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  • FIRST POST
    • pinstrypsoldier
    • By pinstrypsoldier 2nd Aug 18, 7:26 PM
    • 11Posts
    • 1Thanks
    pinstrypsoldier
    Should I have to wait 28 days to get my money back from TOTO?
    • #1
    • 2nd Aug 18, 7:26 PM
    Should I have to wait 28 days to get my money back from TOTO? 2nd Aug 18 at 7:26 PM
    Hi all,

    Had no end of problems with Toto. I won't go into it too much but I switched to Outfox The Market back in March and I'm STILL paying Toto for my gas - even though my new supplier confirms they are now supplying my gas.

    After constant calls to Toto and being told someone will call me back, (which they never do), they've now cancelled the DD and said it will be passed onto the billing team (after me saying i would be going to the energy ombudsman) and i will get any money back that they owe me (around £400!!) after 28 days.

    It just seems a bit rich that i have to wait a month to get back the money they shouldn't have taken from me in the first place.

    Is there any way around this? I need that money now! I was just checking over my budget now that i finally have time, to try and figure out why i have less money available than normal and this is why. I need that money.

    Many thanks
    Dan
Page 1
    • trickytree1963
    • By trickytree1963 3rd Aug 18, 12:59 PM
    • 253 Posts
    • 151 Thanks
    trickytree1963
    • #2
    • 3rd Aug 18, 12:59 PM
    • #2
    • 3rd Aug 18, 12:59 PM
    If they took DD's AFTER you left contact your bank and invoke the direct debit guarantee.
    • macman
    • By macman 3rd Aug 18, 1:23 PM
    • 42,307 Posts
    • 17,693 Thanks
    macman
    • #3
    • 3rd Aug 18, 1:23 PM
    • #3
    • 3rd Aug 18, 1:23 PM
    Why didn't you cancel the DD once you received the final bill-which should be within 6 weeks of the switch?
    No one but you can cancel the DD-it's your account.
    No free lunch, and no free laptop
    • pinstrypsoldier
    • By pinstrypsoldier 5th Aug 18, 12:18 PM
    • 11 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    pinstrypsoldier
    • #4
    • 5th Aug 18, 12:18 PM
    • #4
    • 5th Aug 18, 12:18 PM
    Why didn't you cancel the DD once you received the final bill-which should be within 6 weeks of the switch?
    No one but you can cancel the DD-it's your account.
    Originally posted by macman
    As I said in my post - Toto actually cancelled the DD in the end.

    Companies almost always cancel DDs after the account is closed so Iím not sure what you mean? Obviously you are the only one that can cancel the DD from the bankís end, but companies can (and almost always do and should do) cancel DDs on their end at the end of an account. People donít have to go to their bank account and physically cancel DDs themselves every time they cancel a membership with something?

    Anyway, the real question - the real fault on my end - is letting it go on for so long which is totally my fault (though Toto still have an obligation to cancel the DD on their end as companies always do). The answer to that is that I get very easily confused with dates of switchovers/when last bills come in/forgetting to chase companies up and staying super aware of whatís going on in my bank account etc. Thankfully, this isnít an issue most of the time as companies 9/10 just need to be told once that youíre switching and they actually do what they say and take care of the rest - just not on this occasion. Believe me, if Iíd remembered/had the presence of mind to sort this out earlier, I would have - Iím not Ďfineí with people take £80 a month from me for no reason.

    The reason Iím Ďall over ití now, is I was recently diagnosed with ADHD (which explains A LOT) and am now on medication, meaning this is all a breeze to chase up and stay on top of. Itís a shock how much needs catching up with (paid memberships for things I donít need anymore like the gym etc but theyíre entirely my fault because I havenít cancelled them), but thankfully, Iím able to do it now.
    • pinstrypsoldier
    • By pinstrypsoldier 5th Aug 18, 12:20 PM
    • 11 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    pinstrypsoldier
    • #5
    • 5th Aug 18, 12:20 PM
    • #5
    • 5th Aug 18, 12:20 PM
    If they took DD's AFTER you left contact your bank and invoke the direct debit guarantee.
    Originally posted by trickytree1963
    Thanks for your response.

    Could I ask what you mean by this?

    Also, the DD is done now. All Iím asking is if thereís a way around having to wait for so long for whatís mine?
    • JJ Egan
    • By JJ Egan 5th Aug 18, 12:38 PM
    • 10,847 Posts
    • 4,641 Thanks
    JJ Egan
    • #6
    • 5th Aug 18, 12:38 PM
    • #6
    • 5th Aug 18, 12:38 PM
    No DD acccount to refund the money to ??
    Is that the problem .
    • ValiantSon
    • By ValiantSon 5th Aug 18, 5:48 PM
    • 2,526 Posts
    • 2,461 Thanks
    ValiantSon
    • #7
    • 5th Aug 18, 5:48 PM
    • #7
    • 5th Aug 18, 5:48 PM
    Should you have to wait 28 days for the refund? No.

    Do you have to wait 28 days for the refund? Yes.

    It is perfectly legal for them to make you wait 28 days, I'm afraid. I don't believe it should be, but at present it is.

