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  • FIRST POST
    • Pando
    • By Pando 24th Jul 18, 9:51 PM
    • 11Posts
    • 2Thanks
    Pando
    No PCN Served - BW Legal instructed to collect - help please
    • #1
    • 24th Jul 18, 9:51 PM
    No PCN Served - BW Legal instructed to collect - help please 24th Jul 18 at 9:51 PM
    Hello all, and thank you for any advice you may give me ahead of this.
    Today I received a collection letter from bwlegal.co.uk who are collecting for Napier Parking.

    I was never served a PCN on my car and never had any letters sent to me about any fine and so was surprised when BWLegal sent me a letter claiming I owed 100 for a PCN and also 60 for their client's initial legal costs.

    This has hit me at a bad time and I am struggling with various other costs that have decided to group up and form an ambush party on me.
    I have attached photos of two letters that have come through the post in the same letter together.

    Im not sure how to appeal (or if thats even worth trying) because I do not even have PCN number to appeal against. Should I raise a complain with Napier parking? I imagine they will just refer me to the collectors now.

    Any advice anyone could give me would be much appreciated, at this stage a friendly helping hand would be a god-send.
    BW Legal Letter:-
    dropbox.com/s/gb2dzdxjwlb72a1/IMG_20180724_213550.jpg?dl=0
    Napier Parking Letter:-
    dropbox.com/s/1148ixm290dx1wu/IMG_20180725_181037.jpg?dl=0
    Last edited by Pando; 25-07-2018 at 6:16 PM. Reason: Need to remove an address
Page 1
    • Redx
    • By Redx 24th Jul 18, 10:33 PM
    • 18,814 Posts
    • 23,789 Thanks
    Redx
    • #2
    • 24th Jul 18, 10:33 PM
    • #2
    • 24th Jul 18, 10:33 PM
    drop a SAR bomb under the new GDPR 2018 on both of them


    see the GDPR thread by coupon mad for guidance
    Newbies !!
    Private Parking ticket? check the 2 sticky threads by coupon-mad and crabman in the Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking Board forum for the latest advice or maybe try pepipoo or C.A.G. or legal beagles forums if you need legal advice as well because this parking forum is not about debt collectors or legal matters per se
    • claxtome
    • By claxtome 25th Jul 18, 5:04 AM
    • 603 Posts
    • 714 Thanks
    claxtome
    • #3
    • 25th Jul 18, 5:04 AM
    • #3
    • 25th Jul 18, 5:04 AM
    I started to make the dropbox links more readily accessible but found the second one had your name and address on. I suggest you rescan the Napier letter and hide this bit.
    Last edited by claxtome; 25-07-2018 at 5:09 AM.
    • Pando
    • By Pando 25th Jul 18, 6:24 PM
    • 11 Posts
    • 2 Thanks
    Pando
    • #4
    • 25th Jul 18, 6:24 PM
    • #4
    • 25th Jul 18, 6:24 PM
    Thank you both for your replies. When you have a lot of financial weight on your shoulders its a really big relief to know members of this forum will have each other's backs.

    Redx I can't see a GDPR thread by Coupon mad, I see a newbie guide started by himself, is it on that? I also tried an advanced search for GDPR by username Coupon mad but couldnt find it. The term SAR bomb has got me excited though! Sounds like some new legislation that I can use to fight against this unfair treatment! If so that will be awesome

    Claxome thank you for checking that, I have edited the post with a censored document. Cheers again
    • KeithP
    • By KeithP 25th Jul 18, 6:39 PM
    • 8,597 Posts
    • 8,477 Thanks
    KeithP
    • #5
    • 25th Jul 18, 6:39 PM
    • #5
    • 25th Jul 18, 6:39 PM
    Using advanced search with username Coupon-mad and searching for GDPR in titles only returned just one post:

    forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?p=74351342#post74351342
    .
    • The Deep
    • By The Deep 25th Jul 18, 6:51 PM
    • 9,965 Posts
    • 9,754 Thanks
    The Deep
    • #6
    • 25th Jul 18, 6:51 PM
    • #6
    • 25th Jul 18, 6:51 PM
    Complain to the SRA

    http://www.sra.org.uk/home/home.page

    and your MP.

    This is an entirely unregulated industry which is scamming the public with inflated claims for minor breaches of contracts for alleged parking offences, aided and abetted by a handful of low-rent solicitors.

    Parking Eye, CPM, Smart, and another company have already been named and shamed, as has Gladstones Solicitors, and BW Legal, (these two law firms take hundreds of these cases to court each year). They lose most of them, and have been reported to the regulatory authority by an M.P. for unprofessional conduct

    Hospital car parks and residential complex tickets have been especially mentioned.

