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  • FIRST POST
    • Udder
    • By Udder 16th Apr 19, 7:52 PM
    • 2Posts
    • 2Thanks
    Udder
    2x LBCs from BW Legal (for parking on my street in 2014)
    • #1
    • 16th Apr 19, 7:52 PM
    2x LBCs from BW Legal (for parking on my street in 2014) 16th Apr 19 at 7:52 PM
    Firstly, a huge thanks to all who have contributed to the collective web of knowledge. I have read the Newbies page a few times in the last week and am making my way through the recent pertinent threads on the forum.

    I have been issued with 2 'letter(s) of claim' from BW Legal on behalf of Armtrac Services. I believe these are LBCs due to their citing 30-day deadlines and reply forms. These are both for alleged parking contraventions dating back to 2014. So far I have sent Armtrac a SAR and BW Legal an email citing the SAR I've sent and asking them to restrict data processing & hold off action, as advised in Newbies. In both correspondence I reminded them to consolidate any claims against me. Awaiting responses from both.

    I received a total of 12 PCNs from Armtrac (including the 2 I have received LBCs for) between 2013-15 when I was renting a property on a privately owned street which had its parking managed by this company. The car had a resident's permit displayed but tickets were issued for blocking our own driveway, being parked on areas of the street which were suddenly deemed off-limits (without informing residents .etc). To be honest, I cannot remember the exact details of why any specific ticket was issued and the written documentation from Armtrac, BW Legal and the many intermediary debt collector letters are light on facts. Unfortunately, at the time I was too clueless to gather evidence or dispute the PCNs so here I am.

    I managed to dig up my old tenancy agreement which makes no mention of parking regulations although my old landlady was one of the aforementioned owners contracting Armtrac, and it was from her that we got parking permits. The only even vaguely relevant comment is:
    'That so long as the Tenants shall pay the Rent hereby reserved and perform and observe the agreements and obligations or similar on or by the Tenants herein contained to permit the Tenants quietly to hold and enjoy the Property, Furniture, Fixtures, Fittings during the said Term without interruption by the Landlords or lawful interruption by any person claiming under or in trust for the Landlords.'

    I'm starting a thread preemptively as I understand at this point I should expect BW Legal to proceed. I'm worried about how I can build a robust defence against claims I can no longer remember the particulars of. I will continue reading the forums in the meantime...

    Additionally, my LBC response deadline is 19/4/19. Do I need to badger (i.e. phone) Armtrac/BW Legal for acknowledgement of receiving my emails before then?
Page 1
    • Redx
    • By Redx 16th Apr 19, 7:59 PM
    • 22,245 Posts
    • 28,131 Thanks
    Redx
    • #2
    • 16th Apr 19, 7:59 PM
    • #2
    • 16th Apr 19, 7:59 PM
    just gather your evidence and SAR replies + data etc and do not think you have to meet any LoC deadline , you have done all you need to do for now

    the purpose of the SAR is to get all the missing paperwork and data

    as for a defence , everybody says what you have said , which is rubbish

    you read the OWN SPACE defence by Johnnersh and the 2 BARGEPOLE defences to start wih , then you search for and read any other recent residential permit defence as well in order to formulate your own defence

    once you have done this and seen defences and Witness statements and exhibits and seen the transcripts etc of other cases you can use yourself, you will realise just how much info you have at your fingertips, plus all this prep work is in anticipation of the court claim , so that you have what you need at the very start
    Newbies !!
    Private Parking ticket? check the 2 sticky threads by coupon-mad and crabman in the Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking Board forum for the latest advice or maybe try pepipoo or C.A.G. or legal beagles forums if you need legal advice as well because this parking forum is not about debt collectors or legal matters per se
    • Umkomaas
    • By Umkomaas 16th Apr 19, 8:04 PM
    • 23,080 Posts
    • 36,666 Thanks
    Umkomaas
    • #3
    • 16th Apr 19, 8:04 PM
    • #3
    • 16th Apr 19, 8:04 PM
    Additionally, my LBC response deadline is 19/4/19. Do I need to badger (i.e. phone) Armtrac/BW Legal for acknowledgement of receiving my emails before then?
    A ‘proper’ LBC has to give you 30 days in which to respond, enclose a sheaf of explanatory notes, and a financial pro forma (which you do not complete - none of their business!).

