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  • FIRST POST
    • MSE Callum
    • By MSE Callum 10th Aug 18, 8:44 AM
    • 364Posts
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    MSE Callum
    All change - jargon to be removed from train tickets - MSE News
    • #1
    • 10th Aug 18, 8:44 AM
    All change - jargon to be removed from train tickets - MSE News 10th Aug 18 at 8:44 AM
    Train firms will remove jargon such as 'London terminals' and 'any permitted' from tickets on 100,000s of routes next month...
    Read the full story:
    'All change - jargon to be removed from train tickets'

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Page 1
    • Ian011
    • By Ian011 10th Aug 18, 9:15 AM
    • 2,134 Posts
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    Ian011
    • #2
    • 10th Aug 18, 9:15 AM
    • #2
    • 10th Aug 18, 9:15 AM
    So, rather than printing it on the ticket, where it is then clear exact!y what it is that you have bought, the information will be provided on a website which you are unlikely to read. Yet more dumbing down of everything.
    • JuicyJesus
    • By JuicyJesus 10th Aug 18, 10:37 AM
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    JuicyJesus
    • #3
    • 10th Aug 18, 10:37 AM
    • #3
    • 10th Aug 18, 10:37 AM
    This makes no sense. The information referred to is actually useful, indeed crucial, for understanding what journeys a ticket is valid for.

    I'm not sure what's jargon-ish about "Any permitted" route for starters, that's any route that's permitted. I'm also not sure what's jargon-ish about "London Terminals" - what constitutes a "London Terminal" is freely available information, if not obvious to anyone with a basic understanding of what London and a terminal are.

    Utter nonsense.
    urs sinserly,
    ~~joosy jeezus~~
    • JezR
    • By JezR 10th Aug 18, 12:32 PM
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    JezR
    • #4
    • 10th Aug 18, 12:32 PM
    • #4
    • 10th Aug 18, 12:32 PM
    First step to reducing flexibility - instead of a choice of routes (and stations in London) only one will be offered.
    • martindow
    • By martindow 10th Aug 18, 1:41 PM
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    martindow
    • #5
    • 10th Aug 18, 1:41 PM
    • #5
    • 10th Aug 18, 1:41 PM
    I'm not sure what's jargon-ish about "Any permitted" route for starters, that's any route that's permitted. .
    Originally posted by JuicyJesus
    Any permitted is jargon and not very helpful. What a passenger needs is something specific to their journey.


    If you have a ticket from Reading to Brighton, say, any permitted gives no useful information at all. Via London, via Guildford or via London or Guildford tell the passenger their choices.
    • Kite2010
    • By Kite2010 10th Aug 18, 10:22 PM
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    Kite2010
    • #6
    • 10th Aug 18, 10:22 PM
    • #6
    • 10th Aug 18, 10:22 PM
    First step to reducing flexibility - instead of a choice of routes (and stations in London) only one will be offered.
    Originally posted by JezR

    Agreed, as "London Terminals" is 'hard' to understand it will probably be made simple to just saying one station.


    For example a ticket from my local station to London is valid into Paddington/Waterloo/Victoria/Charing Cross/City Thameslink/Cannon Street/London Bridge etc, my fear is that it will be replaced with a nice simple "London Waterloo", where if you want to carry on towards Charing Cross you have to pay extra.
    • pmduk
    • By pmduk 13th Aug 18, 8:27 AM
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    pmduk
    • #7
    • 13th Aug 18, 8:27 AM
    • #7
    • 13th Aug 18, 8:27 AM
    So, rather than printing it on the ticket, where it is then clear exact!y what it is that you have bought, the information will be provided on a website which you are unlikely to read. Yet more dumbing down of everything.
    Originally posted by Ian011
    But we have a situation now where a ticket I regularly use says "any permitted route". I've searched and been unable to find a list of the permitted routes, so at least the new plans will bring some clarity. Some things do need dumbing down.
    • NaughtiusMaximus
    • By NaughtiusMaximus 13th Aug 18, 3:40 PM
    • 1,241 Posts
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    NaughtiusMaximus
    • #8
    • 13th Aug 18, 3:40 PM
    • #8
    • 13th Aug 18, 3:40 PM
    But we have a situation now where a ticket I regularly use says "any permitted route". I've searched and been unable to find a list of the permitted routes, so at least the new plans will bring some clarity. Some things do need dumbing down.
    Originally posted by pmduk
    There is a site where you can find the info you need but it's incredibly awkward to use. I think it's probably aimed more at people who work in the industry but I fail to see why they couldn't have designed a user friendly version for the general public. The information is all there but spread across various bits of the website.

