fee" in the process).

    We were suspicious whether this was actually driven by the landlord (rather than the agent looking to collect their fee) and so suggested letting the contract lapse and fall back to periodic tenancy (this is what we have agreed with previous landlords at our last few rental properties). We do not have the contact details for the landlord.

    In short, the agency have now come back to say the landlord will not accept a periodic tenancy and that they now want to re-market the property to rent and for us to move out on the end of our fixed term on 1st July (option for renewal is off the table).

    1) As far as I understand it, even though our fixed term expires on 1st July, they are required to give us at least 2 months notice, which they haven't (1st July was less than 2 months away). Is this correct?

    2) Could they argue that their initial mail stating that they wanted us to renew the contract counted as giving notice? (They did state that if we did not agree to extend the contract they would discuss with the landlord the option of evicting us under a section 21 notice, but presumably this wouldn't count as a formal notice at that point?)

    3) Assuming my above assumptions are correct, what is our best course of action here? Our preferred aim is basically to drag our eviction date out as long as possible as it's not a good time for us to look for somewhere to move to at the moment due to personal reasons (imminent baby arrival expected..!)

    All in all this is turning out to be a very unpleasant process and by far the worst I've experienced in 10+ years of renting so any advice would be greatly appreciated
Page 1
    • Comms69
    • By Comms69 16th May 19, 2:39 PM
    • 8,059 Posts
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    Comms69
    • #2
    • 16th May 19, 2:39 PM
    • #2
    • 16th May 19, 2:39 PM
    Hi,

    Myself and my partner are currently tenants in a property we have lived in for almost 1 year. Our fixed term contract comes to an end on 1st July.

    Our letting agents contacted us well in advance of that on behalf of the landlord to tell us they would like us to renew the contract (and charge us several hundred pounds "administration fee" in the process). - This isn't mandatory.

    We were suspicious whether this was actually driven by the landlord (rather than the agent looking to collect their fee) and so suggested letting the contract lapse and fall back to periodic tenancy (this is what we have agreed with previous landlords at our last few rental properties). We do not have the contact details for the landlord. - Ask for them

    In short, the agency have now come back to say the landlord will not accept a periodic tenancy and that they now want to re-market the property to rent and for us to move out on the end of our fixed term on 1st July (option for renewal is off the table). - that's fine. They can want whatever they like. You aren't obliged to move

    1) As far as I understand it, even though our fixed term expires on 1st July, they are required to give us at least 2 months notice, which they haven't (1st July was less than 2 months away). Is this correct? - Yes. and that is NOT notice to leave. You aren't obliged to leave. And if you choose to, you must serve your own notice (or leave before July 1st) or you will continue to be liable for rent

    2) Could they argue that their initial mail stating that they wanted us to renew the contract counted as giving notice? (They did state that if we did not agree to extend the contract they would discuss with the landlord the option of evicting us under a section 21 notice, but presumably this wouldn't count as a formal notice at that point?) - No a s.21 notice is very specific.

    3) Assuming my above assumptions are correct, what is our best course of action here? Our preferred aim is basically to drag our eviction date out as long as possible as it's not a good time for us to look for somewhere to move to at the moment due to personal reasons (imminent baby arrival expected..!) - that's fine you'll still be there in 2020 as the average eviction times are 6-9 months

    All in all this is turning out to be a very unpleasant process and by far the worst I've experienced in 10+ years of renting so any advice would be greatly appreciated
    Originally posted by Kotov


    Just ignore the agent. an agent cannot evict you (more or less ever - unless they're also a solicitor basically)
    • Kotov
    • By Kotov 16th May 19, 4:34 PM
    • 4 Posts
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    Kotov
    • #3
    • 16th May 19, 4:34 PM
    • #3
    • 16th May 19, 4:34 PM
    Thanks Comms - all sounds quite reassuring. It had been suggested to me that the fixed term expiry meant they didn't actually have to serve a section 21
    • Comms69
    • By Comms69 16th May 19, 5:13 PM
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    Comms69
    • #4
    • 16th May 19, 5:13 PM
    • #4
    • 16th May 19, 5:13 PM
    Thanks Comms - all sounds quite reassuring. It had been suggested to me that the fixed term expiry meant they didn't actually have to serve a section 21
    Originally posted by Kotov


    Literally no idea who would say that. It's simply not true.


    A tenancy can be ended by two entities.


    You


    The courts.


    To take it to court the LL (or his solicitor, but NOT the agent) must appear in court, having served proper notice. s.21 no fault eviction or s.8 with grounds - e.g. rent arrears.
    • wesleyad
    • By wesleyad 16th May 19, 5:18 PM
    • 480 Posts
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    wesleyad
    • #5
    • 16th May 19, 5:18 PM
    • #5
    • 16th May 19, 5:18 PM
    To take it to court the LL (or his solicitor, but NOT the agent) must appear in court, having served proper notice. s.21 no fault eviction or s.8 with grounds - e.g. rent arrears.
    Originally posted by Comms69
    And lets be honest, before any of that happens it's far more likely a LL finding out his agent is trying it on and telling him porkies about "tenant doesnt want to renew, we need to find a new one. that will be £xxx thanks very much"
    • Comms69
    • By Comms69 16th May 19, 5:20 PM
    • 8,059 Posts
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    Comms69
    • #6
    • 16th May 19, 5:20 PM
    • #6
    • 16th May 19, 5:20 PM
    And lets be honest, before any of that happens it's far more likely a LL finding out his agent is trying it on and telling him porkies about "tenant doesnt want to renew, we need to find a new one. that will be £xxx thanks very much"
    Originally posted by wesleyad
    Indeed. Just providing the legal position. As you say in most cases the LL is happy with a rolling contract
    • anselld
    • By anselld 16th May 19, 5:35 PM
    • 6,278 Posts
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    anselld
    • #7
    • 16th May 19, 5:35 PM
    • #7
    • 16th May 19, 5:35 PM
    "Well in advance" as in before the tenant fee ban.
    Tell them you will be happy to enter into a new fixed term contract starting 1st July if that is what the L wants, but you will not be signing until after 1 June.
    • theartfullodger
    • By theartfullodger 16th May 19, 7:15 PM
    • 10,275 Posts
    • 14,096 Thanks
    theartfullodger
    • #8
    • 16th May 19, 7:15 PM
    • #8
    • 16th May 19, 7:15 PM
    You can of course propose changes in the contract: Lower rent, things being fixed/replaced...