    Does the LBC tell you to whom you should make any payment?
    Please note, we are not a legal, residential or credit advice forum, rather one that helps motorists fight private parking charges, primarily at the 'front-end' of the process.
    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day;
    show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.
    • Udder
    • By Udder 16th Apr 19, 9:11 PM
    • 2 Posts
    • 2 Thanks
    Udder
    • #4
    • 16th Apr 19, 9:11 PM
    • #4
    • 16th Apr 19, 9:11 PM
    Thank you for the reassurance Redx. Feeling a bit overloaded with info at the moment but I'm sure you're right and once I've had a little more time to review and process the relevant defences/hopefully get my SAR stuff back I will be well poised!
    A ‘proper’ LBC has to give you 30 days in which to respond, enclose a sheaf of explanatory notes, and a financial pro forma (which you do not complete - none of their business!).

    Does the LBC tell you to whom you should make any payment?
    Originally posted by Umkomaas
    Yes to the 30 days, sheaf of notes and financial pro forma which I did not complete thanks to the advice already written in Newbies!

    LBC seems to imply I pay the £100 + £60 (lol) to BW Legal via their website.
    • Redx
    • By Redx 16th Apr 19, 10:50 PM
    • 22,245 Posts
    • 28,131 Thanks
    Redx
    • #5
    • 16th Apr 19, 10:50 PM
    • #5
    • 16th Apr 19, 10:50 PM
    for everyone who thinks they have NO defence , here is what coupon-mad says about it


    most people can use bargepole's concise template defence from the NEWBIES thread, and add in a point or two about the facts of the case/contravention/why they are not liable.
    And a point about no landowner authority as seen in other defences.

    and these are 4 examples she has added to that NEWBIES thread, so no idea how you missed them


    Here is a defence for an 'own space' residential site, by Johnersh who is legally qualified:

    and one written by me but based on a template by bargepole (legally qualified), about a residential space (this one has a point about the site being secured by key fob):

    and one I wrote in a similar style with clear headings & sections, about an ''undesignated bay'' allegation in a block of flats:

    Here is one of many residential cases won. This report by bargepole mentions the case transcripts that might help (find them hosted by the Parking Prankster in his CASE LAW pages on his Blog website):
    Last edited by Redx; 16-04-2019 at 10:53 PM.
    Newbies !!
    Private Parking ticket? check the 2 sticky threads by coupon-mad and crabman in the Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking Board forum for the latest advice or maybe try pepipoo or C.A.G. or legal beagles forums if you need legal advice as well because this parking forum is not about debt collectors or legal matters per se
    • The Deep
    • By The Deep 17th Apr 19, 8:28 AM
    • 12,660 Posts
    • 12,888 Thanks
    The Deep
    • #6
    • 17th Apr 19, 8:28 AM
    • #6
    • 17th Apr 19, 8:28 AM
    Get your MP involved, these scammers have no place in residential car parks, read this

    https://parking-prankster.blogspot.com/2016/11/residential-parking.html

    On 15th March 2019 a Bill was enacted to curb the excesses of these private parking companies. Codes of Practice are being drawn up, an independent appeals service will be set up, and access to the DVLA's date base more rigorously policed, and persistent offenders denied access. Hopefully life will become impossible for the worst of these scammers.

    Until this is done you should still complain to your MP, citing the new legislation.

    http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2019/8/contents/enacted

    Just as the clampers were finally closed down, so hopefully will many of these Private Parking Companies.
    You never know how far you can go until you go too far.
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