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  • FIRST POST
    • Darth_Spud
    • By Darth_Spud 4th Aug 18, 1:12 AM
    • 2Posts
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    Darth_Spud
    New Driver - 2 Speeding tickets in a week!
    • #1
    • 4th Aug 18, 1:12 AM
    New Driver - 2 Speeding tickets in a week! 4th Aug 18 at 1:12 AM
    Hi all,
    We're looking for some advice, my partner is a relatively new driver (under 1 year) and started a new job recently. She was unfamiliar with the route to work and got caught speeding 36 in a 30 twice on 2 different days all within the space of a week. She thought the road was a 40. The letters arrived within 2 days of each other and she's pretty distraught about it all and what may happen.

    Due to her being a new driver would she be offered an awareness course or would they simply hand her 6 points and revoke her license?

    Her car is on my insurance policy and she is marked as an additional driver to the car. will I need to inform my insurance company? If so would this effect my insurance as It was't my car and I wasn't driving?

    Not looking for any sympathy here, It was her fault and she's aware of that just looking for advice as to whats likely to happen.
Page 4
    • Supersonos
    • By Supersonos 6th Aug 18, 8:37 AM
    • 178 Posts
    • 68 Thanks
    Supersonos
    She thought the road was a 40.
    Originally posted by Darth_Spud
    Why did she think the road was a 40? Speed limit signs are very clear, so there would be no reason for her to think it was a 40 unless the signs weren't clear.

    There's a road near me where it goes from 60 to 30 at a slightly odd point (a long way before
    the village/any houses) and the signs are almost completely grown over at the moment. Anyone who didn't know the road would be likely to miss them.

    As she's a new driver, all the rules would be very fresh in her mind, so I'm sure there's a legitimate reason for her breaking the law - maybe go and take photos of the damaged/missing/obscured 30 signs and contest the tickets.

    EDIT: Read further on through the thread and noticed you're fronting her on your insurance. Sounds like you're just a pair of chancers, so I suspect the speed limit signs were fully visible, she just decided to ignore them because she doesn't actually care about how her speeding could affect others.

    I'm glad she's been caught.

    Hopefully now you'll get on and sort out the insurance. Don't forget to mention the points and pay the increased premium.
    Last edited by Supersonos; 06-08-2018 at 8:51 AM.
    • AdrianC
    • By AdrianC 6th Aug 18, 9:03 AM
    • 18,034 Posts
    • 16,348 Thanks
    AdrianC
    There's a road near me where it goes from 60 to 30 at a slightly odd point (a long way before
    the village/any houses) and the signs are almost completely grown over at the moment. Anyone who didn't know the road would be likely to miss them.
    Originally posted by Supersonos
    But a competent and alert driver will, of course, quickly realise they missed the sign due to the default rules over repeaters and streetlights.
    • Supersonos
    • By Supersonos 6th Aug 18, 10:01 AM
    • 178 Posts
    • 68 Thanks
    Supersonos
    But a competent and alert driver will, of course, quickly realise they missed the sign due to the default rules over repeaters and streetlights.
    Originally posted by AdrianC
    No streetlights or even a pavement at that point I don't think - it looks and feels exactly like the NSL country road, hedges and trees each side, that the driver was just on. It's a good few hundred yards before you see the village, and as the signs are currently grown over, I'd understand a less competent driver not realising it was a 30mph.

    Actually, looking on streetview, there is a pavement, but that pavement is also on the NSL part. But interestingly, there are road markings showing 30 that are no longer there as I assume the road has been resurfaced in the last year and those haven't been painted back on. Look at the B5378 as it enters Shenley from Borehamwood. The two 30 signs are totally grown over at the moment - you can't even see the village name.
    Last edited by Supersonos; 06-08-2018 at 10:07 AM.
    • AndyMc.....
    • By AndyMc..... 6th Aug 18, 10:18 AM
    • 2,055 Posts
    • 1,246 Thanks
    AndyMc.....
    Why did she think the road was a 40? Speed limit signs are very clear, so there would be no reason for her to think it was a 40 unless the signs weren't clear.

    There's a road near me where it goes from 60 to 30 at a slightly odd point (a long way before
    the village/any houses) and the signs are almost completely grown over at the moment. Anyone who didn't know the road would be likely to miss them.

    As she's a new driver, all the rules would be very fresh in her mind, so I'm sure there's a legitimate reason for her breaking the law - maybe go and take photos of the damaged/missing/obscured 30 signs and contest the tickets.