    As to the direct debit guarantee, you are entitled to have the money refunded to you swiftly, if it should not have been taken. If they continued to take direct debit payments after you ceased being a customer (and not just one to settle the final bill), then they shouldn't have and you are entitled to the money back through the direct debit scheme. You should, therefore be able to make a claim under the guarantee and receive the money immediately in your account (the bank will then pursue the company for the money). You need to contact your bank and ask them to do this, but as a word of caution, given that Toto now seem to have agreed that they owe you the money, it might complicate things with getting all of the money back, if there are additional funds that are not due to the incorrect direct debit payments.

    https://www.directdebit.co.uk/DirectDebitExplained/Pages/DirectDebitGuarantee.aspx
    • macman
    • By macman 5th Aug 18, 6:27 PM
    • 42,307 Posts
    • 17,693 Thanks
    macman
    • #8
    • 5th Aug 18, 6:27 PM
    • #8
    • 5th Aug 18, 6:27 PM
    As I said in my post - Toto actually cancelled the DD in the end.

    Companies almost always cancel DDs after the account is closed so Iím not sure what you mean? Obviously you are the only one that can cancel the DD from the bankís end, but companies can (and almost always do and should do) cancel DDs on their end at the end of an account. People donít have to go to their bank account and physically cancel DDs themselves every time they cancel a membership with something?

    Anyway, the real question - the real fault on my end - is letting it go on for so long which is totally my fault (though Toto still have an obligation to cancel the DD on their end as companies always do). The answer to that is that I get very easily confused with dates of switchovers/when last bills come in/forgetting to chase companies up and staying super aware of whatís going on in my bank account etc. Thankfully, this isnít an issue most of the time as companies 9/10 just need to be told once that youíre switching and they actually do what they say and take care of the rest - just not on this occasion. Believe me, if Iíd remembered/had the presence of mind to sort this out earlier, I would have - Iím not Ďfineí with people take £80 a month from me for no reason.

    The reason Iím Ďall over ití now, is I was recently diagnosed with ADHD (which explains A LOT) and am now on medication, meaning this is all a breeze to chase up and stay on top of. Itís a shock how much needs catching up with (paid memberships for things I donít need anymore like the gym etc but theyíre entirely my fault because I havenít cancelled them), but thankfully, Iím able to do it now.
    Originally posted by pinstrypsoldier
    You don't understand how a DD works. The recipient cannot cancel it, all they can do is stop drawing on it-but it remains in place. Of course you should cancel it yourself, since no-one else can. You don't need to go to the bank to do this, you can do it instantly via your online account
    No free lunch, and no free laptop
    • pinstrypsoldier
    • By pinstrypsoldier 6th Aug 18, 8:54 AM
    • 11 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    pinstrypsoldier
    • #9
    • 6th Aug 18, 8:54 AM
    • #9
    • 6th Aug 18, 8:54 AM
    You don't understand how a DD works. The recipient cannot cancel it, all they can do is stop drawing on it-but it remains in place. Of course you should cancel it yourself, since no-one else can. You don't need to go to the bank to do this, you can do it instantly via your online account
    Originally posted by macman
    My point is Iíve never needed to cancel a direct debit myself after leaving a company before. Theyíve always Ďcancelledí it themselves (in their words). Whether that means theyíve actually cancelled it or have just stopped drawing on it as you say has never mattered in this past - either way Iím not paying them anymore. Whether the DD has just been changed to £0 or has actually been cancelled is a moot point as far as Iím concerned at that point.

    When I said Ďgo to your bankí I meant online. I have cancelled DDs before but always as a Ďhousekeepingí task, not every time I cease being a customer of someoneís. Itís tough enough as it is keeping on top of things, without adding what should be (and is 99.9% of the time) an unnecessary step.
    • Smodlet
    • By Smodlet 6th Aug 18, 12:17 PM
    • 3,622 Posts
    • 6,806 Thanks
    Smodlet
    Cancelling a DD online takes about 30 seconds. You can either leave it to someone else and take the consequences or take control of the situation by cancelling it yourself. Your choice, of course but you could have avoided this situation a dozen times over in the time you have spent on this thread. Again, your choice just as it is to learn from this experience, or not to.
    What is this life if, sweet wordsmith, we have no time to take the pith?
    Every stew starts with the first onion.
    I took it upon myself to investigate a trifle; it had custard, jelly, soggy sponge things...
    • brewerdave
    • By brewerdave 6th Aug 18, 12:28 PM
    • 5,020 Posts
    • 2,213 Thanks
    brewerdave
    My point is Iíve never needed to cancel a direct debit myself after leaving a company before. Theyíve always Ďcancelledí it themselves (in their words). Whether that means theyíve actually cancelled it or have just stopped drawing on it as you say has never mattered in this past - either way Iím not paying them anymore. Whether the DD has just been changed to £0 or has actually been cancelled is a moot point as far as Iím concerned at that point.
    Originally posted by pinstrypsoldier

    ....when I switched current accounts , my then bank sent a list of DDs to the new bank, who forwarded to me for checking.

    I believe that there were ~ 8 "old" DDs still existing ,which had dropped off the internet banking interface but were still recorded as live by the old bank. This included a couple to a previous utility supplier.

    Now, I don't take the risk -I cancel myself!
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