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  • FIRST POST
    • queenmedusa
    • By queenmedusa 3rd Oct 18, 7:54 PM
    • 27Posts
    • 17Thanks
    queenmedusa
    How to warm north east corner rooms?
    • #1
    • 3rd Oct 18, 7:54 PM
    How to warm north east corner rooms? 3rd Oct 18 at 7:54 PM
    The rooms in the north east corner of the house get very cold in winter. One of the rooms is the living room end of the lounge / diner, the other is a bedroom. The bedroom gets quite badly condensated and has had water running down the walls in the past simply because of people breathing. The loft is fully insulated and we have central heating but even with the heating on full it still gets cold. With winter about to hit I'm worried about how cold it's going to get. When I bought the house the home buyers pack said it was cavity wall insulated but I'm not sure that's the case. A colleague has warned me against CWI in case something goes wrong (eg. damp). I have no idea where to start in terms of getting this sorted and would appreciate advice. Whilst ventilation in the bedroom may reduce condensation it won't make it warmer (and no idea who could fit window vents either :-( )

    The house was built in1970 and is a semi detached with full exposure to the elements. These rooms get no sunlight after about 9am.
    Last edited by queenmedusa; 03-10-2018 at 8:00 PM.
Page 1
    • onomatopoeia99
    • By onomatopoeia99 3rd Oct 18, 8:23 PM
    • 4,701 Posts
    • 10,726 Thanks
    onomatopoeia99
    • #2
    • 3rd Oct 18, 8:23 PM
    • #2
    • 3rd Oct 18, 8:23 PM
    Are your radiators and boilers adequate for the size of the house? Are they functioning well?


    When I moved in to this house despite having huge radiators and a modern boiler big enough for a much larger home, the lounge was cold with the heating running. Partly due to no insulation, but mostly as the CH had no inhibitor and the primary heat exchanger had got clogged, so it was working really badly (eventually just stopped, in November when it as 0 centigrade outside).


    I fixed the heating with a bottle of X800 and patience, insulated the loft and walls and it's much better now.
    INTP, nerd, libertarian and scifi geek.
    Home is where my books are.
    • queenmedusa
    • By queenmedusa 3rd Oct 18, 8:32 PM
    • 27 Posts
    • 17 Thanks
    queenmedusa
    • #3
    • 3rd Oct 18, 8:32 PM
    • #3
    • 3rd Oct 18, 8:32 PM
    The boiler is really good and certainly heats the radiators to a good temperature. I had the boiler replaced 8 years ago and it's has a service every year. The bedroom has one radiator which seems to be the right size for the room. The main bedroom is a bit bigger, has the same sized radiator and heats up OK but the smaller room just seems to lose heat quickly. The lounge / diner has a radiator at each end. No idea if they're the right size. There's also a gas heater but that heat seems to disappear quickly once it's switched off (and costly to keep it on). All radiators are checked and bled each season (at least once). I do want to replace one of the lounge radiators and the gas fire eventually but it's going to be a lot of money to do.
    • onomatopoeia99
    • By onomatopoeia99 3rd Oct 18, 9:10 PM
    • 4,701 Posts
    • 10,726 Thanks
    onomatopoeia99
    • #4
    • 3rd Oct 18, 9:10 PM
    • #4
    • 3rd Oct 18, 9:10 PM
    You could get a central heating controller with thermostat that works wirelessly and allows you to set different temperatures at different times of day, then leave the heating "on" 24/7 and controlled by the thermostat.


    So what I have is a Honeywell CM907 (or maybe 927, I forget) which I leave in the lounge and have the thermostatic valves there on maximum. I set the thermostat to 19C at wakeup time, evenings to 10pm and weekends, 15C overnight and during the working day. That ensures that the lounge is always comfortable when I'm likely to be using it. I then set the thermostatic valves on the other radiators to make the rooms comfortable when the lounge is comfortable.


    If your thermostat is not in the lounge, or you have set hours when the CH is "allowed" to be on irrespective of the temperature, it may be turning off the heating when the lounge is still cold.
    INTP, nerd, libertarian and scifi geek.
    Home is where my books are.
    • keith969
    • By keith969 3rd Oct 18, 11:07 PM
    • 1,323 Posts
    • 969 Thanks
    keith969
    • #5
    • 3rd Oct 18, 11:07 PM
    • #5
    • 3rd Oct 18, 11:07 PM
    You need to find out where the heat is going. With adequate central heating the room should be no different to any other on a dull day.