    The problem has become so rampant that MPs have agreed to enact a Bill to regulate these scammers. Watch the video of the Second Reading in the House of Commons recently

    http://parliamentlive.tv/event/index/2f0384f2-eba5-4fff-ab07-cf24b6a22918?in=12:49:41 recently.

    and complain in the most robust terms to your MP. With a fair wind they will be out of business by Christmas.
    You never know how far you can go until you go too far.
    • Pando
    • By Pando 25th Jul 18, 8:41 PM
    • 11 Posts
    • 2 Thanks
    Pando
    • #7
    • 25th Jul 18, 8:41 PM
    • #7
    • 25th Jul 18, 8:41 PM
    Redx: The thread seems to suggest I send a SAR to the PPC but in my case wont they just tell me its been passed on to the collection company and solicitors (BW Legal) ?

    KeithP: Thank you for the link, I was missing a dash between the username

    The Deep: I will complain to the SRA also. (getting used to all these abbreviations).

    Can any of you tell me whether I should contact Napier Parking and ask to see the original PCN and copies of any letters they are supposed to have sent me, or is that just inviting them to make it up and also proceeding towards an admission of fault on my behalf?
    Should I contact BW Legal in these regards also.
    OR
    Should I just fill out a SAR Template (aka Sar Bomb) and also the DVLA in regards to my data. ?

    Sorry to seem pedantic, this is a whole new world of legal jargon I'm not really used to.
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 26th Jul 18, 12:46 AM
    • 60,025 Posts
    • 73,164 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    • #8
    • 26th Jul 18, 12:46 AM
    • #8
    • 26th Jul 18, 12:46 AM
    The thread seems to suggest I send a SAR to the PPC but in my case wont they just tell me its been passed on to the collection company and solicitors (BW Legal) ?
    No. A company MUST respond to a SAR. Why not Google it?

    Can any of you tell me whether I should contact Napier Parking and ask to see the original PCN and copies of any letters they are supposed to have sent me,
    Of course but that's part of the SAR letter, you will be asking for copies of all letters, as well as all photos and their records/PCN summary and every instance where your name/address and/or VRN has been processed or stored.
    PRIVATE PCN? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT TWO Clicks needed for advice:
    Top of the page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    Advice to ignore is WRONG, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • nosferatu1001
    • By nosferatu1001 26th Jul 18, 10:32 AM
    • 3,080 Posts
    • 3,781 Thanks
    nosferatu1001
    • #9
    • 26th Jul 18, 10:32 AM
    • #9
    • 26th Jul 18, 10:32 AM
    A SAR is a Subject Access Request. It REQUIRES THEM to furnish you with ALL DATA THEY HAVE ON YOU, regardless of how this data is stored.

    So of course they cant say "we passed it on to..." bwecause *clearly* they still have to know your details, otherwise they would be clueless if / when BW Legal come back with a bill, having lost in court to you with our help, asking for payment
    • Pando
    • By Pando 26th Jul 18, 10:36 AM
    • 11 Posts
    • 2 Thanks
    Pando
    Ok thank you Coupon-Mad, and thank you for putting in the time to put together the newbie thread on here too.
    My situation has changed, having gone to the car to look grab out the V5CW document to attach with the SAR email and I can see why I did not receive any reminder letters. I had not updated my from when I changed my address 8 months ago.
    My position is considerably weaker it seems then I had thought. My own fault, I had updated my driving license details and thought all taken care of but not thought to update the V5 address.

    I will still attach it to a SAR document and send them off. Perhaps the PPC is remiss on other responsibilities. Thank you all for your advice all the same, I've slept a better knowing their is action I could take.
    • Quentin
    • By Quentin 26th Jul 18, 10:42 AM
    • 36,820 Posts
    • 20,953 Thanks
    Quentin
    Make sure you inform the PPC of your correct address - keep a copy of the letter and get proof of posting when you sent it


    Otherwise you risk getting a default CCJ against you without you knowing about it!
    • Pando
    • By Pando 26th Jul 18, 11:19 AM
    • 11 Posts
    • 2 Thanks
    Pando
    Will do Quentin, although the PPC is no longer dealing with it, they have passed it onto BW Legal who seem to have figured out the correct address they got a demand over to me :-
    Napier Parking Letter: dropbox.com/s/1148ixm290dx1wu/IMG_20180725_181037.jpg?dl=

