Your browser isn't supported
It looks like you're using an old web browser. To get the most out of the site and to ensure guides display correctly, we suggest upgrading your browser now. Download the latest:

Welcome to the MSE Forums

We're home to a fantastic community of MoneySavers but anyone can post. Please exercise caution & report spam, illegal, offensive or libellous posts/messages: click "report" or email forumteam@.

Search
  • FIRST POST
    • Beaker99
    • By Beaker99 12th Jul 18, 1:36 PM
    • 228Posts
    • 120Thanks
    Beaker99
    Affect of forfeiture of lease on other houses
    • #1
    • 12th Jul 18, 1:36 PM
    Affect of forfeiture of lease on other houses 12th Jul 18 at 1:36 PM
    Afternoon all,

    I live on a small private estate. There are some shenanigans going on with some landlords not ensuring their tenants are abiding by some parking conditions in the covenants.

    The chairman of the management company of the communal areas and leasholds (which we all own a share of) has written a snotty letter to all the shareholders saying they will force forfeiture on the offending leasholders if they don't start abiding by the covenants.

    To inflame things further they said that if any property on the entire development (which is a mixture of lease and freeholds) faces forfeiture, then no property can get mortgage.

    Simply, Is this true?
Page 1
    • davidmcn
    • By davidmcn 12th Jul 18, 1:45 PM
    • 8,535 Posts
    • 8,995 Thanks
    davidmcn
    • #2
    • 12th Jul 18, 1:45 PM
    • #2
    • 12th Jul 18, 1:45 PM
    Incoming buyers/lenders won't know whether other properties' leases have been forfeited anyway, so...no.
    • sal_III
    • By sal_III 12th Jul 18, 1:45 PM
    • 644 Posts
    • 658 Thanks
    sal_III
    • #3
    • 12th Jul 18, 1:45 PM
    • #3
    • 12th Jul 18, 1:45 PM
    I highly doubt the freeholder will be able to force forfeiture over parking conditions in the lease.

    What is the exact wording of the covenants in question and what are the offences commited by the tenants of the leaseholders?
    • Beaker99
    • By Beaker99 12th Jul 18, 2:23 PM
    • 228 Posts
    • 120 Thanks
    Beaker99
    • #4
    • 12th Jul 18, 2:23 PM
    • #4
    • 12th Jul 18, 2:23 PM
    I highly doubt the freeholder will be able to force forfeiture over parking conditions in the lease.

    What is the exact wording of the covenants in question and what are the offences commited by the tenants of the leaseholders?
    Originally posted by sal_III
    The covenant is over the parking of commercial vehicles ( in this case the tenants work van).

    The management company says all sales (whether freeholds or lease) ask if any forfeiture have commenced in the entire development during the mortgage application.
    Last edited by Beaker99; 12-07-2018 at 2:26 PM.
    • NeilCr
    • By NeilCr 12th Jul 18, 2:47 PM
    • 2,269 Posts
    • 3,060 Thanks
    NeilCr
    • #5
    • 12th Jul 18, 2:47 PM
    • #5
    • 12th Jul 18, 2:47 PM
    Worth a read. Section 11

    https://www.lease-advice.org/advice-guide/service-charges-other-issues/#32

    Sounds to me that the chairman is flexing his muscles. I have to say, as a director of a management company, I have some sympathy. Enforcing covenants is very difficult and you are often caught between two sides. One group complaining about the breaking of the covenants - the other side not complying

    I've been a director, one way or another, for 15 years or so. In that time we have only had to go to court once and that was for wilful non payment of service charges. That didn't result in forfeiture - we got a charge on the house. Personally, I'd find it extremely hard (probably impossible) to force forfeiture.

    When we were going through the process - neither the MA or the solicitor mentioned anything about the effect on other properties
    Last edited by NeilCr; 12-07-2018 at 3:39 PM.
    • davidmcn
    • By davidmcn 12th Jul 18, 2:53 PM
    • 8,535 Posts
    • 8,995 Thanks
    davidmcn
    • #6
    • 12th Jul 18, 2:53 PM
    • #6
    • 12th Jul 18, 2:53 PM
    The management company says all sales (whether freeholds or lease) ask if any forfeiture have commenced in the entire development during the mortgage application.
    Originally posted by Beaker99
    I'm not sure that they do, or even that they have a policy of how to respond if the answer is yes. Not sure why they'd care - the reason for the forfeiture may be of interest if e.g. not enough people are contributing to the service charge or the breaches otherwise affect the value of the property in question.
    • sal_III
    • By sal_III 12th Jul 18, 6:12 PM
    • 644 Posts
    • 658 Thanks
    sal_III
    • #7
    • 12th Jul 18, 6:12 PM
    • #7
    • 12th Jul 18, 6:12 PM
    The covenant is over the parking of commercial vehicles ( in this case the tenants work van).

    The management company says all sales (whether freeholds or lease) ask if any forfeiture have commenced in the entire development during the mortgage application.
    Originally posted by Beaker99
    I have always "admired" these covenants. I understand where the freeholder is a 3rd party management company and they want to keep the "appeal" of the development clear of commercial vans. But when the freehold is owned by the leaseholders I fail to see the point in enforcing these. What is the big deal?

    Looks like the current management company director got a bit drunk on power and is "trowing the book" at others. Reign him in and make him understand that if such trivialities go to court everyone stand to lose.
    • NeilCr
    • By NeilCr 12th Jul 18, 6:27 PM
    • 2,269 Posts
    • 3,060 Thanks
    NeilCr
    • #8
    • 12th Jul 18, 6:27 PM
    • #8
    • 12th Jul 18, 6:27 PM
    I have always "admired" these covenants. I understand where the freeholder is a 3rd party management company and they want to keep the "appeal" of the development clear of commercial vans. But when the freehold is owned by the leaseholders I fail to see the point in enforcing these. What is the big deal?

    Looks like the current management company director got a bit drunk on power and is "trowing the book" at others. Reign him in and make him understand that if such trivialities go to court everyone stand to lose.
    Originally posted by sal_III
    We have just had our AGM and a number of residents were complaining about the surfeit of commercial vehicles on the estate. Some have them parked directly in front of their windows - it's the way our car parking is configured and I can see that I wouldn't want a great big van (and one or two of them are BIG) blocking out my light.

    On the other side of the coin residents, when they purchase a property, sign papers which spell out covenants and accept they have to abide by them. It's not very nice then breaking your word is it?

    Covenants are funny old things - what most people accept are okay trigger off strong reactions in others. I had a problem with the ivy on the side of my house. My neighbour whose front room faced it hated it and complained. Not a covenant but an example of what can set people off.

    As I say, as a director, you do get caught between the two sides. Short of threatening court you have very little ammunition against someone who, wilfully, ignores a covenant. I think this guy is "waving the big stick" and may have other residents in his ear
Welcome to our new Forum!

Our aim is to save you money quickly and easily. We hope you like it!

Forum Team Contact us

Live Stats

1,835Posts Today

7,085Users online

Martin's Twitter