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  • FIRST POST
    • basil3107
    • By basil3107 10th Nov 18, 8:02 PM
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    basil3107
    Can a letting agent be our 'Landlord'
    • #1
    • 10th Nov 18, 8:02 PM
    Can a letting agent be our 'Landlord' 10th Nov 18 at 8:02 PM
    Hi

    London area but this would apply across the country.

    The contract we have signed with the letting agent names them as the 'Landlord' on the contract, and the Superior Landlord (owner of the property). Is this allowed? what difference does this make?

    They are trying to charge extortionate renewal fees for another term and I'd like to know if the contract I have signed is even valid.

    Many Thanks,

    Basil
Page 1
    • davidmcn
    • By davidmcn 10th Nov 18, 8:11 PM
    • 9,062 Posts
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    davidmcn
    • #2
    • 10th Nov 18, 8:11 PM
    • #2
    • 10th Nov 18, 8:11 PM
    Are they the landlord?
    • atrixblue.-MFR-.
    • By atrixblue.-MFR-. 10th Nov 18, 8:13 PM
    • 6,608 Posts
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    atrixblue.-MFR-.
    • #3
    • 10th Nov 18, 8:13 PM
    • #3
    • 10th Nov 18, 8:13 PM
    the contract with those terms seems legitimate. the "agent" is acting as "landlord", for the owner who probably has only a income related vested interest in the property and in no way wants the legal onus of being "landlord duties", hence he contracted an " estates agent" to act as "landlord" for the purposes of such duties. .

    • Slithery
    • By Slithery 10th Nov 18, 8:14 PM
    • 967 Posts
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    Slithery
    • #4
    • 10th Nov 18, 8:14 PM
    • #4
    • 10th Nov 18, 8:14 PM
    Is this allowed?
    Originally posted by basil3107
    Yes.
    what difference does this make?
    None.
    • basil3107
    • By basil3107 10th Nov 18, 8:15 PM
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    basil3107
    • #5
    • 10th Nov 18, 8:15 PM
    • #5
    • 10th Nov 18, 8:15 PM
    Query really as I've never seen it before. I thought there might be some kind of regulation not allowing letting agents to be 'landlords', as the don't own the property.
    • atrixblue.-MFR-.
    • By atrixblue.-MFR-. 10th Nov 18, 8:21 PM
    • 6,608 Posts
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    atrixblue.-MFR-.
    • #6
    • 10th Nov 18, 8:21 PM
    • #6
    • 10th Nov 18, 8:21 PM
    Query really as I've never seen it before. I thought there might be some kind of regulation not allowing letting agents to be 'landlords', as the don't own the property.
    Originally posted by basil3107
    there is "principle" contract laws that govern this type of thing, but the essence of the contract is saying that the principle (the landlord/owner) has contracted the agents to be "landlord on their behalf" does this make sense?
    Last edited by atrixblue.-MFR-.; 10-11-2018 at 8:23 PM.

    • G_M
    • By G_M 11th Nov 18, 2:33 AM
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    G_M
    • #7
    • 11th Nov 18, 2:33 AM
    • #7
    • 11th Nov 18, 2:33 AM
    A more likely explanation is that this is one of those 'rent guarantee schemes'.

    the owner of the property grants a commercial tenancy to the letting agency (the terms of which guarantee him a monthly rental income irrespective of whether or not the property is sub-let to an occupier).

    The agency then sublets the property, under an AST, to an occupier who is their (the agency's) tenant. The tenant's landlord is thus the agency. The occupier has no legal relationship with the property owner who is the agency's landlord.

    So yes, the contract between occupant (tenant) and agency is perfectly valid.

    If the renewal fees are 'extortionate' the tenant can deal with this in the usual way:
    * pay and renew
    * negotiate over the fee (and then pay whatever is negotiated)
    * leave at the end of the contract
    * move to a Statutory Periodic Tenancy

    See also
    * Ending/renewing an AST: what happens when a fixed term ends? How can a LL or tenant end a tenancy? What is a periodic tenancy?
    Last edited by G_M; 11-11-2018 at 12:19 PM.
    • theartfullodger
    • By theartfullodger 11th Nov 18, 3:45 AM
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    theartfullodger
    • #8
    • 11th Nov 18, 3:45 AM
    • #8
    • 11th Nov 18, 3:45 AM

    London area but this would apply across the country.
    Originally posted by basil3107
    different in Scotland..
    .....

    ? what difference does this make?
    If contract between agent & owner (probably "superior landlord") ends then tenant becomes tenant of owner on same terms.

    Just ignore request you renew and pay fees:. Tenancy continues if you remain in occupation, no fees chargeable.

    Also assume agent is dodgier than usual.
    Last edited by theartfullodger; 11-11-2018 at 3:47 AM.
    • missile
    • By missile 11th Nov 18, 9:47 AM
    • 9,780 Posts
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    missile
    • #9
    • 11th Nov 18, 9:47 AM
    • #9
    • 11th Nov 18, 9:47 AM
    Yes, in Scotland we have a Landlords Register. LLs are required to register with their name and address. Thus one can easily verify who the Landlord is.

    Great idea??????

