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  • FIRST POST
    • YoungBlueEyes
    • By YoungBlueEyes 3rd Oct 18, 9:57 PM
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    YoungBlueEyes
    Shared access - odd question.
    • #1
    • 3rd Oct 18, 9:57 PM
    Shared access - odd question. 3rd Oct 18 at 9:57 PM
    I have a strange question. It sounds like a good thing in principle, but it's niggling me and I can't articulate why. I'm keen to hear your thoughts please.

    I've (nearly) bought a terrace house. It's a row of 6, and I'm buying the fifth one. There is a pathway from the pavement at the side of no 1 that then runs across the back of the houses and out again at no 6 where it meets the pavement again. (I hope that makes sense!)

    My house would be the fifth one. So in theory only the lady at no 4 would pass my kitchen window, as the first 3 would turn left to go round the back and not come past me.

    The people in no 6 have put up a pair of bloody big solid wood gates and keep it locked all the time, so no-one can wander in off the street (from 'our end' at least). The gates are half way down the length of their house so they've effectively created themselves a parking space and keep their car on it.

    I know this because I was down there the other day and the lady at no 4 told me. She said she loves it because it makes her feel safe in her garden knowing no-one can poddle round off the street as all the connecting gates along the shared access are locked. "But what if I want to come through with big garden furniture or something? Do we all get a key?" "No we don't do that, but if we need to come through then Mr 6 will open up and help us with whatever. They also collect up our bins (4 5 + 6) and take them to the pavement for the binmen. Saves us a job And in return they get a free parking space."

    So it sounds like a good thing - no-one wandering round, a bit more security, I wouldn't have to worry about leaving my back door or windows open, or strangers wandering through when I'm only in my dressing gown and hanging out the washing etc.

    So why is this niggling me...?
    I don't make the same mistake twice. I like to make it 5 or 6 times, you know, just to be sure.

    Look before you leap. No I mean really look. And take a friend so they can look too. Then leap. Maybe.
Page 7
    • circuit
    • By circuit 7th Oct 18, 7:25 PM
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    circuit
    When we were discussing the paperwork side, Mr solic asked me "how keen are you to get into more legal wranglings?" "Ah um what?" The locked gate carry on has already been challenged (and lied about on the property form), but he's not taken a bit of notice.
    Originally posted by YoungBlueEyes
    I just knew there was more to it than your potential neighbours were letting on. Good thing you questioned this silly situation.
    • YoungBlueEyes
    • By YoungBlueEyes 7th Oct 18, 10:30 PM
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    YoungBlueEyes
    If it were me and I'd just lost 1k because of a richardhead like this, I'd be tempted to delete the bit in this thread that IDs the exact location, then send the link with a short explanatory letter to Nos 1-4.
    They ought to know what others think about their cosy arrangement with Mr 6 now the truth is known.
    Originally posted by Davesnave
    I didn't think of this. As no4 is the only one I actually spoke to and she happy with it, the challenger/s are from 1-3. They're trying to do something, unsuccessfully as yet but at least they're standing up to it. The other side of no6 is a commercial premises. Looking at streetview I think their building goes up to their boundary so it doesn't affect them at all.

    I think I would be tempted to send it to the EA... And, perhaps, the LR? Trading standards if the EA fails to disclose it once they have been informed? What me? Stir it?
    Originally posted by Smodlet
    This I like. I was going to ask (on here) - what is the point of asking an EA "why have other sales fallen through, what do I need to know about this property?" if they're just going to lie through their teeth?? Is there no comeback? Yes mortgages do fall through and close relatives die, but I severely doubt those are the real reasons in this case!
    I'd love to be able to send them my bill. It's c1.5k I could do with right now!
    I'm going to write to the EA's boss, telling him exactly what's happened. I'd cheerfully do LR and trading standards too Anybody got an address ha haa!
    I don't make the same mistake twice. I like to make it 5 or 6 times, you know, just to be sure.

    Look before you leap. No I mean really look. And take a friend so they can look too. Then leap. Maybe.
    • YoungBlueEyes
    • By YoungBlueEyes 7th Oct 18, 10:32 PM
    • 487 Posts
    • 655 Thanks
    YoungBlueEyes
    Good thing you questioned this silly situation.
    Originally posted by circuit
    Good thing I know that I know nothing, and have wise people to ask!
    I don't make the same mistake twice. I like to make it 5 or 6 times, you know, just to be sure.

