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    • Just Focus
    • By Just Focus 15th Apr 19, 10:51 AM
    • 16Posts
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    Just Focus
    No fault accident claim queries ...
    • #1
    • 15th Apr 19, 10:51 AM
    No fault accident claim queries ... 15th Apr 19 at 10:51 AM
    Hi All,


    Looking for some advice please in relation to a no-fault accident my vehicle was involved in on Saturday as my insurance company are being very unhelpful. At 3.30PM on Saturday I returned to my parked car to find a vehicle ploughed in to the back of mine and another vehicle on it's roof next to it (odd I know). Basically it looks like the vehicle that hit mine was a learner and the flipped vehicle tried to overtake it through a width restrictor, collided with it, then the side of the road flipping over, and pushing the learner in to the back of my car. Damage is substantial - my entire rear wing is crushed, bumper destroyed, lights smashed and it also pushed the left side of my car in to a log next to the road so damaged the length of the sill. Police and ambulances attended and confirmed that both parties were insured and they said it was clearly the flipped car's fault for a dangerous overtake. So, I phoned my insurer (Admiral) and they confirmed it would be a non-fault claim, taped my car up as best I could and limped home, parking it up. This was nearly 48 hours ago and I have phoned my insurer multiple times to find out why they haven't helped book my vehicle in and provided a hire car for me. They keep saying that because they haven't been able to contact the flipped car driver they can't help with anything, including booking my car in. I asked them what happens if they can't contact the driver and they said tough I would have to wait.


    Now given that I am obviously not at fault I don't really see why I should be losing out here. I'm meant to be going away on Wednesday for Easter and I now have no vehicle. It's an Audi so presumably it would be OK for me to just sort this all out myself? I.e. book it in at Audi, get them to collect it and provide a courtesy car then charge it to whoever the insurers decide the at fault party is? The added confusion is that the flipped car is also insured with Admiral, and I have a feeling that is why they are being so rubbish to me i.e. they know that any costs I incur will also fall to them. I have friends who've been involved in non-fault claims and they've had their car collected and been in a like-for-like hire car within the same day...


    I hear about credit hire companies but haven't been contacted by anyone about that possibility. Admiral did say the first time I reported the claim that I could deal with it through their claim management company but they said it would be easier and quicker if I dealt directly with them because the at fault party is also insured with them. I'm guessing that if I'd gone through the claim management company they would have had me in a hire car potentially?


    Any advice much appreciated.
Page 2
    • Aylesbury Duck
    • By Aylesbury Duck 15th Apr 19, 1:56 PM
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    Aylesbury Duck
    That's helpful advice. The vehicle I am being given as a rental is an A4 Avant the same as my damaged vehicle so it's not over-specced. I obviously won't be keeping it any longer that in takes for the repairs to be carried out. I don't use the vehicle for commuting, it's for SDP and, as I said above, I am going on holiday in the car on Wednesday for Easter so need a replacement vehicle.
    Originally posted by Just Focus
    Just be careful. It may be a match for your current vehicle but that is a classic pitfall seen on here when people insist on a like-for-like hire car. For example, I drive a large family car but if it were off the road for a week or two, could I make a Fiesta or Yaris work for me? Yes. The difference in hire costs between a Mondeo and a Fiesta can be sizeable and the insurer may only pay costs for the latter, leaving me to pick up the difference.

    If you're confident you have the justification for the spec of car for the duration you need it, and can show that if needs be, you'll be fine. One final point, make sure you fully understand the insurance cover on the hire car and any excesses that apply. A lot of people make assumptions there, too.
    • Takmon
    • By Takmon 15th Apr 19, 2:11 PM
    • 416 Posts
    • 369 Thanks
    Takmon
    That's helpful advice. The vehicle I am being given as a rental is an A4 Avant the same as my damaged vehicle so it's not over-specced. I obviously won't be keeping it any longer that in takes for the repairs to be carried out. I don't use the vehicle for commuting, it's for SDP and, as I said above, I am going on holiday in the car on Wednesday for Easter so need a replacement vehicle.
    Originally posted by Just Focus
    How much is the rental fee per day? These companies often charge an extortionate fee for credit hire which is many times more than the cost of renting a car yourself. If the fee is too high the insurance company could challenge it.

    The Claims Company may also delay repairs to your vehicle knowing they are racking up a nice profit.

