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  • FIRST POST
    • Itsascam
    • By Itsascam 6th Jan 19, 7:23 PM
    • 14Posts
    • 15Thanks
    Itsascam
    Indigo ITAL appeal
    • #1
    • 6th Jan 19, 7:23 PM
    Indigo ITAL appeal 6th Jan 19 at 7:23 PM
    I'm a newbie but have spent quite a bit of time reading up and still not sure what I should do next.
    I am the keeper of a vehicle that received a PCN from Indigo on 07/11.
    Following advice on various threads I waited until a letter was received by the owner. I took this to be the notice to keeper.
    This was appealed online using the template in the newbie forum.
    This was rejected by an email from zzps on 18/12
    In here there is a note that this can be appealed to ITAL including an ITAL Verification Code.

    I read the thread linked from here entitled "Mainly for Regulars - a new twist on the Indigo appeals procedures" - sorry as a Newbie I can't post the link directly) .
    The current case is similar to the one described here, except the current case received the PCN on the windscreen, and the date of the appeal completing on the parking cowboys POPLA code checker (sorry not allowed to post the link) is 5 days after the pepipoo case.

    I intend to follow fairly closely the appeal wording on this Peepipo forum (barring the 15 day time out which I understand does not apply to PCNs in the windscreen).

    I've checked the POPLA appeals site for wording but Indigo appeals seem to stop in 2017 - and I do understand that Indigo are now suppose to provide POPLA codes. I guess there have not been any yet?

    The chap in the peepipo case has stated that the ITAL code does not work on the POPLA website and that is where the thread ends, but I assume he will end up only appealing to ITAL. I will follow this other case closely and hopefully since I have a couple of days extra I will know the outcome in time, but.......

    That may not be the case so wanted to check with the old hands on here if they agree with this approach? The current deadline is Jan 15th the Peepipo case in Jan 10th.

    I notice the advice on MSE tends to be one appeal at a time, wherease over on the peepipo case there seem to be several appeals in one?

    I can post the wording from the other forum if people like (it's quite long)
Page 2
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 12th Jan 19, 9:16 PM
    • 68,567 Posts
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    Coupon-mad
    Expect to lose but as long as nothing says you are committing yourself to an ADR where the decision is legally binding on you, it's fine.

    Check the small print as you are one of the first to try and none of us have done.
    PRIVATE 'PCN'? DON'T PAY BUT DON'T IGNORE IT UNLESS IN SCOTLAND OR NI
    TWO Clicks needed Look up, top of the page:
    Main site>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets Fines & Parking - read the NEWBIES THREAD
    • twhitehousescat
    • By twhitehousescat 12th Jan 19, 9:23 PM
    • 3,341 Posts
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    twhitehousescat
    there is no small print , look at appeal form

    however , reaf this

    "Should you remain dissatisfied with this decision, or have additional evidence, you may further your appeal to the Appeals Service within 28 days of receiving your rejection letter. Appeals may be submitted online at www.asparking.co.uk or by post at:

    Appeals Service (Parking)
    PO Box 267
    Petersfield
    GU32 9FH

    You’ll be issued with a 10 digit verification code, which you must use with your appeal to the Appeals Service. This is shown at the top of your rejection letter. The Appeals Service process does not apply in Scotland or to PN’s (Penalty Notices) received at a railway station car park.
    Time pretending I was asleep whilst under his desk , has given me insight to this sordid world
    • Handbags-at-dawn
    • By Handbags-at-dawn 12th Jan 19, 9:34 PM
    • 178 Posts
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    Handbags-at-dawn
    there is no small print , look at appeal form

    however , reaf this

    "Should you remain dissatisfied with this decision, or have additional evidence, you may further your appeal to the Appeals Service within 28 days of receiving your rejection letter. Appeals may be submitted online at www.asparking.co.uk or by post at:

    Appeals Service (Parking)
    PO Box 267

    Petersfield
    GU32 9FH

    Youíll be issued with a 10 digit verification code, which you must use with your appeal to the Appeals Service. This is shown at the top of your rejection letter. The Appeals Service process does not apply in Scotland or to PNís (Penalty Notices) received at a railway station car park.
    Originally posted by twhitehousescat
    Well spotted. What a complete Horlicks....