    Look before you leap. No I mean really look. And take a friend so they can look too. Then leap. Maybe.
    • YoungBlueEyes
    • By YoungBlueEyes 7th Oct 18, 11:37 PM
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    YoungBlueEyes
    Has anybody complained about an EA? What are your experiences?

    This EA is a member of the property ombudsman, and I've just read the code of practice for EA's on trading standard's website. There are plenty of points they've fallen foul of... Should I chalk this up to experience or pursue it? (The boss is getting a letter tomorrow, I mean pursue it with trading standards.)
    I don't make the same mistake twice. I like to make it 5 or 6 times, you know, just to be sure.

    Look before you leap. No I mean really look. And take a friend so they can look too. Then leap. Maybe.
    • Davesnave
    • By Davesnave 8th Oct 18, 1:53 AM
    • 26,867 Posts
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    Davesnave
    I think Trading Standards are pretty stretched generally. In some areas, like where I live, they seem reluctant to get into what they see as less important matters.

    I contacted them over an issue with a conservatory company, but apart from waffling about stuff I already knew re consumer rights, they seemed keen to push me to use the relevant trade association rather than become involved. I did that, but without success, so eventually I took the company on myself.

    I didn't bother reporting back to Trading Standards. They asked me to do that, more in terms of 'if I got stuck,' than to build up any picture . Anyway there's nothing to report yet; the company still have 4 years to come after me for the money I withheld!
    "We won't get fooled again...."
    • moneyistooshorttomention
    • By moneyistooshorttomention 8th Oct 18, 7:04 AM
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    moneyistooshorttomention
    Estate Agents are supposed to tell the truth re any problems they know of with a property - I believe that was something that came in in 2013.

    When I bought current house I did found one EA here telling me the real reason why a sale had fallen through on a house I was interested in (think it was the roof?). They didn't mention the kerfuffle about the road it's in - though the local grapevine is quite well aware about that (ie several people have told me about that road). I didnt buy that house.

    A rule of thumb that applies to some areas as one way to tell whether an EA is aware that a property has a noticeable defect or two is if they do the viewings themselves. In my home city we downright expect EA's to do their own viewings - but in current town the "rule of thumb" is = if an EA actually does their own job for once and shows you the property, then that means they know the property is very defect-prone and are hoping to flannel the person who doesnt know the area into buying it. In some areas (probably smaller ones - as you are looking at) the EA's can be very lazy and hate setting foot outside their offices if they can possibly help it.

    In your position - as you are looking at a different area to your own, then I'd check whether it's the norm or no for the local EA's to show people around. If it is their norm to do their own viewings = then fine. If it isn't their norm and they are trying to persuade you to see a house you haven't mentioned and they actually come with you to do the viewing = the house has got a lot of defects and they're hoping for incomers to view it (as the locals probably know about it).
    Last edited by moneyistooshorttomention; 08-10-2018 at 7:06 AM.
    If you feel like you don't fit in in this world, it's because you are here to help create a new one.
    • Davesnave
    • By Davesnave 8th Oct 18, 9:12 AM
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    Davesnave
    A rule of thumb that applies to some areas as one way to tell whether an EA is aware that a property has a noticeable defect or two is if they do the viewings themselves.
    Originally posted by moneyistooshorttomention
    Really? I'm not aware of that one.

    When I sold my Dad's bungalow in Wiltshire, I didn't do any viewings at all. There was nothing wrong with it, as I'd just re-furbed and it was only 20 years old. I just didn't want any hassle or to deal with the old ladies/gents I knew it would attract.

    Conversely, when we sold our house in Bath, which was also well-up together, we did about half the viewings and the agents did t'others. We were the ones that sold it, if anyone thinks it made a difference, but we considered it irrelevant.

    Here in Devon, and also in West Wales, we had many viewings, usually owner-led, but that was down to the type of property. All the agents we met spouted rubbish at least some of the time, but on the whole we found no obvious attempts at deception. I'd agree Welsh country agents are quite often lazy, to the extent that we'd be given keys to vacant houses, but maybe that practice has changed now?