    You could have paid to hire a car yourself and then got reimbursed when the insurance company settle the claim.
    • DoaM
    • By DoaM 15th Apr 19, 2:46 PM
    • 6,749 Posts
    • 6,666 Thanks
    DoaM


    You're right. Unless the commenters above are correct that I should have been claiming off the learner rather than the car roller.


    Car A - Mine. Insured by Admiral.
    Car B - Learner vehicle. Collided with mine. Insured by A.N. Other insurer.
    Car C - Rolled over vehicle. At fault according to police. Insured by Admiral.
    Originally posted by Just Focus
    You should be claiming off B, so you need to find out who their insurance company are.

    Engaging the CMC (AMC) yourself was a Bad Idea ™
    Diary of a madman
    Walk the line again today
    Entries of confusion
    Dear diary, I'm here to stay
    • alfie1950
    • By alfie1950 15th Apr 19, 3:03 PM
    • 67 Posts
    • 23 Thanks
    alfie1950
    As it stands your car will be with an Audi dealer bodyshop tomorrow morning but not all dealer bodyshop's are manufacturer accreditted so the dealer may not be allocated the work.
    It may then have to be moved to an Audi accreditted repairer.
    People usually get tunnel vision about getting a replacement car and it clouds normal thinking .
    • gzoom
    • By gzoom 15th Apr 19, 5:50 PM
    • 326 Posts
    • 322 Thanks
    gzoom
    I know that CMCs are leeches and that credit hire is the reason premiums are so horrendously high (along with whiplash claims) but honestly why should I have to mess around with a completely substandard service from my insurer when I've done nothing wrong at all? I always thought I'd be someone who refuses to use CMCs (hence why I refused them on the day of the accident) but frankly I can see why people do now.
    Originally posted by Just Focus
    There really are some ridiculously comments on here about CMC/AMCs.

    Like you I never thought I would use one, until I had my non-fault crash.

    My own insurance company (Direct Line) sent me a Seat Leon as a 'like for like' replacement car when I my own car was a 6 seater electric SUV.

    They then sent my car to a local garage who called me to ask how to open the door as they didn't have a clue where to start on how to assess the car, and than tried to get me to pay my excess until the claim was settled. The final straw was when third party claimed I was at fault despite having dash cam evidence, and my own insurance company just in effect shrugged their shoulders.

    Involving an independent accident management company was the best thing I did.

    Within in 24hrs I had a exact 'like for like' car delivered to my work address, and they sorted out the previous loan car to be picked up. They got my car transferred to a garage who knew what they were doing, and when the third party insurance company started sending threatening letters they contacted them directly to get them to stop. They even helped to negotiate a prompt and satisfactory settlement with my own insurance company.

    Ignore all the negative comments about CMC/AMC, as you have said until your face with dealing with an incompetent insurance company you don't realise the valuable service these parties provide.

    I didn't asked to be rammed off the road by an idiot driver, and I suspect you also didn't expect your car to be damaged the week before Easter. The whole thing is stressful enough already, so let some else deal with the stress.

    Hope your Easter plans can continue as planned.
    • gzoom
    • By gzoom 15th Apr 19, 5:59 PM
    • 326 Posts
    • 322 Thanks
    gzoom
    Oh I should add the Third party insurance company on question was Admiral.

    Their behaviour bordered on been illegal. I got letter from them using very carefully phased words to suggest they would NOT pay a single penny out for the entire claim if I didn't accept their first offer. Legally the letter used no firm words that would considered legally binding, but the over message was clear - It was essentially a threat but worded so if challenged in court they can say that wasn't the message.

    They than called me and tried to get me to 'trip up' by asking me using the specific phrase 'But you don't really need a car every day do you as your wife has a car?'. They were clearly trying to get me to imply I wasn't 'minimising' my costs as the law states.