    EDIT: Read further on through the thread and noticed you're fronting her on your insurance. Sounds like you're just a pair of chancers, so I suspect the speed limit signs were fully visible, she just decided to ignore them because she doesn't actually care about how her speeding could affect others.

    I'm glad she's been caught.

    Hopefully now you'll get on and sort out the insurance. Don't forget to mention the points and pay the increased premium.
    Originally posted by Supersonos
    If there are lamp post there wouldn't be any signs.
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    • Supersonos
    • By Supersonos 6th Aug 18, 10:41 AM
    • 178 Posts
    • 68 Thanks
    Supersonos
    If there are lamp post there wouldn't be any signs.
    Originally posted by AndyMc.....
    That's new to me. I always thought that, when entering a new speed limit zone, the zone would be marked by the speed limit in a red circle. I didn't realise lamp posts alone were an indication of the new speed limit.
    • AndyMc.....
    • By AndyMc..... 6th Aug 18, 10:52 AM
    • 2,055 Posts
    • 1,246 Thanks
    AndyMc.....
    That's new to me. I always thought that, when entering a new speed limit zone, the zone would be marked by the speed limit in a red circle. I didn't realise lamp posts alone were an indication of the new speed limit.
    Originally posted by Supersonos
    There's no mention of her entering a new limit, just her assuming. 40 limit was 30.
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    • Nick_C
    • By Nick_C 6th Aug 18, 11:28 AM
    • 4,025 Posts
    • 5,596 Thanks
    Nick_C
    No need for psychic powers. A 20 zone will have traffic calming measures every 100 metres or less.
    Originally posted by Car 54
    All traffic calming has been removed in my area.
    Originally posted by Labsuper
    According to ROSPA "20mph limits, which consist of just a speed limit change but no physical measures to reduce vehicle speeds within the areas. Drivers are alerted to the speed limit with 20mph speed limit repeater signs."

    Every 20mph road I have driven on has had regular repeaters.
    • Supersonos
    • By Supersonos 6th Aug 18, 11:33 AM
    • 178 Posts
    • 68 Thanks
    Supersonos
    There's no mention of her entering a new limit, just her assuming. 40 limit was 30.
    Originally posted by AndyMc.....
    How do you think she arrived in that 30 zone? Teleportation?

    To get to the place where she was caught speeding, she must have passed a speed limit sign as she entered, even though the OP didn't specifically mention her doing so. Therefore, she must have known it was a 30 zone. Unless the signs were overgrown/missing as per my suggestion above.

    If the signs were visible, she was simply speeding or driving without due attention and absolutely deserves the points/speed awareness course and increased premiums.
    • Nick_C
    • By Nick_C 6th Aug 18, 11:50 AM
    • 4,025 Posts
    • 5,596 Thanks
    Nick_C
    The problem is people see the speed limit as a target.
    The clue is in the name "limit".
    Originally posted by treboeth
    While it is an absolute limit, it's also a target in the right circumstances. If you are on a single carriageway road with a national speed limit and in a vehicle permitted to do 60, you should be driving at 60 if the conditions are appropriate. You should be driving showing consideration for other road users.

    There will of course be conditions which mean that a lower speed is appropriate.

    Edit: and you can of course fail your driving test for driving too slowly!
    • AndyMc.....
    • By AndyMc..... 6th Aug 18, 12:01 PM
    • 2,055 Posts
    • 1,246 Thanks
    AndyMc.....
    How do you think she arrived in that 30 zone? Teleportation?

    To get to the place where she was caught speeding, she must have passed a speed limit sign as she entered, even though the OP didn't specifically mention her doing so. Therefore, she must have known it was a 30 zone. Unless the signs were overgrown/missing as per my suggestion above.

    If the signs were visible, she was simply speeding or driving without due attention and absolutely deserves the points/speed awareness course and increased premiums.
    Originally posted by Supersonos
    She may have always been in a 30.
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    • Supersonos
    • By Supersonos 6th Aug 18, 12:11 PM
    • 178 Posts
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    Supersonos
    She may have always been in a 30.
    Originally posted by AndyMc.....
    Then she would definitely know she was in a 30 zone if she lives in a 30 zone and had not passed any signs on her new route to work indicating she had now entered a 40.