    In your shoes I'd simply not reply at all.
    • G_M
    • By G_M 16th May 19, 8:06 PM
    • 48,056 Posts
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    G_M
    • #9
    • 16th May 19, 8:06 PM
    • #9
    • 16th May 19, 8:06 PM
    read


    * Ending/renewing an AST: what happens when a fixed term ends? How can a LL or tenant end a tenancy? What is a periodic tenancy?
    • chanz4
    • By chanz4 16th May 19, 8:08 PM
    • 10,018 Posts
    • 2,981 Thanks
    chanz4
    go on landregistry online it will give you the owners address
    Don't put your trust into an Experian score - it is not a number any bank will ever use & it is generally a waste of money to purchase it. They are also selling you insurance you dont need.
    • G_M
    • By G_M 16th May 19, 8:20 PM
    • 48,056 Posts
    • 58,842 Thanks
    G_M
    go on landregistry online it will give you the owners address
    Originally posted by chanz4
    That will give the name/address of the property owner, who may well be, but might not be, the landlord.

    Landlord & Tenant Act 1985 section 1:

    1 Disclosure of landlord’s identity.

    (1)If the tenant of premises occupied as a dwelling makes a written request for the landlord’s name and address to—

    (a)any person who demands, or the last person who received, rent payable under the tenancy, or

    (b)any other person for the time being acting as agent for the landlord, in relation to the tenancy,

    that person shall supply the tenant with a written statement of the landlord’s name and address within the period of 21 days beginning with the day on which he receives the request.

    (2)A person who, without reasonable excuse, fails to comply with subsection (1) commits a summary offence and is liable on conviction to a fine not exceeding level 4 on the standard scale.
    • Johnhowell
    • By Johnhowell 16th May 19, 8:24 PM
    • 637 Posts
    • 284 Thanks
    Johnhowell
    go on landregistry online it will give you the owners address
    Originally posted by chanz4
    However, this could be the rented property itself, as many people do not update their details with HMLR. I deal with lots of Land Registry titles and so many have had out of date information for the Proprietor's address.

    OP - why not write to the landlord C/O his agent's address (not the agent, just the address - the agent should forward it, not open it)?

    Good luck,
    J
    • G_M
    • By G_M 16th May 19, 8:28 PM
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    G_M
    I understand that the law does not state it has to be the LL's actual home address, just a UK address suitable for receipt of communications.

    J
    Originally posted by Johnhowell
    There are two quite separate relevant laws. One I quoted above requiring an agent to provide the LL's actual address when asked for in writing by the tenant ( Landlord & Tenant Act 1985 )

    The other requires a LL to provide the tenant, in writing, at the start of every tenancy, with AN address (as you rightly say anywhere in England and Wales [not the UK]) "for serving (official) notices" on the landlord (Landlord and Tenant Act 1987 S48 ).


    48Notification by landlord of address for service of notices.

    (1)A landlord of premises to which this Part applies shall by notice furnish the tenant with an address in England and Wales at which notices (including notices in proceedings) may be served on him by the tenant.

    (2)Where a landlord of any such premises fails to comply with subsection (1), any rent [F203, service charge or administration charge] otherwise due from the tenant to the landlord shall (subject to subsection (3)) be treated for all purposes as not being due from the tenant to the landlord at any time before the landlord does comply with that subsection.
    Last edited by G_M; 16-05-2019 at 8:31 PM.
    • Johnhowell
    • By Johnhowell 16th May 19, 8:31 PM
    • 637 Posts
    • 284 Thanks
    Johnhowell
    Good point G_M

    So the LL/LA could be failing to both Acts?
    • G_M
    • By G_M 16th May 19, 8:34 PM
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    • 58,842 Thanks
    G_M
    Good point G_M

    So the LL/LA could be failing to both Acts?
    Originally posted by Johnhowell
    Don't think the OP has suggested this.

    1) has he actually written to the agent requesting the LL's address (and waited 21 days)?

    2) does the OP's tenancy agreement contain an address in Eng/Wales "for serving notices?"
    • pinkshoes
    • By pinkshoes 16th May 19, 8:35 PM
    • 16,397 Posts
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    pinkshoes
    Another vote for doing nothing.

    Just ignore them for now and see what happens.

    In reality, your LL probably has no idea they are threatening eviction. The agent just wants some money!

    Do nothing, ignore any emails, and let us know what happens next!
    Should've = Should HAVE (not 'of')
    Would've = Would HAVE (not 'of')

    No, I am not perfect, but yes I do judge people on their use of basic English language. If you didn't know the above, then learn it! (If English is your second language, then you are forgiven!)
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