    Unfortunately, in practise many LLs do not comply with this and other regulations.

    https://www.landlordregistrationscotland.gov.uk/
    Last edited by missile; 11-11-2018 at 9:49 AM.
    "A nation's greatness is measured by how it treats its weakest members." ~ Mahatma Gandhi
    Ride hard or stay home
    • AdrianC
    • By AdrianC 11th Nov 18, 9:51 AM
    • 19,061 Posts
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    AdrianC
    Unfortunately, in practise many LLs do not comply with this and other regulations.
    Originally posted by missile
    There should be a law against it!
    • atrixblue.-MFR-.
    • By atrixblue.-MFR-. 11th Nov 18, 2:10 PM
    • 6,608 Posts
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    atrixblue.-MFR-.
    yes, but only if you know the difference between principle and principal.
    Originally posted by 00ec25
    I obviously do but my phone doesn't. I don't usually proof read my posts either post and go. Have not got time for grammar correction life's too short and its gives the grammar police something to do, it gives them a sense of self purpose the poor little mites, gotta love em ai!.

    • missile
    • By missile 11th Nov 18, 4:48 PM
    • 9,780 Posts
    • 4,918 Thanks
    missile
    There should be a law against it!
    Originally posted by AdrianC
    That would be nice
    "A nation's greatness is measured by how it treats its weakest members." ~ Mahatma Gandhi
    Ride hard or stay home
    • stator
    • By stator 11th Nov 18, 5:46 PM
    • 6,597 Posts
    • 4,437 Thanks
    stator
    The one thing you should look out for is that the rental agency often still try to push the blame onto the owner of the house.
    If there is an urgent issue, eg your hot water is not working, or if the gas safety check hasn't been done or failed, the rental agents will still just pass the buck on to the owner, even though they are the landlords they will still often talk about the owner as the landlord, and your landlord. Often they can just leave issues for weeks without chasing them up.

    You should remind them of their responsibilities as your landlord and if they start talking about how the landlord hasn't made his mind up or not, you should remind them that he is THEIR landlord and thus THEIR problem, and that your relationship is with them as they are your landlord.
    Changing the world, one sarcastic comment at a time.
    • Comms69
    • By Comms69 11th Nov 18, 7:09 PM
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    Comms69
    Query really as I've never seen it before. I thought there might be some kind of regulation not allowing letting agents to be 'landlords', as the don't own the property.
    Originally posted by basil3107
    There is no requirement for any landlord to own the property.
    • SmashedAvacado
    • By SmashedAvacado 12th Nov 18, 1:30 PM
    • 449 Posts
    • 461 Thanks
    SmashedAvacado
    There is no requirement for any landlord to own the property.
    Originally posted by Comms69
    To grant a valid tenancy, the landlord needs a legal right to do so. You can't just be named as landlord - you need to understand the basis of their right to grant the tenancy. If they are not the owner, and do not have a lease of it then they might have a right to grant the tenancy on behalf of the owner, but they will not have such a right in their own capacity. You can't give what you don't have.
    • charlotte1994
    • By charlotte1994 12th Nov 18, 1:32 PM
    • 27 Posts
    • 14 Thanks
    charlotte1994
    Yes they can do this, I only talk to the letting agent - I've never met my landlord, though they have her address on the agreement. They probably have the right to manage the property on behalf of the owner (personally I hate this, the Landlord is just in it for the money rather than the responsibility that comes with it)
    • Comms69
    • By Comms69 12th Nov 18, 1:40 PM
    • 5,452 Posts
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    Comms69
    To grant a valid tenancy, the landlord needs a legal right to do so. You can't just be named as landlord - you need to understand the basis of their right to grant the tenancy. If they are not the owner, and do not have a lease of it then they might have a right to grant the tenancy on behalf of the owner, but they will not have such a right in their own capacity. You can't give what you don't have.
    Originally posted by SmashedAvacado


    I didn't claim otherwise. My point was very succinct (and factually correct)
    • Comms69
    • By Comms69 12th Nov 18, 1:42 PM
    • 5,452 Posts
    • 5,542 Thanks
    Comms69
    Yes they can do this, I only talk to the letting agent - I've never met my landlord, though they have her address on the agreement. They probably have the right to manage the property on behalf of the owner (personally I hate this, the Landlord is just in it for the money rather than the responsibility that comes with it)
    Originally posted by charlotte1994


    You're confused.


    As G_M said it is likely to be a guaranteed rent scheme. In effect the letting agent rents the property at under market rates; and is subsequently the actual landlord for any tenants.


    The benefit (or perceived benefit) to the landlord is that they are guaranteed an income for the duration - whether a tenant lives there or not. In practice this is not the case
    • SmashedAvacado
    • By SmashedAvacado 12th Nov 18, 1:43 PM
    • 449 Posts
    • 461 Thanks
    SmashedAvacado
    Yes they can do this, I only talk to the letting agent - I've never met my landlord, though they have her address on the agreement. They probably have the right to manage the property on behalf of the owner (personally I hate this, the Landlord is just in it for the money rather than the responsibility that comes with it)
    Originally posted by charlotte1994
    a right to manage the property would not be enough to allow an agent to enter into a lease as landlord (neither ought it to want to do this because it is not the landlord - it is acting as agent in managing on behalf of the owner).
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