    The OP made clear she was "unfamiliar with her route to work". Even someone who doesn't drive is familiar with the road they live on.
    • AndyMc.....
    • By AndyMc..... 6th Aug 18, 12:19 PM
    • 2,055 Posts
    • 1,246 Thanks
    AndyMc.....
    Then she would definitely know she was in a 30 zone if she lives in a 30 zone and had not passed any signs on her new route to work indicating she had now entered a 40.

    The OP made clear she was "unfamiliar with her route to work". Even someone who doesn't drive is familiar with the road they live on.
    Originally posted by Supersonos
    Some people assume dual carriageways are 40 when they are 30. But given we don't know the route it is mere speculation.
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    • Nick_C
    • By Nick_C 6th Aug 18, 12:25 PM
    • 4,025 Posts
    • 5,596 Thanks
    Nick_C
    Some people assume dual carriageways are 40 when they are 30. But given we don't know the route it is mere speculation.
    Originally posted by AndyMc.....
    But if you are not sure whether the limit is 30 or 40 (it's easy to miss the first sign) you should assume it is 30 until you see a repeater telling you it is 40.
    • Supersonos
    • By Supersonos 6th Aug 18, 12:31 PM
    • 178 Posts
    • 68 Thanks
    Supersonos
    But if you are not sure whether the limit is 30 or 40 (it's easy to miss the first sign) you should assume it is 30 until you see a repeater telling you it is 40.
    Originally posted by Nick_C
    Whatever happened and for whatever reason, the person in question wasn't paying attention (or, more likely, just didn't care and thought they'd get away with it) and got caught. And for that I'm grateful.

    More people need to be caught, the fines should increase and the speed awareness course should be scrapped.
    • AndyMc.....
    • By AndyMc..... 6th Aug 18, 12:32 PM
    • 2,055 Posts
    • 1,246 Thanks
    AndyMc.....
    But if you are not sure whether the limit is 30 or 40 (it's easy to miss the first sign) you should assume it is 30 until you see a repeater telling you it is 40.
    Originally posted by Nick_C
    #64 I know.
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    • Car 54
    • By Car 54 6th Aug 18, 12:33 PM
    • 3,185 Posts
    • 1,984 Thanks
    Car 54
    According to ROSPA "20mph limits, which consist of just a speed limit change but no physical measures to reduce vehicle speeds within the areas. Drivers are alerted to the speed limit with 20mph speed limit repeater signs."

    Every 20mph road I have driven on has had regular repeaters.
    Originally posted by Nick_C
    As ROSPA says, there are "20mph limits, which consist of just a speed limit change but no physical measures to reduce vehicle speeds". These require repeater signs.


    But there are also 20 mph zones. These have distinctive entry and exit signs and no repeater signs, but must have traffic calming features (bumps, chicanes, etc.) at least every 100 metres.


    The signs are the very first shown in the HC https://www.gov.uk/guidance/the-highway-code/traffic-signs, so no real excuse for anyone not knowing about them.
    • Herzlos
    • By Herzlos 6th Aug 18, 2:24 PM
    • 7,654 Posts
    • 7,015 Thanks
    Herzlos
    Do we know where these incidents happen? We may be able to help with a bit of local knowledge.


    More likely you'll need to take your partner off your insurance and buy her a bus pass though.
    • Supersonos
    • By Supersonos 6th Aug 18, 6:10 PM
    • 178 Posts
    • 68 Thanks
    Supersonos
    As well as punishments for idiots who speed etc., there should be rewards for people who don't speed. I've just paid 450 VED. There should be a reduction because I've never had any endorsements.
    • AndyMc.....
    • By AndyMc..... 6th Aug 18, 6:19 PM
    • 2,055 Posts
    • 1,246 Thanks
    AndyMc.....
    As well as punishments for idiots who speed etc., there should be rewards for people who don't speed. I've just paid 450 VED. There should be a reduction because I've never had any endorsements.
    Originally posted by Supersonos
    So you've never been caught, if you want to pay less get a cleaner car.
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    • Car 54
    • By Car 54 6th Aug 18, 6:20 PM
    • 3,185 Posts
    • 1,984 Thanks
    Car 54
    As well as punishments for idiots who speed etc., there should be rewards for people who don't speed. I've just paid 450 VED. There should be a reduction because I've never had any endorsements.
    Originally posted by Supersonos

    Excellent idea. I've never murdered anyone or robbed a bank: that must be worth a lot more than your driving record.
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