    I had the same issue and had thermal imaging done on my house (actually the local green group did it for free for a number of villagers) and it's very good at showing you exactly where the heat is escaping - in my case bay windows with inadequate insulation at the bottom of the bays.
    Heaven wasn't built in a day
    • queenmedusa
    • By queenmedusa 4th Oct 18, 11:12 AM
    • 27 Posts
    • 17 Thanks
    queenmedusa
    • #6
    • 4th Oct 18, 11:12 AM
    • #6
    • 4th Oct 18, 11:12 AM
    Thanks for the responses. The thermostat is in the hall where all the heat rises up the stairs. The OH doesn't believe in having the heating on when we're not home and insists on controlling via the stat instead of the timer. We may have to have some serious chats about that this winter! I am one of those people who gets cold quickly and he's a human radiator so I'll be freezing while he's still in a T-shirt! I'll look into getting a digital stat.

    Had been thinking about getting thermal imaging done, no idea how much it will cost to get someone in as can't find anyone nearby at the moment. Will have to research more.
    • Catsacor
    • By Catsacor 12th Oct 18, 7:06 AM
    • 72 Posts
    • 65 Thanks
    Catsacor
    • #7
    • 12th Oct 18, 7:06 AM
    • #7
    • 12th Oct 18, 7:06 AM
    Thanks for the responses. The thermostat is in the hall where all the heat rises up the stairs. The OH doesn't believe in having the heating on when we're not home and insists on controlling via the stat instead of the timer. We may have to have some serious chats about that this winter! I am one of those people who gets cold quickly and he's a human radiator so I'll be freezing while he's still in a T-shirt! I'll look into getting a digital stat.

    Had been thinking about getting thermal imaging done, no idea how much it will cost to get someone in as can't find anyone nearby at the moment. Will have to research more.
    Originally posted by queenmedusa

    "On" doesn't mean it's firing, it just means it's 'available'.


    If the temperature in the area of the thermostat falls below your set temperature it would start up then to bring it to an ambient temperature, and then turn itself "off" again.


    Leaving the system to come "on"/start 'firing' at a set time of day, instead of leaving it permanently "on" means that it has to work harder to bring it up to your chosen/set temperature - thus using more energy to try and get it up to your chosen temp.


    More energy used to get it from 16C to 20C = higher heating bill.
    Leaving system "on" means an even, ambient, temperature, no struggling to get from 16-20 in a shorter space of time = less energy used.


    I try to explain this to my parents, and older relatives, to no avail, they use far, far, more energy than they need to because of it
    • chrisw
    • By chrisw 12th Oct 18, 8:31 AM
    • 1,776 Posts
    • 1,009 Thanks
    chrisw
    • #8
    • 12th Oct 18, 8:31 AM
    • #8
    • 12th Oct 18, 8:31 AM

    Leaving the system to come "on"/start 'firing' at a set time of day, instead of leaving it permanently "on" means that it has to work harder to bring it up to your chosen/set temperature - thus using more energy to try and get it up to your chosen temp.


    More energy used to get it from 16C to 20C = higher heating bill.
    Leaving system "on" means an even, ambient, temperature, no struggling to get from 16-20 in a shorter space of time = less energy used.


    I try to explain this to my parents, and older relatives, to no avail, they use far, far, more energy than they need to because of it
    Originally posted by Catsacor
    Unfortunately you are wrong and your relatives are correct.

    The best case would be the impossible situation of zero heat loss anywhere, in which case both scenarios would be the same.

    However, the house will be losing heat and the rate of heat loss
    increases exponentially with temperature, so the warmer it's kept the greater the heat loss.

    If you take the scenarios to the extremes eg leaving it on permanently for a month or leaving it off completely for a month, it becomes clear that turning it off when not needed is the most efficient.
    • robotrobo
    • By robotrobo 12th Oct 18, 9:09 AM
    • 847 Posts
    • 714 Thanks
    robotrobo
    • #9
    • 12th Oct 18, 9:09 AM
    • #9
    • 12th Oct 18, 9:09 AM
    The rooms in the north east corner of the house get very cold in winter. One of the rooms is the living room end of the lounge / diner, the other is a bedroom. The bedroom gets quite badly condensated and has had water running down the walls in the past simply because of people breathing. The loft is fully insulated and we have central heating but even with the heating on full it still gets cold. With winter about to hit I'm worried about how cold it's going to get. When I bought the house the home buyers pack said it was cavity wall insulated but I'm not sure that's the case. A colleague has warned me against CWI in case something goes wrong (eg. damp). I have no idea where to start in terms of getting this sorted and would appreciate advice. Whilst ventilation in the bedroom may reduce condensation it won't make it warmer (and no idea who could fit window vents either :-( )