    http://data.atoc.org/routeing-guide
    • yorkie2
    • By yorkie2 16th Aug 18, 7:47 PM
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    • #9
    • 16th Aug 18, 7:47 PM
    • #9
    • 16th Aug 18, 7:47 PM
    I see there are many replies questioning if this could lead to erosion of our rights and doubting if it will actually make things simpler.


    I firmly agree with those concerns.


    But we have a situation now where a ticket I regularly use says "any permitted route". I've searched and been unable to find a list of the permitted routes, so at least the new plans will bring some clarity. Some things do need dumbing down.
    Originally posted by pmduk
    You can find out if a route is permitted by searching the National Rail website (or any ticket booking website) and see if you can get an itinerary that is valid on one ticket for the journey you wish to make.


    If you book a particular journey online, you can obtain a travel itinerary which will be evidence that the route you wish to take is a permitted route; production of the itinerary on your booking confirmation email is evidence of a contract.


    If you want to find a particularly convoluted route, there are websites that offer up to 3 via points and up to 3 avoid locations, such as Trainsplit.



    There is a site where you can find the info you need but it's incredibly awkward to use. I think it's probably aimed more at people who work in the industry but I fail to see why they couldn't have designed a user friendly version for the general public. The information is all there but spread across various bits of the website.

    http://data.atoc.org/routeing-guide
    Originally posted by NaughtiusMaximus
    Yes, that site is very much intended for experts within the rail industry or people wishing to learn the inner workings of it.
    • t0rt0ise
    • By t0rt0ise 17th Aug 18, 10:46 AM
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    t0rt0ise
    Getting rid of London Terminals on the ticket is a good idea. The amount of people who think it means they can travel to any underground station is enormous. And then get abusive when it's pointed out to them that it's a National Rail ticket and not valid on the underground.
    • yorkie2
    • By yorkie2 19th Aug 18, 11:52 PM
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    • 530 Thanks
    yorkie2
    Getting rid of London Terminals on the ticket is a good idea.
    Originally posted by t0rt0ise
    Are you sure it's a good idea? What would you do for the following examples:
    • Edinburgh to London;
    • Oxford to London;
    • Ashford Intl to London.
    These examples are currently valid into numerous terminals, and I do not see how you could possibly come up with a viable proposal that does not reduce passenger rights.

    The amount of people who think it means they can travel to any underground station is enormous. And then get abusive when it's pointed out to them that it's a National Rail ticket and not valid on the underground.
    Originally posted by t0rt0ise
    I doubt this applies to any more than a tiny minority of passengers; I do not think you can come up with any solution that reduces the number of abusive passengers to zero, as that tiny minority will find something else to be abusive about.
    • aljama
    • By aljama 31st Aug 18, 12:10 PM
    • 1 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    aljama
    Getting rid of London Terminals on the ticket is a good idea. The amount of people who think it means they can travel to any underground station is enormous. And then get abusive when it's pointed out to them that it's a National Rail ticket and not valid on the underground.
    Originally posted by t0rt0ise
    To be pedantic are they not valid on the Underground for one journey between two NR terminals as long as you are not finishing your journey in London?
    Last edited by aljama; 31-08-2018 at 12:43 PM.
    • NaughtiusMaximus
    • By NaughtiusMaximus 31st Aug 18, 1:40 PM
    • 1,241 Posts
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    NaughtiusMaximus
    To be pedantic are they not valid on the Underground for one journey between two NR terminals as long as you are not finishing your journey in London?
    Originally posted by aljama
    If you buy a rail ticket between two location where a cross London transfer is require (e.g Birmingham to Brighton or Norwich to Bristol), your ticket will allow tube travel between the relevant London stations but such a ticket wouldn't say 'London terminals'
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