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    • CitizenSteve
    • By CitizenSteve 11th Jul 18, 2:31 PM
    • 1Posts
    • 0Thanks
    CitizenSteve
    Civil Enforcement Ltd - Number Plate Registration System, not used
    • #1
    • 11th Jul 18, 2:31 PM
    Civil Enforcement Ltd - Number Plate Registration System, not used 11th Jul 18 at 2:31 PM
    Hi all

    A mate of mine has a Civil Enforcement Ltd fine because I parked at a pub who have a contract with Civil Enforcement Ltd. Customers are supposed to enter their registration plates into an electronic system which then prevents the fine. He didn't do this but have emailed Civil Enforcement Ltd with proof of his custom (bank statement with pub and date clearly displayed), Civil Enforcement Ltd have written to him to tell him that his appeal was rejected.

    So my questions...
    1) Why is proof of is spending money in the establishment not proof? I was neglectful not to enter my number plate onto electronic system (apparently there are clear signs about this on the doors) but the whole system was implemented to prevent non customers exploiting the pub car park. They say that in not typing my details in, his vehicle was not authorised and that being a paying customer is not the issue. This reeks of predatory capitalism because the reason the landlord signed a contract with Civil Enforcement Ltd was because non customers were exploiting his car park !!!8211; I evidently don!!!8217;t fall into that category.
    I guess what this boils down to is, is it right to fine people for being stupid / ignorant? I!!!8217;m sure many have fallen into this trap because they have other distractions on their mind.


    2) I suspect that POPLA will reject his appeal so this will go to CCJ. I want to put his case to CCJ to appeal this but, as far as I know, it all happens in my absence and I don!!!8217;t get my say. IS this true?
    3) I!!!8217;ve not found a thread to a similar predicament but would appreciate a link to one if someone has one.
    All advice gratefully received.
    Last edited by CitizenSteve; 11-07-2018 at 3:44 PM.
Page 1
    • Quentin
    • By Quentin 11th Jul 18, 2:48 PM
    • 36,345 Posts
    • 20,591 Thanks
    Quentin
    • #2
    • 11th Jul 18, 2:48 PM
    • #2
    • 11th Jul 18, 2:48 PM
    Everyone is politely asked to read up on this in the Newbies FAQ thread near the top of the forum before starting a new thread

    Go there now to learn about the game you are now caught up in and how to deal with this

    All your questions and misunderstanding will be cleared up by spending time studying the FAQ

    Throughout here you are advised never to reveal who was driving

    You need to edit your post to remove details of who was driving

    The ppcs monitor this forum and can use posts in your thread against you
    • Loadsofchildren123
    • By Loadsofchildren123 11th Jul 18, 3:04 PM
    • 2,224 Posts
    • 3,727 Thanks
    Loadsofchildren123
    • #3
    • 11th Jul 18, 3:04 PM
    • #3
    • 11th Jul 18, 3:04 PM
    So my questions...
    1) Why is proof of spending money in the establishment not proof....neglectful not to enter the number plate onto electronic system (apparently there are clear signs about this on the doors - According to who? Go back and look at them. What do they say? How clear are they? Are they obvious? Are there other signs on the doors as well, which make it easy to miss these ones? Was there a sign IN the carpark? Was there a sign at the entrance to the car park? What did they say? ) but the whole system was implemented to prevent non customers exploiting the pub car park. They say that in not typing the details in, the vehicle was not authorised and that being a paying customer is not the issue. This reeks of predatory capitalism because the reason the landlord signed a contract with Civil Enforcement Ltd was because non customers were exploiting his car park !!!8211; the driver evidently doesn!!!8217;t fall into that category. Complain to the landlord, landlords can often get these things cancelled. But don't be a wallflower about it, push the point forcefully, let him know that if it isn't cancelled you and others like you will never go there again. Look at his tripadvisor reviews, if any, are there others on there complaining about being done like you have? Point this out to him.
    I guess what this boils down to is, is it right to fine people for being stupid / ignorant? I!!!8217;m sure many have fallen into this trap because they have other distractions on their mind. Private parking companies are not reasonable, normal people. They target people like you. They do not listen to reasonable explanations or excuses, they don't care you were a pub patron. They just want your money.


    2) I suspect that POPLA will reject the appeal so this will go to CCJ. no it won't. A CCJ is a county court judgment. Before you get that far, there will be a claim which you will defend. Please read up other CEL threads on here, CEL ALWAYS back out of well defended claims, but they don't do so until the very end, so you have to educate yourself, wise up and get ready. ......as far as I know, it all happens in my absence and I don!!!8217;t get my say. IS this true? What idiot told you that? You think a company can go and get a judgment against you and you aren't allowed to defend?????
    3) I!!!8217;ve not found a thread to a similar predicament but would appreciate a link to one if someone has one. There are hundreds on here about CEL and lots of ones about pub car parks and lots about systems where patrons are allowed to sign into a tablet in the shop/bar/gym or wherever, but didn't realise because the SIGNS didn't make this CLEAR. Which I imagine is what happened in your case.
    All advice gratefully received.
    Originally posted by CitizenSteve

    Comments above.
    Look, you won't be spoon fed on here, if that's what you're hoping for. It's utter rubbish that there are no similar predicaments to yours on here. There are loads. Choose some CEL threads to read, and do an advanced search for ones about pub car parks as well, and tablets (to sign in on). You will find many. Read them and the Newbies thread to educate yourself. Then come back for help.