    The house was built in1970 and is a semi detached with full exposure to the elements. These rooms get no sunlight after about 9am.
    Originally posted by queenmedusa
    Hi
    my bungalow is exactly the same problem as yours. i have tried everything thats been mentioned on here to no avail.

    i think its the cavity insulation !. my neighbour next door as the mirror same property who has no problems at all,

    How i manage the problem the best way i can is on the days that my windows are misted up , i use the karcher window vac and suck the water away and then wipe dry,this usally happens when the outside temp is hovering about the freezing temp , vent the room for a while,
    keep all moveable furniture with a 3" air gap able to circulate around the walls,
    once a month i put the dehumidifier on for the day to get rid of the excess water away.
    In the one corner i leave a small interior 99p dehumidifier,which fills up in 6weeks or more.
    So i manage this annoying problem i have inherited when buying this detached bungalow.
    today i have no moisture on the windows at all.
    no more cavity insulation for me , there again i am not moveing again.
    • Catsacor
    • By Catsacor 12th Oct 18, 5:11 PM
    • 72 Posts
    • 65 Thanks
    Catsacor
    Unfortunately you are wrong and your relatives are correct.

    The best case would be the impossible situation of zero heat loss anywhere, in which case both scenarios would be the same.

    However, the house will be losing heat and the rate of heat loss
    increases exponentially with temperature, so the warmer it's kept the greater the heat loss.

    If you take the scenarios to the extremes eg leaving it on permanently for a month or leaving it off completely for a month, it becomes clear that turning it off when not needed is the most efficient.
    Originally posted by chrisw


    Apologies, i must have misunderstood and talking at crossed purposes, sorry.


    I'm just going by the various heating engineers that have advised me over the years, they suggest using that method and controlling each rooms temp by adjusting the radiators thermostats apropriate to each room.
    • chrisw
    • By chrisw 12th Oct 18, 7:50 PM
    • 1,776 Posts
    • 1,009 Thanks
    chrisw
    I'm just going by the various heating engineers that have advised me over the years, they suggest using that method and controlling each rooms temp by adjusting the radiators thermostats apropriate to each room.
    Originally posted by Catsacor
    That is indeed the best method whilst the house is occupied but turn the heating off when you go out.

    Or if you have a programmable thermostat, you can set it around 10 to 15 degrees for while you're out and leave the heating on so it will keep it a bit warm and prevent pipes from freezing.
    • Fire Fox
    • By Fire Fox 18th Oct 18, 7:54 PM
    • 23,856 Posts
    • 27,067 Thanks
    Fire Fox
    Trickle vents in the windows wouldn't be sufficient to address that level of condensation, they are usually part of a ventilation strategy. And you do needa strategy, a damp area is unhealthy for occupants, for the building and won't feel warm.

    You might consider a single room heat recovery unit. This ventilates at a constant low rate 24/7 year round AND conserve a good percentage of the heat. Or if your loft or other area is warm, a decentralised mechanical input ventilation unit (MEV). Consult a BPEC domestic ventilation installer for these.

    An electric underblanket on the bed is a very cheap way to be toasty. An 'overnight' setting means it can safely be on all night. Also can be left on 'low' all day with duvet removed to air the bed (we all sweat lightly at night, and a slightly damp bed feels colder).
    Last edited by Fire Fox; 18-10-2018 at 8:00 PM.
    What a difference a day makes, twenty four little hours.
    • PasturesNew
    • By PasturesNew 18th Oct 18, 7:59 PM
    • 64,644 Posts
    • 379,437 Thanks
    PasturesNew
    Best place to start, that'll do something identifiable and give you at least "a better home" would be to invest (100-150 max) in a little dehumidifier and plug it in.

    If you can dry out that bedroom and the air then you're not causing more problems in the future, you'll be able to see the difference and that'll at least lift the spirits.

    Air post-dehumidifier is allegedly easier to warm ... some science reason about water and holding warmth etc.

    So, if you do nothing else, get researching a dehumidifier.
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