    Here in Devon, with the house we bought, our 3 viewings were all owner-led. We're friends with the person who conducted them.There was lots wrong with the place, but it would have made no difference at all if the agent had been there. We never met him, having soon deduced he was a shyster worst kind. Indeed, when we collected the keys, at our request, it was from under a brick in the front garden!
    "We won't get fooled again...."
    • ReadingTim
    • By ReadingTim 8th Oct 18, 12:42 PM
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    ReadingTim
    Estate Agents are supposed to tell the truth re any problems they know of with a property - I believe that was something that came in in 2013.
    Originally posted by moneyistooshorttomention
    The problem though, is proving that the EA knew about the problem and deliberately lied/concealed the truth, as they can only go on information provided to them by the vendor.

    So, if the vendor is economical with the truth / dishonest, there's nothing the EA can do about that, or be held liable for.
    • Cakeguts
    • By Cakeguts 8th Oct 18, 2:27 PM
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    Cakeguts
    This is what I did although it was some years ago now. I viewed an old 2 bed cottage. The vendors had moved out so the house was vacant and luckily they had removed the carpets from upstairs. The stairs went up the middle from the kitchen so between the kitchen and the front living room. What the vendors had done was to remove the wall between the stairs and the kitchen making the stairs open plan in the kitchen. When I went upstairs I noticed that the floor boards in the back room the one over the kitchen went across the room from wall to wall meaning that the joists went the otherway and would have been resting on the wall that had been removed. You could see from the depth of wood that was left on bottom of the staircase that there was no supporting steel. We then realised what the beam of wood that was slightly offset from the stairs at the bottom and going between the floor of the kitchen and the kitchen ceiling was for. The following day the estate agent had told me there was a young couple going back for a second viewing. I didn't want to risk the possibility that this might be true because the upstairs backroom floor in that house was held up on a beam of wood. So I told the estate agent after the viewing that he was not to allow anyone else into the house until it had been made safe. (I can have that tone of voice you know) my mother was with me so she was a witness to it all. The estate agent said that he would get a structural engineer in to look at the property and he would instruct the vendors to remove the property from the market. I also said at the time to the estate agent (using that tone of voice) that he was now not to show the property to anyone else until the issues had been resolved because I had told him what the problem was.



    In your case you can always get a mystery shopper to phone the agent after you have written to them telling them of the problem or told them in front of a witness to find out if they are still not telling people about the access problem.
    • Smodlet
    • By Smodlet 8th Oct 18, 2:32 PM
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    Smodlet
    The problem though, is proving that the EA knew about the problem and deliberately lied/concealed the truth, as they can only go on information provided to them by the vendor.

    So, if the vendor is economical with the truth / dishonest, there's nothing the EA can do about that, or be held liable for.
    Originally posted by ReadingTim
    Until or unless a potential buyer can prove they were aware because said buyer told them and had a read receipt to an email, perhaps?

    Not sure it would do any good but I would also be tempted to contact RM; there is a button on every listing to report errors... It all depends on how much trouble you want to go to and how much you care about helping others, who may not be nearly as clued up as yourself, YBE, to avoid this pitfall. I think you said there were mining issues as well?
    What is this life if, sweet wordsmith, we have no time to take the pith?
    Every stew starts with the first onion.
    I took it upon myself to investigate a trifle; it had custard, jelly, soggy sponge things...
    • YoungBlueEyes
    • By YoungBlueEyes 8th Oct 18, 10:25 PM
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    YoungBlueEyes
    I posted this aft but I can't have pressed "post quick reply" properly. Evidently not as bright as I like to think I am.... Grrr.

    The gist was that I don't have proof that the EA knew about the access when I viewed, though I don't doubt they did. I know people do have mortgage troubles and relatives die, but I reckon in this case it's no6 that's the issue. But actual proof is another matter.

    I haven't heard of the EA viewings means there's a defect thing either. We had the EA do our viewings as we've never sold a house before. Although our buyers wanted to view on a Sunday afternoon (EA shut) so I had to do it - eek! Not as scary in the end as I'd thought it would be. It wasn't a defect/good house thing though, it was an opening hours/don't lose the buyers thing.