    And so much for being independent. The whole FAQs page seems to have been written by and for the benefit of Indigo. This is the link I think:
    https://www.asparking.co.uk/Faq

    What on earth does the BPA think itís doing?
    • twhitehousescat
    • By twhitehousescat 12th Jan 19, 9:40 PM
    • 3,341 Posts
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    twhitehousescat
    ok we have a problem , or rather indigo have

    the DFT state that in cases bylaws/railway (indigo) that notices must be called penalty notices https://popla.co.uk/docs/default-source/default-document-library/popla-update-on-tickets-issued-for-alleged-breach-of-byelaws.pdf?sfvrsn=0 and that an indipendent appeal service must be offered

    popla quickly realised they were going to have to work - with no pay (no evidence offered) and quickly declined the offer , ITAL was hastily set up , but are now saying no penalty notices

    i wonder if DFT know what the hell is happening
    Time pretending I was asleep whilst under his desk , has given me insight to this sordid world
    • Itsascam
    • By Itsascam 13th Jan 19, 1:29 PM
    • 14 Posts
    • 15 Thanks
    Itsascam
    Many thanks all. It sounds to me like the appeal to ITAL is giving everyone that does so an extra 28 days. Great!

    I will double check that I'm not committing myself to an ADR before submitting.

    Will let people know what happens.
    • Itsascam
    • By Itsascam 13th Jan 19, 1:35 PM
    • 14 Posts
    • 15 Thanks
    Itsascam
    And the website to appeal the appeal is bla.parkindigoappeals.bla - actually has Indigo in the url even! (I had to put the blas in as a newbie)
    • Itsascam
    • By Itsascam 13th Jan 19, 1:48 PM
    • 14 Posts
    • 15 Thanks
    Itsascam
    Sorry realised that is just the faqs as if appealing to indigo rather than the challenge the results of that appeal - as somone pointed out. What a load of brown stuff.
    • twhitehousescat
    • By twhitehousescat 13th Jan 19, 1:49 PM
    • 3,341 Posts
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    twhitehousescat
    yup




    but in theory you have already made an appeal to indigo and been given a code for ital
    Time pretending I was asleep whilst under his desk , has given me insight to this sordid world
    • Fruitcake
    • By Fruitcake 13th Jan 19, 1:54 PM
    • 39,126 Posts
    • 87,388 Thanks
    Fruitcake
    ok we have a problem , or rather indigo have

    the DFT state that in cases bylaws/railway (indigo) that notices must be called penalty notices https://popla.co.uk/docs/default-source/default-document-library/popla-update-on-tickets-issued-for-alleged-breach-of-byelaws.pdf?sfvrsn=0 and that an indipendent appeal service must be offered

    popla quickly realised they were going to have to work - with no pay (no evidence offered) and quickly declined the offer , ITAL was hastily set up , but are now saying no penalty notices

    i wonder if DFT know what the hell is happening
    Originally posted by twhitehousescat
    The DfT didn't say this, at least not in the letter they wrote to PoPLA last June. It mentions ticketing and parking charge notices, but not penalty notices.

    yup




    but in theory you have already made an appeal to indigo and been given a code for ital
    Originally posted by twhitehousescat
    How to appeal a parking fine by Indigo. Fine? Complaint to the BPA methinks.
    I married my cousin. I had to...
    I don't have a sister.

    All my screwdrivers are cordless.
    "You're Safety Is My Primary Concern Dear" - Laks
    • twhitehousescat
    • By twhitehousescat 13th Jan 19, 2:01 PM
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    twhitehousescat
    I was thinking of the letters much later , nov 2018?
    Time pretending I was asleep whilst under his desk , has given me insight to this sordid world
    • Itsascam
    • By Itsascam 23rd Jan 19, 8:08 PM
    • 14 Posts
    • 15 Thanks
    Itsascam
    No major news. Not heard back on ITAL appeal, but have received a debt collection letter from ZZPS (and yes I will ignore it, promise) but myappeal to ITAL was within the 28 days so clearly the offer of appeal (from ZZPS) was pointless - even though we thought it would be pointless anyway. Hope that makes sense
    • waamo
    • By waamo 23rd Jan 19, 8:37 PM
    • 6,034 Posts
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    waamo
    Report them to the BPA. Debt collectors letters while an appeal is ongoing is a no no.

    Demand they are given sanction points.
    This space for hire.
    • twhitehousescat
    • By twhitehousescat 23rd Jan 19, 8:46 PM
    • 3,341 Posts
    • 4,074 Thanks
    twhitehousescat
    the bpa code of practice states POPLa as"an appeal" , there is no appeal going on in the eyes of the BPA
    Time pretending I was asleep whilst under his desk , has given me insight to this sordid world
    • twhitehousescat
    • By twhitehousescat 23rd Jan 19, 9:11 PM
    • 3,341 Posts
    • 4,074 Thanks
    twhitehousescat
    No major news. Not heard back on ITAL appeal, but have received a debt collection letter from ZZPS (and yes I will ignore it, promise) but myappeal to ITAL was within the 28 days so clearly the offer of appeal (from ZZPS) was pointless - even though we thought it would be pointless anyway. Hope that makes sense
    Originally posted by Itsascam
    I would write to ital head honcho nicola.welling@ital-uk.com who is the Corporate Affairs Director

    who has told me that the company who have issued ital ref , must abide by BPA code of practice , and action will be taken against companies (???) that send fraudulent documents or fail to uphold BPA code of practice ,