    My experience with my non-fault claim has shown me just how corked the whole insurance industry is, CMC/AMCs are least of the problems. Companies like Admiral really should be banned, they have little interest in helping their customers or dealing with claims, its all about and they will use very trick in the book.
    Last edited by gzoom; 15-04-2019 at 6:02 PM.
    • Aylesbury Duck
    • By Aylesbury Duck 15th Apr 19, 6:04 PM
    • 3,489 Posts
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    Aylesbury Duck
    An insurance company focusing on profits? I'm shocked.
    • gzoom
    • By gzoom 16th Apr 19, 5:05 AM
    • 326 Posts
    • 322 Thanks
    gzoom
    An insurance company focusing on profits? I'm shocked.
    Originally posted by Aylesbury Duck
    Thats why as consumers we NEED accident management companies, and I wouldn't hesitate to use another one if needed.
    Last edited by gzoom; 16-04-2019 at 5:07 AM.
    • alfie1950
    • By alfie1950 16th Apr 19, 6:27 AM
    • 67 Posts
    • 23 Thanks
    alfie1950
    Many people have good experiences with AMC's but it is a bit of a generalisation from your one experience to extol their virtues .
    I deal with insurance companies , bodyshop's and AMC's and there as many bad experiences as good.
    As I said earlier with many drivers the main issue is the rush to get a replacement car at all costs and that is the AMC's main aim , to get you in to hire as soon as possible , once your in hire costs are clicking up , many drivers later change their minds about using the AMC , cancel the claim through them and are then stuck with the costs to date.
    I'm glad you had a good experience but believe me it's not all a bed of roses.
    • Aylesbury Duck
    • By Aylesbury Duck 16th Apr 19, 7:14 AM
    • 3,489 Posts
    • 4,713 Thanks
    Aylesbury Duck
    Thats why as consumers we NEED accident management companies, and I wouldn't hesitate to use another one if needed.
    Originally posted by gzoom
    There's a flaw in your logic there.
    • caprikid1
    • By caprikid1 16th Apr 19, 12:15 PM
    • 748 Posts
    • 730 Thanks
    caprikid1
    GZoom it sounds like you have had a similar experience as I had with Direct Line.


    Can you confirm the accident management company you used.


    Thanks
    • caprikid1
    • By caprikid1 16th Apr 19, 12:19 PM
    • 748 Posts
    • 730 Thanks
    caprikid1
    An insurance company focusing on profits? I'm shocked.
    Originally posted by Aylesbury Duck


    Problem is though that there is no protection for the consumer. Once your crashed car leaves you , you have no control of the repairs. From the conversations I have had they will quite happily go for substandard repairs so long as it looks ok with the consumer non the wiser.


    I have come to the conclusion I would probably never drive a vehicle again that I allowed to go to the insurers approved Chop Shop as there is no chance of the structure being repaired to an acceptable standard.
    • Just Focus
    • By Just Focus 16th Apr 19, 12:21 PM
    • 16 Posts
    • 5 Thanks
    Just Focus
    There really are some ridiculously comments on here about CMC/AMCs.

    Like you I never thought I would use one, until I had my non-fault crash.

    My own insurance company (Direct Line) sent me a Seat Leon as a 'like for like' replacement car when I my own car was a 6 seater electric SUV.

    They then sent my car to a local garage who called me to ask how to open the door as they didn't have a clue where to start on how to assess the car, and than tried to get me to pay my excess until the claim was settled. The final straw was when third party claimed I was at fault despite having dash cam evidence, and my own insurance company just in effect shrugged their shoulders.

    Involving an independent accident management company was the best thing I did.

    Within in 24hrs I had a exact 'like for like' car delivered to my work address, and they sorted out the previous loan car to be picked up. They got my car transferred to a garage who knew what they were doing, and when the third party insurance company started sending threatening letters they contacted them directly to get them to stop. They even helped to negotiate a prompt and satisfactory settlement with my own insurance company.

    Ignore all the negative comments about CMC/AMC, as you have said until your face with dealing with an incompetent insurance company you don't realise the valuable service these parties provide.

    I didn't asked to be rammed off the road by an idiot driver, and I suspect you also didn't expect your car to be damaged the week before Easter. The whole thing is stressful enough already, so let some else deal with the stress.

    Hope your Easter plans can continue as planned.
    Originally posted by gzoom

    Thanks for your comments. As an update, at 9AM this morning a clean and tidy 17 plate Audi A4 Avant was delivered to my address. The deliverer was very helpful and happy for me to film the outside of the vehicle for damage. The daily charge is c.165 per day. About 5 minutes after he left a very professional and friendly tow-truck driver turned up and took my vehicle to an approved Audi bodyshop. Both the delivery and collection occurred within 10 minutes of when I was told that it would and they were both friendly and professional meaning I could get to straight to work. So far, it's been a thoroughly positive experience that echoes yours. The company is called CX as I mentioned above.
    • Just Focus
    • By Just Focus 16th Apr 19, 12:25 PM
    • 16 Posts
    • 5 Thanks
    Just Focus
    Thanks for your comments. As an update, at 9AM this morning a clean and tidy 17 plate Audi A4 Avant was delivered to my address. The deliverer was very helpful and happy for me to film the outside of the vehicle for damage. The daily charge is c.165 per day. About 5 minutes after he left a very professional and friendly tow-truck driver turned up and took my vehicle to an approved Audi bodyshop. Both the delivery and collection occurred within 10 minutes of when I was told that it would and they were both friendly and professional meaning I could get to straight to work. So far, it's been a thoroughly positive experience that echoes yours. The company is called CX as I mentioned above.
    Originally posted by Just Focus