    I've written my letter but not sent it yet. It's really a complaint about the staff's conduct and many lies, and my unhappiness with them in general. I've not sent it yet though in case I end up moving there and need to use them again. The access + ROW malarky is another issue though. I'll email them about that, and tell RM. It isn't right that they're letting people spend so much money for something when they don't have the full picture. That !!!! ain't right!

    Yes there are mining issues as well. I can't remember what my solic said now - was it maybe a mine head or a mineshaft within 25m of the property. I know Derbyshire is practically riddled with them, but 25m is damned close! Too much for me, on top of all the other survey issues.

    It's thanks to this place that I'm as clued up as I am. I've said this before but it's true - I would pay to be a member of mse. You've saved me god knows how much money and trouble and heartache and sleepless nights, between father dying and all that contesting will nonsense and now this
    I don't make the same mistake twice. I like to make it 5 or 6 times, you know, just to be sure.

    Look before you leap. No I mean really look. And take a friend so they can look too. Then leap. Maybe.
    • YoungBlueEyes
    • By YoungBlueEyes 8th Oct 18, 10:32 PM
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    YoungBlueEyes
    There's an idea for a website - a kind of anti RM. Look up a house and find out it's troubles. "I had a survey and it said abc." "Yeah I had searches and they came back saying xyz." I'm not sure how you'd filter out the bored/liars though... It'd free up solics for all the contagious probate there seems to be now...

    Then EA's could spend all day poking themselves in the eyes with dirty sticks and other suitable pastimes...
    I don't make the same mistake twice. I like to make it 5 or 6 times, you know, just to be sure.

    Look before you leap. No I mean really look. And take a friend so they can look too. Then leap. Maybe.
    • ReadingTim
    • By ReadingTim 9th Oct 18, 10:42 AM
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    ReadingTim
    The gist was that I don't have proof that the EA knew about the access when I viewed, though I don't doubt they did. I know people do have mortgage troubles and relatives die, but I reckon in this case it's no6 that's the issue. But actual proof is another matter.

    I haven't heard of the EA viewings means there's a defect thing either. We had the EA do our viewings as we've never sold a house before. Although our buyers wanted to view on a Sunday afternoon (EA shut) so I had to do it - eek! Not as scary in the end as I'd thought it would be. It wasn't a defect/good house thing though, it was an opening hours/don't lose the buyers thing.

    I've written my letter but not sent it yet. It's really a complaint about the staff's conduct and many lies, and my unhappiness with them in general. I've not sent it yet though in case I end up moving there and need to use them again. The access + ROW malarky is another issue though. I'll email them about that, and tell RM. It isn't right that they're letting people spend so much money for something when they don't have the full picture. That !!!! ain't right!

    Yes there are mining issues as well. I can't remember what my solic said now - was it maybe a mine head or a mineshaft within 25m of the property. I know Derbyshire is practically riddled with them, but 25m is damned close! Too much for me, on top of all the other survey issues.
    Originally posted by YoungBlueEyes
    I'm sure writing the letter was cathartic, but sending it really won't achieve anything: you don't have any proof, and frankly, you need to expect a certain amount of being economical with the truth from an EA - they're salesmen (and women) after all, and no sales person is going to dwell on the negative features of a product.

    Also, at the risk of stating the obvious, this is why you get searches etc done - to ascertain what the position really is, rather than simply as described by the vendor or their agent.

    Finally, whilst issues with access or mineshafts might be dealbreakers for you, they're not necessarily dealbreakers for everyone - many can be overcome if the price was right, or for an investor rather than an owner occupier.

    No-one likes to waste time or money, but look on the bright side - you've spend a smaller amount of both to save a lot more in the long term. Chalk it up to experience and move on.
    • YoungBlueEyes
    • By YoungBlueEyes 10th Oct 18, 11:15 PM
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    YoungBlueEyes
    You're right RT. I guess there's a flicker of...... idealism..... in me that refuses to go out :rolleyes ha haa!
    I don't make the same mistake twice. I like to make it 5 or 6 times, you know, just to be sure.

    Look before you leap. No I mean really look. And take a friend so they can look too. Then leap. Maybe.
    • moneyistooshorttomention
    • By moneyistooshorttomention 11th Oct 18, 6:04 AM
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    moneyistooshorttomention
    You're right RT. I guess there's a flicker of...... idealism..... in me that refuses to go out :rolleyes ha haa!
    Originally posted by YoungBlueEyes
    Good for you

    Though, depending on what Life as a whole throws at you, I have to tell you you'll reach my age (60's) having changed from an idealist to Distinctly Cynical - and there's times where you still think "I should have been more cynical about that person - I've just been caught out again by believing something someone said to me when I shouldn't have".