    I asked what would happen , sanctions and ban was the answer


    my (???) comment above , was that ital as such only have one client for motoring appeals


    send my lov and kisses , as she now refuses to answer questions from me
    Time pretending I was asleep whilst under his desk , has given me insight to this sordid world
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 23rd Jan 19, 10:40 PM
    • 68,567 Posts
    • 80,806 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    I would write to ital head honcho nicola.welling@ital-uk.com who is the Corporate Affairs Director

    who has told me that the company who have issued ital ref , must abide by BPA code of practice , and action will be taken against companies (???) that send fraudulent documents or fail to uphold BPA code of practice ,

    I asked what would happen , sanctions and ban was the answer
    Good idea, let's do this every time.
    PRIVATE 'PCN'? DON'T PAY BUT DON'T IGNORE IT UNLESS IN SCOTLAND OR NI
    TWO Clicks needed Look up, top of the page:
    Main site>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets Fines & Parking - read the NEWBIES THREAD
    • Itsascam
    • By Itsascam 24th Jan 19, 8:51 PM
    • 14 Posts
    • 15 Thanks
    Itsascam
    Ok have sent an email to Ms Welling. For what if is worth here is what I wrote...

    Dear Ms Welling

    I have appealed a supposed penalty notice through your website and would like to complain about a debt collector letter from your client ZZPS.

    My appeal with ITAL has not been decided yet, how can they send threatening letters while the appeal is in progress? I attach a scan of the letter in which you can see it is dated after the appeal was lodged (sorry I got the orientation wrong but you can see the date of the letter etc)

    On a lesser point, they refer to a debt. There is no debt, just made up figures from what seems to be a cowboy operation.

    Please can you look into this matter as I am sure this must be against BPA guidelines. Even if it isn't it is definitely not reasonable bahaviour (what is the point of the appeal process if they are able to continue to send such letters?)
    • Itsascam
    • By Itsascam 24th Jan 19, 8:59 PM
    • 14 Posts
    • 15 Thanks
    Itsascam
    Also, they've taken the Indigo logo off the AS parking website and changed the FAQs. I've got the screenshot of the email address being Indigo from this thread (thanks Fruitcake), but did anyone happen to get a screenshot of the front page that had the Indigo logo?
    I think I saw it on a forum as well but have searched with now luck.
    Would like to have it in my back pocket in case.
    • twhitehousescat
    • By twhitehousescat 24th Jan 19, 9:14 PM
    • 3,341 Posts
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    twhitehousescat
    I got screenshots
    Time pretending I was asleep whilst under his desk , has given me insight to this sordid world
    • waamo
    • By waamo 24th Jan 19, 10:08 PM
    • 6,034 Posts
    • 7,843 Thanks
    waamo
    Ok have sent an email to Ms Welling. For what if is worth here is what I wrote...

    Dear Ms Welling

    I have appealed a supposed penalty notice through your website and would like to complain about a debt collector letter from your client ZZPS.

    My appeal with ITAL has not been decided yet, how can they send threatening letters while the appeal is in progress? I attach a scan of the letter in which you can see it is dated after the appeal was lodged (sorry I got the orientation wrong but you can see the date of the letter etc)

    On a lesser point, they refer to a debt. There is no debt, just made up figures from what seems to be a cowboy operation.

    Please can you look into this matter as I am sure this must be against BPA guidelines. Even if it isn't it is definitely not reasonable bahaviour (what is the point of the appeal process if they are able to continue to send such letters?)
    Originally posted by Itsascam
    Brilliant. Copy that to the BPA too.
    This space for hire.
    • twhitehousescat
    • By twhitehousescat 25th Jan 19, 12:00 AM
    • 3,341 Posts
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    twhitehousescat
    sigh

    AS clearly state in facts that only the owner is liable ,

    "The Byelaws 14(4) state that it is the owner of a vehicle that may be liable for a Penalty. The owner is presumed to be the registered keeper, unless it is proven otherwise. If the owner was not the driver, the owner is still liable for the Penalty."


    but of the appeal you are offered

    1: I am the owner

    or

    2: I was the keeper , BUT you cannot submit form until you give owners name , address email , phone number

    and accept "You may be contacted by email. Please ensure you
    check your junk/spam folders for a response and
    that you add no-reply@ital-uk.com to your contacts."
    Time pretending I was asleep whilst under his desk , has given me insight to this sordid world
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