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  • FIRST POST
    • Scarborough Flyer
    • By Scarborough Flyer 12th Jan 19, 10:43 PM
    • 2Posts
    • 1Thanks
    Scarborough Flyer
    PCN for loading in disabled parking bay
    • #1
    • 12th Jan 19, 10:43 PM
    PCN for loading in disabled parking bay 12th Jan 19 at 10:43 PM
    Hi. Would be grateful for any advice or suggestions on the following. Went shopping yesterday at the Range in Stockton. Car park was quiet, less than half full. Went into store and ended up buying two chairs. Left my wife with these and went to move car closer to store exit as they were large and heavy. In front of the store were maybe 10 disabled parking bays which were empty. I reversed into one, went into store and brought chairs out. Spent a bit of time putting car back seats down and loading new chairs. I then went back into the store to find my wife who was now looking at some other things! We returned to car a few minutes later to find PCN on the windscreen.
    The time on the ticket is 8 minutes after the time on my till receipt from the Range. Should I pay the £60 charge?
    A few further points: the car park is free of charge. I was not aware it was 'controlled. I did not see any signage (although I saw afterwards that there are some high up on posts!). There was no signage adjacent to the disabled bays.
    I appreciate that disabled bays are for disabled drivers but they were all empty and I was there for about 5 minutes. I saw the parking attendant when we were leaving so stopped and asked him about the ticket. He said he had watched me park and load my vehicle but gave me a ticket because I then went back into the store and '3 people complained to him that I shouldn't be allowed to use the disabled bay' !? He suggested that if I knew someone who had a blue badge I should appeal saying that they were with me and the badge had fallen off the dashboard!!
    Part of me thinks I should just pay the £60 and forget about it, but on the other hand I think that is excessive under the circumstances. Would welcome any comments, suggestions, etc. Thanks.
Page 1
    • Ralph-y
    • By Ralph-y 12th Jan 19, 10:50 PM
    • 2,920 Posts
    • 3,664 Thanks
    Ralph-y
    • #2
    • 12th Jan 19, 10:50 PM
    • #2
    • 12th Jan 19, 10:50 PM
    hi, and welcome to the forum ...


    have a read of the newbie thread



    https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=4816822


    to find the template for the first appeal ...


    who is the PPC ?


    take chairs back for a refund as they are now to dear after your parking invoice





    Ralph
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 12th Jan 19, 10:51 PM
    • 65,507 Posts
    • 78,062 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    • #3
    • 12th Jan 19, 10:51 PM
    • #3
    • 12th Jan 19, 10:51 PM
    '3 people complained to him that I shouldn't be allowed to use the disabled bay'
    He lied.

    He suggested that if I knew someone who had a blue badge I should appeal saying that they were with me and the badge had fallen off the dashboard!!
    What a nasty piece of work he is.

    Which parking firm? You know to appeal on day 26, from the NEWBIES thread.
    PRIVATE 'PCN'? DON'T PAY BUT DON'T IGNORE IT UNLESS IN SCOTLAND OR NI
    TWO Clicks needed Look up, top of the page:
    Main site>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets Fines & Parking - read the NEWBIES THREAD
    • Sligo Smokey
    • By Sligo Smokey 12th Jan 19, 10:52 PM
    • 25 Posts
    • 5 Thanks
    Sligo Smokey
    • #4
    • 12th Jan 19, 10:52 PM
    • #4
    • 12th Jan 19, 10:52 PM
    Only blue badge holders, displaying a badge, may use disabled parking bays. .......bloody simple really... and you know it!!
    • Ralph-y
    • By Ralph-y 12th Jan 19, 10:55 PM
    • 2,920 Posts
    • 3,664 Thanks
    Ralph-y
    • #5
    • 12th Jan 19, 10:55 PM
    • #5
    • 12th Jan 19, 10:55 PM
    wrong ......
    Ralph
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 12th Jan 19, 11:00 PM
    • 65,507 Posts
    • 78,062 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    • #6
    • 12th Jan 19, 11:00 PM
    • #6
    • 12th Jan 19, 11:00 PM
    Disabled people (no blue badge) can use a disabled bay on private land.

    BB is a Council on-street scheme that PPCs hijack to confuse people into thinking they can restrict private bay to BB holders. They can't, as long as a person meets the definition of disability. No permit needed at all, no BB.

    Not saying the OP does meet the definition of disability, nor that this was right. But read what the nasty piece of work who ticketed him, lied about! Horrible jumped up person hiding then swooping, when the OP effectively had permission to briefly load.

    Sligo Smokey, you need to stop swallowing he PPC misinformation that they can abuse the BB scheme (the PPCs abuse the scheme) and that a BB is needed.