    I also specced up the equivalent rental from Sixt and it was 127.50 per day, without delivery and collection.
    • caprikid1
    • By caprikid1 16th Apr 19, 12:28 PM
    • 748 Posts
    • 730 Thanks
    caprikid1
    Thanks for your comments. As an update, at 9AM this morning a clean and tidy 17 plate Audi A4 Avant was delivered to my address. The deliverer was very helpful and happy for me to film the outside of the vehicle for damage. The daily charge is c.165 per day. About 5 minutes after he left a very professional and friendly tow-truck driver turned up and took my vehicle to an approved Audi bodyshop. Both the delivery and collection occurred within 10 minutes of when I was told that it would and they were both friendly and professional meaning I could get to straight to work. So far, it's been a thoroughly positive experience that echoes yours. The company is called CX as I mentioned above.
    Originally posted by Just Focus
    What frustrates me is that the insurance company create the market for these people to exist by abusing the good will of customers and victims. It costs us all more in the long run but they just don't care and happy to charge us more.
    • Just Focus
    • By Just Focus 16th Apr 19, 12:33 PM
    • 16 Posts
    • 5 Thanks
    Just Focus
    What frustrates me is that the insurance company create the market for these people to exist by abusing the good will of customers and victims. It costs us all more in the long run but they just don't care and happy to charge us more.
    Originally posted by caprikid1

    I completely agree and this is exactly my point. Why should I be without a vehicle or any contact at all from my insurer after a no-fault accident 48 hours after the collision? It's totally unacceptable. The service that I am receiving from the AMC is only what I should be receiving from my own insurer but don't. I obviously don't want them charging nearly 2 hundred quid a day to the insured (as this drives all our premiums up) but if my insurer won't provide even a basic level of customer service why should I have to suffer and what other option do I have? I could go and try to rent a car myself and go through that hassle, as well as having to pay significant costs up front and then have to worry about contacting the at fault party's insurer etc, then book myself in for repairs but why should I go through that inconvenience.
    • caprikid1
    • By caprikid1 16th Apr 19, 1:14 PM
    • 748 Posts
    • 730 Thanks
    caprikid1
    I have to say despite the response from others who clearly work in the industry, I do not see why if I buy a BMW 7 series I should be expected to drive a Corsa.


    I have been without my car for some considerable time as I refused to let it be taken way to their chop shop. I am not allowed a hire car as I have another car. Why should I be without the ability to drive the car I want ?
    • Just Focus
    • By Just Focus 16th Apr 19, 2:25 PM
    • 16 Posts
    • 5 Thanks
    Just Focus
    Just got contacted by the body shop and looks likely to be write-off which is gutting. I'll no doubt be horribly stung on the offer and I only bought it 5 months ago, and paid extra for an extended warranty.
    • caprikid1
    • By caprikid1 16th Apr 19, 2:43 PM
    • 748 Posts
    • 730 Thanks
    caprikid1
    I think you will have a massive fight, good luck.
    • Aylesbury Duck
    • By Aylesbury Duck 16th Apr 19, 2:57 PM
    • 3,489 Posts
    • 4,713 Thanks
    Aylesbury Duck
    I have to say despite the response from others who clearly work in the industry, I do not see why if I buy a BMW 7 series I should be expected to drive a Corsa.


    I have been without my car for some considerable time as I refused to let it be taken way to their chop shop. I am not allowed a hire car as I have another car. Why should I be without the ability to drive the car I want ?
    Originally posted by caprikid1
    And there it is, the classic refrain on these forums when someone gets answers they don't agree with. "You must work for company x". Such a tired and baseless accusation...so predictable, too.

    It's not about you not being allowed to drive the car you want, you can do what you like. What you can't do is pay no heed to the costs you rack up unnecessarily through brand/experience snobbery. If you can demonstrate you must have a hire car of equal size and spec, there's no problem in getting it paid for. You clearly didn't do that, so enjoy the Corsa.
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