    It's perfectly possible to be a heck of a cynic - whilst still watching one or two Bright Ideas one had earlier in life and "put out there" (and would have been too cynical to think would even work if you'd thought them up later in life) still being used by a variety of people across the country/world.
    Last edited by moneyistooshorttomention; 11-10-2018 at 6:10 AM.
    If you feel like you don't fit in in this world, it's because you are here to help create a new one.
    • YoungBlueEyes
    • By YoungBlueEyes 12th Oct 18, 7:58 PM
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    YoungBlueEyes
    I do have healthy cynical/stubborn/sarcastic streak in me already tbh, and I'm only 40! I've had rather a lot of life thrown at me this past year but the little flicker is still there

    If I could just find a s0dding house to live in, it might turn itself back up into a flame
    I don't make the same mistake twice. I like to make it 5 or 6 times, you know, just to be sure.

    Look before you leap. No I mean really look. And take a friend so they can look too. Then leap. Maybe.
    • Cakeguts
    • By Cakeguts 12th Oct 18, 8:58 PM
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    Cakeguts
    I do have healthy cynical/stubborn/sarcastic streak in me already tbh, and I'm only 40! I've had rather a lot of life thrown at me this past year but the little flicker is still there

    If I could just find a s0dding house to live in, it might turn itself back up into a flame
    Originally posted by YoungBlueEyes

    Judging by the last disaster I think you may be trying to get too much for your budget?



    Start from the point that there are no bargain houses so if one looks good for the price they are asking there is going to be some big problem with it.



    Decide what you must have. If you have a small budget but wan't to live in a popular area you are going to have to buy a small house so a 1 bed not a 2 bed or a 2 bed not a 3 bed. You won't get a decent sized house in a popular area for a low price even if it needs work doing to it.



    There are nice neighbours in not so fashionable areas. They are there because like you they couldn't afford the fashion for a certain area at the time when they needed to find somewhere to live.


    I found this one but I have no idea where you want to live of if you need a station close by.



    https://www.rightmove.co.uk/property-for-sale/property-75753386.html
    • YoungBlueEyes
    • By YoungBlueEyes 12th Oct 18, 9:58 PM
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    YoungBlueEyes
    You're right Cakeguts, I'm sitting here now re-evaluating what is realistic.

    That link looks good, I'll have to do some research on the area

    I need to pull my finger out, but I don't want to rush to buy something that's not right just because I need to buy something. If that makes sense.

    The pressure's on now. Sis moved into her rental the other day, and our buyers wanted in asap. Solic rang me - "what are you doing about finding a house? You need to shake yourself cos the buyers are getting itchy. They want to be in for the weekend as they both have next week off and want to get cracking." Me - "THIS weekend? That's a few days to pack and clean and sort removals and and and aaarghh!" Solic - "After the year you've had you need to draw a line under it. When did you turn into such a fanny?! Go move in with a friend."

    Anyway I managed it. I'm sat in my friend's house, with my whole world in his garage :0 I drove all the way down to (nearly) Cambridge at 9pm last night, having pulled a string of 17 hour days to get the house sorted. We exchanged on Wednesday, completed today.

    So I truly need to shift my 4rse now. The hunting continues apace...
    I don't make the same mistake twice. I like to make it 5 or 6 times, you know, just to be sure.

    Look before you leap. No I mean really look. And take a friend so they can look too. Then leap. Maybe.
    • Wanderingpomm
    • By Wanderingpomm 13th Oct 18, 3:50 AM
    • 104 Posts
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    Wanderingpomm
    The neighbours are stealing your access. Ask for a gate key
    • moneyistooshorttomention
    • By moneyistooshorttomention 13th Oct 18, 6:58 AM
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    moneyistooshorttomention
    That's one straight-talking solicitor

    If they ever decide to move to Wales - I'll househunt for them personally - I could do with one like that.
    If you feel like you don't fit in in this world, it's because you are here to help create a new one.
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