    Nope.
    Last edited by Coupon-mad; 12-01-2019 at 11:02 PM.
    PRIVATE 'PCN'? DON'T PAY BUT DON'T IGNORE IT UNLESS IN SCOTLAND OR NI
    TWO Clicks needed Look up, top of the page:
    Main site>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets Fines & Parking - read the NEWBIES THREAD
    • Scarborough Flyer
    • By Scarborough Flyer 13th Jan 19, 9:26 AM
    • 2 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    Scarborough Flyer
    • #7
    • 13th Jan 19, 9:26 AM
    • #7
    • 13th Jan 19, 9:26 AM
    Thank you all for quick responses.
    The PPC is UKPC.
    Do you think it is worth complaining to the Range? Or does that risk them contacting UKPC with my details? I also see on the Range website that it specifically states that they cannot assist with 3rd party parking issues - maybe in response to high number of complaints!
    If I go down the day 26 appeal route, what is the worst case scenario? Do I open up the potential to get hit for court costs if I eventually lose the appeal? If so how much could it be? There are some scary £figures on the UKPC website - But I suppose that is why they are there!
    When I appeal on day 26 do I avoid giving my home address to UKPC, or does that not matter as presumably they can get this from DVLA?
    • Umkomaas
    • By Umkomaas 13th Jan 19, 9:36 AM
    • 21,294 Posts
    • 33,517 Thanks
    Umkomaas
    • #8
    • 13th Jan 19, 9:36 AM
    • #8
    • 13th Jan 19, 9:36 AM
    Do you think it is worth complaining to the Range?
    Always complain to the retailer. The Range is not normally helpful, but your complaint gives them hassle to deal with, which may be the straw on the camel's back that persuades them to get rid of the root cause of their hassle.

    Or does that risk them contacting UKPC with my details?
    They can't - DPA.

    If I go down the day 26 appeal route, what is the worst case scenario?
    Maybe they still go to the DVLA for your details.

    Do I open up the potential to get hit for court costs if I eventually lose the appeal?
    You won't win any appeal directly with UKPC, it just opens the way to getting a POPLA Code.

    If so how much could it be? There are some scary £figures on the UKPC website
    You're way too far ahead of yourself. If ultimately you lost in court - £200 max, all in.

    When I appeal on day 26 do I avoid giving my home address to UKPC, or does that not matter as presumably they can get this from DVLA?
    The whole purpose of issuing the appeal late is to divert the PPC from accessing your data via the DVLA. Not getting it from the DVLA means they cannot hold the keeper liable under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012.

    So of course you give them your address!
    Please note, we are not a legal, residential or credit advice forum, rather one that helps motorists fight private parking charges, primarily at the 'front-end' of the process.
    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.
    • The Deep
    • By The Deep 13th Jan 19, 9:42 AM
    • 11,443 Posts
    • 11,498 Thanks
    The Deep
    • #9
    • 13th Jan 19, 9:42 AM
    • #9
    • 13th Jan 19, 9:42 AM
    AFAIAA, The Range will not help you.

    IMO, if they have all their ducks in a row, they are right, but PPCs rarely align waterfowl precisely, so read the FAQs/stickies to see if you have a case.

    Consider raising the matter with your MP as it is the will of Parliament that these scammers be put out of business.

    Hopefully that will take place in the near future. The Bill has passed through the HOC without hitch, and goes to the Lords soon. In the meantime involve your MP, the poor dears are buckling under the weight of complaints about these scammers.

    This is an entirely unregulated industry which is scamming the public with inflated claims for minor breaches of alleged contracts for alleged parking offences, aided and abetted by a handful of low-rent solicitors. Is has been suggested by an MP that some of these companies may have connections to organised crime.

    Parking Eye, CPM, Smart, (especially Smart}, and others have already been named and shamed in the House of Commons as have Gladstones Solicitors, and BW Legal, (these two law firms take hundreds of these cases to court each week), hospital car parks and residential complex tickets have been especially mentioned. They lose most of them, and have been reported to the regulatory authority by an M.P. for unprofessional conduct

    The problem has become so widespread that MPs have agreed to enact a Bill to regulate these scammers.

    Sir Greg Knight's Private Members Bill to curb the excesses, and perhaps close down, some of these companies passed its Third Reading in late November, and, with a fair wind, will become Law next year.

    All three readings are available to watch on the internet, (some 6-7 hours), and published in Hansard. MPs have an extremely low opinion of the industry. Many are complaining that they are becoming overwhelmed by complaints from members of the public. Add to their burden, complain in the most robust terms about the scammers.
    You never know how far you can go until you go too far.
    • Fruitcake
    • By Fruitcake 13th Jan 19, 4:11 PM
    • 38,500 Posts
    • 86,321 Thanks
    Fruitcake
    You parked in a disabled bay and got caught by a bunch of unregulated scammers.

    Hopefully you will never park in a disabled bay again unless an occupant of the car has a disability that is covered by the Equality Act 2010.

    You had a number of options including parking elsewhere or asking staff to help loading.

    However, we are here to help people against these scammers, so appeal using the template in blue text from the NEWBIES thread. If/when it is rejected you make a second stage appeal to PoPLA. Use all the relevant points available including the fact that loading/unloading is not parking.


    Only blue badge holders, displaying a badge, may use disabled parking bays. .......bloody simple really... and you know it!!
    Originally posted by Sligo Smokey
    So simple that you have got it completely wrong.
    The blue badge scheme does not apply on private land.

    That is no excuse for parking in a disabled bay, but many people are entitled to park in one who do not have a BB. The law is quite clear on this.
    Last edited by Fruitcake; 13-01-2019 at 4:29 PM.
    I married my cousin. I had to...
    I don't have a sister.

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    "You're Safety Is My Primary Concern Dear" - Laks
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 15th Jan 19, 12:37 AM
    • 65,507 Posts
    • 78,062 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    The entire point of appealing on day 26 online is TO STOP UKPC from going to the DVLA...so of course you must include your postal address as registered keeper.

    It is explained in the NEWBIES thread & no appeal is ever sent with no address!
    PRIVATE 'PCN'? DON'T PAY BUT DON'T IGNORE IT UNLESS IN SCOTLAND OR NI
    TWO Clicks needed Look up, top of the page:
    Main site>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets Fines & Parking - read the NEWBIES THREAD
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