    I'll give all parties my correct details just in case however
    • Pando
    • By Pando 26th Jul 18, 11:21 AM
    • 11 Posts
    • 2 Thanks
    Pando
    Oh and I was thinking to send my SAR letter as a CC'd email with scanned V5 document attached, rather than snail mail. Is there any reason I should go with the written approach?
    • nosferatu1001
    • By nosferatu1001 26th Jul 18, 12:28 PM
    • 3,080 Posts
    • 3,781 Thanks
    nosferatu1001
    None
    They accept service by email so they cant complain if it is used.
    • Pando
    • By Pando 31st Jul 18, 10:22 AM
    • 11 Posts
    • 2 Thanks
    Pando
    Napier Parking have replied asking me to fill out a form to complete the request. Is it in my interest to fill this out or should I let them figure it all out themselves (and 3 pieces of ID that I should send them?)

    "I have enclosed a copy of our Subject Access Request form which details the information we require from you before we can process your request. You do not have to complete this form if you do not wish to do so, however, it may speed up your request.

    If you do not wish to complete the form, we still require two forms of ID from you as detailed in Section 3 of the form. Once we have received these we can return the information you have requested.

    napierparking.co.uk/Napier%20Parking%20Privacy%20Policy%20.pdf"
    • beamerguy
    • By beamerguy 31st Jul 18, 10:36 AM
    • 8,093 Posts
    • 10,628 Thanks
    beamerguy
    Napier think you are mug

    They already know who you are
    From getting your info from the DVLA to you replying
    from the same address and requesting they reply to
    the SAR to the same address

    Stalling tactics, also hoping you will not respond

    Such is the nature of these scammers

    "You do not have to complete this form if you do not wish to do so, however, it may speed up your request."

    You simply cannot give further private data to Napier

    If they do not respond within the statutory period for
    the SAR ....... REPORT THEM TO THE ICO
    RBS - MNBA - CAPITAL ONE - LLOYDS

    DISGUSTING BEHAVIOUR
    • Pando
    • By Pando 1st Aug 18, 11:41 AM
    • 11 Posts
    • 2 Thanks
    Pando
    My reply "Dear data protection officer.

    You have all the information required to deal with this query already. The fact that I am replying to letters sent to my myself at my address by yourselves and by bwlegal is confirmation enough of my identity. I will not be sending any further identification or any thing else that could consitute a breach of my privacy in terms of data held. I await your reponse to my earlier mentioned SAR request. "
    • Pando
    • By Pando 9th Aug 18, 12:53 PM
    • 11 Posts
    • 2 Thanks
    Pando
    14 Days until Potential CCJ
    So even though I have sent a SAR request to both Napier parking and BWLegal they are still applying for a CCJ.
    I had thought that the SAR request would put this on hold.
    In the latest letter they brought my attention to the case of ParkingEye Limited v Beavis [2015] UKSC 67 in which the sepreme court held that parking charges and neither extravagant nor unconscionable. Apparently this case "eliminates the main defence that you will have should I go to Court"

    Also my claim has" already been processed through an independent appeal service who have dismissed it already and country coury is likely to do the same" - I've never made a claim or an appeal, I've only sent them a SAR request, is this standard template stuff?

    See latest Letter
    dropbox.com/s/meh05nyixfnokvy/IMG_20180809_123347.jpg?dl=0

    Can anyone tell me what I should do? I can't afford to pay the legal costs of a CCJ now for the sake of not displaying a valid permit.
    I want to fight these guys if at all possible, I just can't afford for a CCJ to go against me. Should they have put proceedings on hold while they satisfied the CCJ request? Or should Napier parking have instructed BwLegal to put it on hold and they have failed to do that?

    Any guidance would be very welcome.
    • IamEmanresu
    • By IamEmanresu 9th Aug 18, 12:57 PM
    • 2,959 Posts
    • 4,993 Thanks
    IamEmanresu
    Have you actually had a claim form?

    Potential CCJ is like a potential win on the national lottery - and about the same chances.
    If you want to win - avoid losing first. Here are a few examples
    1. Failing to Acknowledge or Defend https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=5760415
    2. Template defences that say nothing https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=5818671&page=5#86
    3. Forgetting about the Witness Statement
    • Castle
    • By Castle 9th Aug 18, 1:20 PM
    • 1,866 Posts
    • 2,532 Thanks
    Castle
    Have you actually had a claim form?

    Potential CCJ is like a potential win on the national lottery - and about the same chances.
    Originally posted by IamEmanresu
    The answer is probably no, because, according to BW Legal's letter, they may be issuing a Letter of Claim on or after 23rd August.
    https://www.dropbox.com/s/meh05nyixfnokvy/IMG_20180809_123347.jpg?dl=0
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