    There are precedents for POPLA appeals. You really need to go back to the pub and look at the signs, as per my comments above, and also try to get the landlord to get it cancelled.
    Make sure you keep your receipts.




    Do not identify who the driver is. Refer to the driver in the third person. Eg don't say 2"/my brother parked in a pub car park and went in and used the pub", say "the driver parked...."
    Last edited by Loadsofchildren123; 12-07-2018 at 11:29 AM.
    Although a practising Solicitor, my posts here are NOT legal advice, but are personal opinion based on limited facts provided anonymously by forum users. I accept no liability for the accuracy of any such posts and users are advised that, if they wish to obtain formal legal advice specific to their case, they must seek instruct and pay a solicitor.
    • Umkomaas
    • By Umkomaas 11th Jul 18, 3:15 PM
    • 18,385 Posts
    • 29,106 Thanks
    Umkomaas
    • #4
    • 11th Jul 18, 3:15 PM
    • #4
    • 11th Jul 18, 3:15 PM
    Send in the (unaltered) template initial appeal from the NEWBIES FAQ sticky, post #1, and on many occasions CEL fold at that stage. Try it and see, the worst you'll get is a POPLA Code that you can use to kill this.
    We cannot provide you with a silver bullet to get you out of this. You have to be in for the long run, and need to involve yourself in research and work for you to get rid of this. It is not simple. We will help, but can't do it for you.

    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.
    • beamerguy
    • By beamerguy 11th Jul 18, 3:17 PM
    • 7,802 Posts
    • 10,378 Thanks
    beamerguy
    • #5
    • 11th Jul 18, 3:17 PM
    • #5
    • 11th Jul 18, 3:17 PM
    CitizenSteve

    CEL will reject anything that walks and talks as they
    are simply scammers.

    The landlord is your point of call .... why did his staff
    not tell you about this .... get it cancelled or he will join
    you in court.

    The landlord did not do his homework first before
    he took on CEL
    Let him read this ...

    https://parking-prankster.blogspot.com/search?q=CEL

    If he let's the CEL rubbish to continue, he won't have
    a pub in future
    RBS - MNBA - CAPITAL ONE - LLOYDS

    DISGUSTING BEHAVIOUR
    • Loadsofchildren123
    • By Loadsofchildren123 11th Jul 18, 3:20 PM
    • 2,224 Posts
    • 3,727 Thanks
    Loadsofchildren123
    • #6
    • 11th Jul 18, 3:20 PM
    • #6
    • 11th Jul 18, 3:20 PM
    PS Power to the People
    Although a practising Solicitor, my posts here are NOT legal advice, but are personal opinion based on limited facts provided anonymously by forum users. I accept no liability for the accuracy of any such posts and users are advised that, if they wish to obtain formal legal advice specific to their case, they must seek instruct and pay a solicitor.
    • Umkomaas
    • By Umkomaas 11th Jul 18, 3:21 PM
    • 18,385 Posts
    • 29,106 Thanks
    Umkomaas
    • #7
    • 11th Jul 18, 3:21 PM
    • #7
    • 11th Jul 18, 3:21 PM
    PS Power to the People
    Originally posted by Loadsofchildren123
    You're starting to give clues about your age!
    We cannot provide you with a silver bullet to get you out of this. You have to be in for the long run, and need to involve yourself in research and work for you to get rid of this. It is not simple. We will help, but can't do it for you.

    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 12th Jul 18, 12:58 AM
    • 59,521 Posts
    • 72,694 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    • #8
    • 12th Jul 18, 12:58 AM
    • #8
    • 12th Jul 18, 12:58 AM
    He didn't do this but have emailed Civil Enforcement Ltd with proof of his custom (bank statement with pub and date clearly displayed), Civil Enforcement Ltd have written to him to tell him that his appeal was rejected.
    And in doing so he's blabbed about who was driving.

    I wish people would research how to win an appeal, before they appeal.

    If he had used the template in the NEWBIES thread he wouldn't even need POPLA. Now he is playing catch up, having thrown the 100% slam-dunk winning appeal point in the bin.
    PRIVATE PCN? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT TWO Clicks needed for advice:
    Top of the page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    Advice to ignore is WRONG, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • Loadsofchildren123
    • By Loadsofchildren123 12th Jul 18, 11:26 AM
    • 2,224 Posts
    • 3,727 Thanks
    Loadsofchildren123
    • #9
    • 12th Jul 18, 11:26 AM
    • #9
    • 12th Jul 18, 11:26 AM
    Citizen (as I mentally punch the air and shout out "Power to the People"), don't be disheartened if C-M is right, CEL do eventually go away (unlike other PPCs), it's just that you have to fight them all the way to achieve that, which is a PIA. So the silver lining is that it's CEL and not one of the others and you will get there in the end.


    The shortcut to all of this is a visit to the landlord.
    Although a practising Solicitor, my posts here are NOT legal advice, but are personal opinion based on limited facts provided anonymously by forum users. I accept no liability for the accuracy of any such posts and users are advised that, if they wish to obtain formal legal advice specific to their case, they must seek instruct and pay a solicitor.
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